From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 2 13:38:36 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B0A542B1F for ; Wed, 2 Jan 2013 13:38:36 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from pacmmta51.windstream.net (pacmmta51.windstream.net [162.39.147.110]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DEC742544 for ; Wed, 2 Jan 2013 13:38:23 -0700 (MST) cv=lfjML3bQkTsh5H+cJ65BAulV5zVM2pgB13D795OEGio= c=1 sm=0 a=OvIMvpSEN2sA:10 a=We2GSUcPNccA:10 a=fOpwdquTRaQA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=OyXh2kECOsAFRqj-jmQA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=b/4jGi4qkAqCQGxL+EAqLQ==:117 Authentication-Results: pacmmta51 smtp.user=ccrobins@ktc.com; auth=pass (PLAIN) Received: from [72.172.30.197] ([72.172.30.197:59359] helo=[127.0.0.1]) by pacmmta51 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39824M)) with ESMTPA id 13/3A-24841-42A94E05; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 15:35:48 -0500 Date: Wed, 02 Jan 2013 14:35:41 -0600 From: Charley & Peggy Robinson Organization: Computer Helpers User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/17.0 Thunderbird/17.0 To: "mgs@Autox.Team.Net" Subject: [Mgs] Wassup? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Something wrong with the list or is there no traffic? CR _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 2 15:13:58 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1012E42544 for ; Wed, 2 Jan 2013 15:13:58 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm38-vm6.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com (nm38-vm6.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com [72.30.239.22]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE3CD42534 for ; Wed, 2 Jan 2013 15:13:32 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.139.212.149] by nm38.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Jan 2013 22:10:57 -0000 Received: from [98.139.215.228] by tm6.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Jan 2013 22:10:54 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1068.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Jan 2013 22:10:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 53255 invoked by uid 60001); 2 Jan 2013 22:10:54 -0000 s=s1024; t=1357164654; bh=2KbUH0OENmcmnxuZU9M9sZ7BUMeOcNad00KYPn2FjO8=; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=oJkDfq2oRQv0iB1enFvyCiVAQbIifVGbhdxJ+lVtQcd3EaP7d/HOG24CbUnrKOzO2wdxqrdlkaQ2rlR0px0mLsJAylnHqMJLDmoIa/98HGIsuifVp+VFxt+vbiVQYQgqK3gEVhPrh+mI8Ee4bVBngciBjrxws/LLFCrBTGifIp4= s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=ppE/FgjfQYtlmrizFYK9JfCI+4MpQqTBsiefyvZXC8iTW07uQql4erV5ADAlMD9P+cn5QqsTGNnIEWE8tKcdsCoQxgIfCO+aJLkhHAKBAQ2dzYyDwgNj9DJsRs8gqdF4mPDZtL40Qtz0VHVSzvUW++YIaxJDtQU4h2YRhn9ffIM=; VlbvBGjG0wei8rXQTbdTlVzFul1bQmxJHmNPPtRee2UOC5sppUzc8ws6yD8U bQnZg9tw6sYSPwpff3kqv0dg9Dx6qUrpkLs_h5H6q92gBXYCMSHq6lnU80k3 tb9DQe119eDrsftSXboB0TcPjxTFI.uetB19n7YRfWfnqfa.okwJWv3jqLfK 36HLQbUiHw0S0XynvTwV6AALcBLCMLN9.yuk1xGUq61kJW96yCPfttb3Rvw_ 94pqKVpF.Q9NE57jzJyFl74jqpobobJq2SXjrxrHSIWMTaEL_BZWUvwVXnw. p11hpbQHd_dr65zoyKNhZxYd9248eO3d4M7NuvT.0.vUwoKKzPCe6rtp3N7R 7HMj_cXWmR1b6v_Reo0nvVX_zidSfaEhfq64ZekD0ul1RTTurHnj5Jb1tyvs juwyewMzupb2UiiMu0A0UbsmiBzP3YlE4cNuoo1GHjeW4Y.ED2lHaX3r_Okx 6oMiAqqy35lVR1Q-- Received: from [68.44.138.78] by web164902.mail.bf1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 14:10:54 PST TGFjayBvZiB0cmFmZmljLCBJIGd1ZXNzLiBQbGVudHkgb24gdGhlIFlhaG9vIGdyb3VwLCB0aG91Z2guCgpEYW4gRAonNzYgQgonNjUgQgpDZW50cmFsIE5KIFVTQQoKCgoKX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX18KIEZyb206IENoYXJsZXkgJiBQZWdneSBSb2JpbnNvbiA8Y2Nyb2JpbnNAa3RjLmNvbT4KVG86ICJtZ3NAQXV0b3guVGVhbS5OZXQiIDxtZ3NAQXV0b3guVGVhbS5OZXQ.IApTZW50OiBXZWRuZXNkYXksIEphbnVhcnkgMiwgMjAxMyAzOjM1IFBNClN1YmplY3Q6IFtNZ3NdIFdhc3MBMAEBAQE- References: <50E49A1D.9070903@ktc.com> Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2013 14:10:54 -0800 (PST) From: Dan DiBiase To: "ccrobins@ktc.com" , "mgs@Autox.Team.Net" Subject: Re: [Mgs] Wassup? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Lack of traffic, I guess. Plenty on the Yahoo group, though. Dan D '76 B '65 B Central NJ USA ________________________________ From: Charley & Peggy Robinson To: "mgs@Autox.Team.Net" Sent: Wednesday, January 2, 2013 3:35 PM Subject: [Mgs] Wassup? Something wrong with the list or is there no traffic? CR _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Donate: Archive: Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/d_dibiase@yahoo.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 2 17:43:21 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D595A42D67 for ; Wed, 2 Jan 2013 17:43:21 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from bay0-omc3-s20.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc3-s20.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.190.158]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B5CB42D51 for ; Wed, 2 Jan 2013 17:41:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from BAY157-W31 ([65.54.190.189]) by bay0-omc3-s20.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Wed, 2 Jan 2013 16:38:29 -0800 From: James Schulte To: , "Mgs@autox.team.net" Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2013 19:38:28 -0500 References: <50E49A1D.9070903@ktc.com>, <1357164654.16815.YahooMailNeo@web164902.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> FILETIME=[A69E8230:01CDE94A] Subject: Re: [Mgs] Wassup? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Dan,Just received my big parts order from LBC for my new acquisition a 1974.5 MGBGT. I now have all the foam needed to finish the seats. I also received the backorder from Moss to cover the back seat with Autumn Leaf like the front that came 3 weeks ago. The car is at Rakafish LLC getting body work done. I hope to have "Skinner" back by late February or early March to finish the interior and start my other plans for it. They include lowering it 1" front and back. Replacing the Webber carb with SU's as original, and an overdrive. We'll see how the money holds out as the body and metal is estimated to be $4000.00. Not sure about the paint yet. But, I am hoping to paint it Teal Blue. That will be decided when the Heritage Certificate shows up.JimHarleysville, PA1970 MGB running1958 Magnette ZB running1974.5 MGBGT under restoration > Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2013 14:10:54 -0800 > From: d_dibiase@yahoo.com > To: ccrobins@ktc.com; mgs@Autox.Team.Net > Subject: Re: [Mgs] Wassup? > > Lack of traffic, I guess. Plenty on the Yahoo group, though. > > Dan D > '76 B > '65 > B > Central NJ USA > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Charley & Peggy > Robinson > To: "mgs@Autox.Team.Net" > Sent: Wednesday, January 2, 2013 3:35 PM > Subject: [Mgs] Wassup? > > Something > wrong with the list or is there no traffic? > > CR > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: > http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: > http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/d_dibiase@yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/schultejim@msn.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 2 20:22:07 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DB0342E25 for ; Wed, 2 Jan 2013 20:22:07 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from pacmmta53.windstream.net (pacmmta53.windstream.net [162.39.147.112]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D942A42E25 for ; Wed, 2 Jan 2013 20:22:02 -0700 (MST) cv=Q144tqixSR1YYiEEgqcDGpPuwwbWKU3BiBZsaiVVqQQ= c=1 sm=0 a=OvIMvpSEN2sA:10 a=We2GSUcPNccA:10 a=fOpwdquTRaQA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=OyXh2kECOsAFRqj-jmQA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=b/4jGi4qkAqCQGxL+EAqLQ==:117 Authentication-Results: pacmmta53 smtp.user=ccrobins@ktc.com; auth=pass (PLAIN) Received: from [72.172.30.197] ([72.172.30.197:62628] helo=[127.0.0.1]) by pacmmta53 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39824M)) with ESMTPA id F3/A5-16037-FB8F4E05; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 22:19:27 -0500 Date: Wed, 02 Jan 2013 14:34:09 -0600 From: Charley & Peggy Robinson Organization: Computer Helpers User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/17.0 Thunderbird/17.0 To: "mgs@Autox.Team.Net" Subject: [Mgs] Wassup? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Something wrong with the list or is there no traffic? CR _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 2 21:22:42 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2881542E89 for ; Wed, 2 Jan 2013 21:22:42 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm29-vm4.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (nm29-vm4.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com [98.136.216.179]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8ACF442E79 for ; Wed, 2 Jan 2013 21:22:34 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.137.12.58] by nm29.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Jan 2013 04:20:00 -0000 Received: from [98.137.12.193] by tm3.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Jan 2013 04:20:00 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1001.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Jan 2013 04:20:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 82526 invoked by uid 60001); 3 Jan 2013 04:20:00 -0000 s=s1024; t=1357186799; bh=g1lDO09zwG5sbwq86/TSEcIoC+nAneF/0AuaSqBqpM8=; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:Message-ID:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=XJrFDT2YLcvTvS3upblCAomsQo63v9abomseNRj/9BxF/tQte007wlPGTPJ5iE9joWB4r0GbBgmxW55Mc5k1Picw9MtLazxCvJ+9NJZD22O7cyNGfIeLh5NOFhKgkUswKJSWSNCZeTYbD8COsXddxXTbSlz810ySP16WaxkW5cg= s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:Message-ID:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=UM3hKHmmli6qwJZEJNnHjszv28FJxJ2R/RkxQIQmcLvOjep/oY6R/h7bNlBfv9ihTiVf62EKXsaey6jQmX+PWdReVhv4tSchSJNxO0bViGgDCfjO9yTfS9BTwvkuYvRtuFgaeovS5czXH93xE5vvfWPaD2VQKwya3YdOcV2XqAo=; FpHQzVpczXyFo9D3dqQTBoJiHR5Y6fnEjjeBg5fNWQ9.Y6Ht_iErvRzoK2Gw M2ihhdu8OzRXaKH85sESwJh18blTTpUVeWKuIdCW5VIcChkY9J84sripdQQG BaooMMq40TD.YfODHL7Xwc_qgoXe0myAh1U2v_x_lkIclhG6xForXzHLF4IR IFp4GUueZ7NrRQbL82vrAc5X_ChY5JyyEm3JUasv4tMcuKjBkFCaO7lvtH8Y p68qwFaoU3E.cZbPUXmi5oxnL2SO2gFFOqlyeclBs8PHshpxM9oO1aAGyKtG LOM13Aw1kch_8eo56_z83uSjMT1_n5q4Z1Z0rYg3PeuXUbGeYa20i_tpuH_G OX4y5JaAcIxEi.bZTDVsc1lqpzWb.sZ0cTfIx9bbb0vyOUTnnj72iS29wibt KMZ_7XqO3aYM8Is4ZaYH9a61TsPbs.ZduBg3P8_bq8fCh0m1HcReS3K1Ukg- - Received: from [98.125.157.186] by web163901.mail.gq1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 20:19:59 PST Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2013 20:19:59 -0800 (PST) From: David Breneman To: "mgs@Autox.Team.Net" Subject: Re: [Mgs] Wassup? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Ketchup? _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 2 23:18:21 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10FDB42ECC for ; Wed, 2 Jan 2013 23:18:21 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from oproxy9.bluehost.com (oproxy9.bluehost.com [69.89.24.6]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id D2BAB42DE3 for ; Wed, 2 Jan 2013 23:18:07 -0700 (MST) Received: (qmail 21518 invoked by uid 0); 3 Jan 2013 06:15:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box609.bluehost.com) (70.40.220.109) by oproxy9.bluehost.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2013 06:15:31 -0000 d=justbrits.com; s=default; h=Content-Type:In-Reply-To:References:Subject:To:MIME-Version:From:Date:Message-ID; bh=SC3fED6j1qWMpAkzwkOHGSYAgO6PbUDmjZb98S1oM3g=; b=pY1aKv3sfoNriaJAilbz+yXNGIu+G94sSFF9rL9DvZGZpcM2VweWxdJCMFqLw6g5e9rm+o3nzaPn8e1YtdKCuMZtAuSaIgcrHzKJ44HFeJOQtjW9QLTaGCLZxEvoW7Uf; Received: from [24.15.13.164] (port=36848 helo=[192.168.0.106]) by box609.bluehost.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Tqe5T-0002fn-2A for mgs@Autox.Team.Net; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 23:15:31 -0700 Date: Thu, 03 Jan 2013 00:15:29 -0600 From: "\" Just Brits \" Shop" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 5.1; rv:17.0) Gecko/17.0 Thunderbird/17.0 To: "mgs@Autox.Team.Net" References: <1357186799.80791.YahooMailClassic@web163901.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> {sentby:smtp auth 24.15.13.164 authed with sales@justbrits.com} Subject: Re: [Mgs] Wassup? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net << On 1/2/2013 10:19 PM, David Breneman wrote: Ketchup? >> No Dan, musta ............... Oh wait, different List ! ! ! Sorry. Anon _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 3 02:16:37 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2644B42EF0 for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 02:16:37 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-wg0-f42.google.com (mail-wg0-f42.google.com [74.125.82.42]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7CA9F42DDD for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 02:13:16 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-wg0-f42.google.com with SMTP id dr1so6355493wgb.3 for ; Thu, 03 Jan 2013 01:10:40 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:to:references:subject:date:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority :x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=LB2bBAwK8rnZtFWVm20t/bIeablkCymeM60g29B6yUg=; b=Ps+HOivN4Q6peCHQTt0BetqAHKOKm03fMm+Dkq3hwiLanWhdoK2EZxnoL1V86kfHKI IxU8Ll9hW90TaTmo/9WR8XEUadl3T25Zq41u272s8MqXn5vgghezd9j7Jb22MC636on6 RfpJgn0PLyooeOpM8efAXTNdgcWScrJ25ZIQK3+c64bC8fsTgGJXl+Up5IYMGsnWX2D2 IhkNeLs1IHirMnnofRJaGkQQChg60tcu036dEqf6ZhmM+ApHrS+eajvQ7W5/fTVrsz1H ZxFP851nAx3hRWtf5q7jMEPeF0SliccirYvNJui099jD9d2dEUDeVLTS3UsuGIGPkd3f 2VNA== n10mr75133086wiv.17.1357204240812; Thu, 03 Jan 2013 01:10:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-1.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.97]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id hg17sm88599438wib.1.2013.01.03.01.10.39 (version=SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Thu, 03 Jan 2013 01:10:39 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" To: "James Schulte" , , "Mgs@autox.team.net" References: <50E49A1D.9070903@ktc.com>, <1357164654.16815.YahooMailNeo@web164902.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2013 08:52:35 -0000 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Wassup? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Good luck with the foams. I've been in a GT with new foams and my head was brushing the roof, I've heard of other people not being able to get their legs under the steering wheel, the only solution seems to be to cut about an inch off the bottom. I've just had a copy of Don Hayter's 'The MGB Story' which makes interesting reading coming as it does from someone who was there from before the MGB to the close down. He says they spent a very long time experimenting with the foam manufacturer with various densities and thicknesses before they came up with the right formula. If the foams we get nowadays are from a different source, as I suspect, I very much doubt they took as much trouble. I say interesting, and also amusing. Don relates how the MGB was the first body they dip-primed, and he spent some time designing in the holes to let the air out at the top and the paint out at the bottom (those peculiar holes in the floor pan for one). However they only dipped up to the level of the shelf in the engine bay, which meant hand-feathering in the edge before hand-spraying the top part. So ICI suggested dipping it completely (I can't imagine why they didn't do that in the first place), and they all stood round while the first shell went in. Unfortunately enough air got trapped to lift the body off the hooks, and it gracefully floated off down the tank and sunk. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- > ... I now have all the foam needed to finish the seats. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 3 05:41:25 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2714042EF9 for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 05:41:25 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com (outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com [64.136.55.36]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id DDA8F42EDF for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 05:40:59 -0700 (MST) s=alpha; t=1357216701; bh=47DEQpj8HBSa+/TImW+5JCeuQeRkm5NMpJWZG3hSuFU=; l=0; h=From:Date:To:Cc:Subject:Message-Id:Content-Type; b=WZ+KWwBgUtDqOy4FOSvWlGC9r6PuuLSbqICyNtqkg5KkL13H9rdfrMVaR3gRL/UJC 8T9mx/DHJFPj6Z/wkXn3+qMcwa4MtEARWsrMYinXslBN4mVSJHgLHVbgU6l6a7zyCu bIKUZevzmjb/lEafT3legNX9n++kOrauAgqYnk9w= Received: from outbound-bu1.vgs.untd.com (webmail-beta01.vgs.untd.com [10.181.12.101]) by smtpout03.vgs.untd.com with SMTP id AABJQL87YALXTPG2 for (sender ); Thu, 3 Jan 2013 04:38:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from [108.88.216.197] by webmail-beta01.vgs.untd.com with HTTP: Thu, 3 Jan 2013 12:37:47 GMT From: "mgbob@juno.com" Full-Name: "mgbob@juno.com" Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2013 12:37:47 GMT To: paulhunt73@virginmedia.com Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] Wassup? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net The sagging old foams in my '72 GT needed replacement. Spring, 2012, I installed Moss foams. Instruction I read somewhere suggested trimming one inch from seat foam, if needed, though not how to determine "if needed". Moss may buy from different suppliers, as our club members have had different experiences. Seat bottoms are higher than before, perhaps 1/2 inch, which is fine for me (5'11", 150 lbs), but a taller or lighter driver would want to cut them down a bit. The great improvement is that the seats are now firm. The old rubber had the support of bread dough, and one did not feel connected to the seat regardless of seat belt tension. Seat bottom foams are easy to replace. Bob ---------- Original Message ---------- From: "PaulHunt73" To: "James Schulte" , , "Mgs@autox.team.net" Subject: Re: [Mgs] Wassup? Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2013 08:52:35 -0000 Good luck with the foams. I've been in a GT with new foams and my head was brushing the roof, I've heard of other people not being able to get their legs under the steering wheel, the only solution seems to be to cut about an inch off the bottom. I've just had a copy of Don Hayter's 'The MGB Story' which makes interesting reading coming as it does from someone who was there from before the MGB to the close down. He says they spent a very long time experimenting with the foam manufacturer with various densities and thicknesses before they came up with the right formula. If the foams we get nowadays are from a different source, as I suspect, I very much doubt they took as much trouble. I say interesting, and also amusing. Don relates how the MGB was the first body they dip-primed, and he spent some time designing in the holes to let the air out at the top and the paint out at the bottom (those peculiar holes in the floor pan for one). However they only dipped up to the level of the shelf in the engine bay, which meant hand-feathering in the edge before hand-spraying the top part. So ICI suggested dipping it completely (I can't imagine why they didn't do that in the first place), and they all stood round while the first shell went in. Unfortunately enough air got trapped to lift the body off the hooks, and it gracefully floated off down the tank and sunk. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- > ... I now have all the foam needed to finish the seats. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mgbob@juno.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 3 05:54:25 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9103542F0E for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 05:54:25 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from imr-ma05.mx.aol.com (imr-ma05.mx.aol.com [64.12.100.31]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 021BF42EDF for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 05:49:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from mtaomg-da06.r1000.mx.aol.com (mtaomg-da06.r1000.mx.aol.com [172.29.51.142]) by imr-ma05.mx.aol.com (Outbound Mail Relay) with ESMTP id 23F231C0000D6; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 07:47:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from core-djd002b.r1000.mail.aol.com (core-djd002.r1000.mail.aol.com [172.29.69.197]) by mtaomg-da06.r1000.mx.aol.com (OMAG/Core Interface) with ESMTP id EE51EE000081; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 07:47:15 -0500 (EST) References: <50E49A1D.9070903@ktc.com>, <1357164654.16815.YahooMailNeo@web164902.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> <6293A2101A544800AABA1E4CFFB7A5DE@paul> To: paulhunt73@virginmedia.com, mgs@autox.team.net From: Alan Kellogg Received: from 74.69.186.96 by webmail-d051.sysops.aol.com (205.188.168.24) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Thu, 03 Jan 2013 07:47:15 -0500 Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2013 07:47:15 -0500 (EST) x-aol-global-disposition: G s=20121107; t=1357217236; bh=WpeFZSnSrwceXeG6mueobyT9PdAwoQP6jrIhXEuHRaM=; h=From:To:Subject:Message-Id:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=HpwgJrwrd/Cf/RW3U2B2I8zSX0SQpYczxM5q+wkfPd0/fwFl7nz2mQVd8H3YYj9Wx LnMjZxCy724nAHE3OiDCftswclSEBYiGvXRhYhL9JCTu3uEvxducqn1XVY9iZcRMMU yV5N1qrxGfGpuyubj67h4YaI8tJUhEGCyld7lXxk= x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d338e50e57dd331f7 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Foam: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Yeah but if you remove an inch the foam won't fill the cover completely. For my MGA, the existing, may or may not have been originalseat cushion, had some approx 2 inch holes cut through. I repeated the pattern in the replacement which lowered the loaded cushion nicely. Alan -----Original Message----- From: PaulHunt73 To: James Schulte ; d_dibiase ; Mgs@autox.team.net Sent: Thu, Jan 3, 2013 4:14 am Subject: Re: [Mgs] Wassup? Good luck with the foams. I've been in a GT with new foams and my head was brushing the roof, I've heard of other people not being able to get their legs under the steering wheel, the only solution seems to be to cut about an inch off the bottom. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 3 06:56:52 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9830142EFB for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 06:56:52 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from snt0-omc1-s51.snt0.hotmail.com (snt0-omc1-s51.snt0.hotmail.com [65.54.61.88]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE28542EF9 for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 06:51:48 -0700 (MST) Received: from SNT124-W61 ([65.55.90.7]) by snt0-omc1-s51.snt0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Thu, 3 Jan 2013 05:49:11 -0800 From: Mike E To: , , Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2013 08:49:11 -0500 References: <50E49A1D.9070903@ktc.com>, , <1357164654.16815.YahooMailNeo@web164902.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>, FILETIME=[1C21A140:01CDE9B9] Subject: Re: [Mgs] Wassup? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net "Replacing the Webber carb with SU's as original,"Yay! I'll never understand the desire to tear off a set of SUs and replace them with a Weber. As a stop-gap while your SUs are being rebuilt, sure. I have two that came with Weber's, and I'll be doing the same as you. > From: schultejim@msn.com > To: d_dibiase@yahoo.com; mgs@autox.team.net > Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2013 19:38:28 -0500 > Subject: Re: [Mgs] Wassup? > > Dan,Just received my big parts order from LBC for my new acquisition a 1974.5 > MGBGT. I now have all the foam needed to finish the seats. I also received the > backorder from Moss to cover the back seat with Autumn Leaf like the front > that came 3 weeks ago. The car is at Rakafish LLC getting body work done. I > hope to have "Skinner" back by late February or early March to finish the > interior and start my other plans for it. They include lowering it 1" front > and back. Replacing the Webber carb with SU's as original, and an overdrive. > We'll see how the money holds out as the body and metal is estimated to be > $4000.00. Not sure about the paint yet. But, I am hoping to paint it Teal > Blue. That will be decided when the Heritage Certificate shows > up.JimHarleysville, PA1970 MGB running1958 Magnette ZB running1974.5 MGBGT > under restoration > > Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2013 14:10:54 -0800 > > From: d_dibiase@yahoo.com > > To: ccrobins@ktc.com; mgs@Autox.Team.Net > > Subject: Re: [Mgs] Wassup? > > > > Lack of traffic, I guess. Plenty on the Yahoo group, though. > > > > Dan D > > '76 B > > '65 > > B > > Central NJ USA > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > From: Charley & Peggy > > Robinson > > To: "mgs@Autox.Team.Net" > > Sent: Wednesday, January 2, 2013 3:35 PM > > Subject: [Mgs] Wassup? > > > > Something > > wrong with the list or is there no traffic? > > > > CR > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > > Donate: > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > > Archive: > > http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/d_dibiase@yahoo.com > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/schultejim@msn.com > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/redscirocco@hotmail.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 3 08:13:47 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 33B8D40552 for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 08:13:47 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from alpha.look.ca (alpha.look.ca [216.66.192.2]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 30B9A40439 for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 08:11:40 -0700 (MST) Received: from e120-pool-d89a5a09.brdbnd.telnetcommunications.com ([216.154.90.9] helo=Barrie-PC.look.ca) by alpha.look.ca with esmtpa (user vectis@look.ca)(Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1TqmPm-0007D7-QR; Thu, 03 Jan 2013 10:09:02 -0500 Date: Thu, 03 Jan 2013 10:09:01 -0500 To: James Schulte ,, "Mgs@autox.team.net" From: Barrie Robinson References: <50E49A1D.9070903@ktc.com> <1357164654.16815.YahooMailNeo@web164902.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [Mgs] Wassup? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Just thought I would add my experiences. I had my MGB GT seats done up by a local craftsman and he put in the memory foam I was given by a local mattress manufacturer - again locally. The result is fantastic and now I know why commercial airplane pilots seats are built that way !!!!! At 07:38 PM 02/01/2013 -0500, James Schulte wrote: >Dan,Just received my big parts order from LBC for my new acquisition a 1974.5 >MGBGT. I now have all the foam needed to finish the seats. I also received the >backorder from Moss to cover the back seat with Autumn Leaf like the front >that came 3 weeks ago. The car is at Rakafish LLC getting body work done. I >hope to have "Skinner" back by late February or early March to finish the >interior and start my other plans for it. They include lowering it 1" front >and back. Replacing the Webber carb with SU's as original, and an overdrive. >We'll see how the money holds out as the body and metal is estimated to be >$4000.00. Not sure about the paint yet. But, I am hoping to paint it Teal >Blue. That will be decided when the Heritage Certificate shows >up.JimHarleysville, PA1970 MGB running1958 Magnette ZB running1974.5 MGBGT >under restoration > > Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2013 14:10:54 -0800 > > From: d_dibiase@yahoo.com > > To: ccrobins@ktc.com; mgs@Autox.Team.Net > > Subject: Re: [Mgs] Wassup? > > > > Lack of traffic, I guess. Plenty on the Yahoo group, though. > > > > Dan D > > '76 B > > '65 > > B > > Central NJ USA > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > From: Charley & Peggy > > Robinson > > To: "mgs@Autox.Team.Net" > > Sent: Wednesday, January 2, 2013 3:35 PM > > Subject: [Mgs] Wassup? > > > > Something > > wrong with the list or is there no traffic? > > > > CR > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > > Donate: > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > > Archive: > > http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/d_dibiase@yahoo.com > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/schultejim@msn.com >_______________________________________________ > >Mgs@autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Suggested annual donation $12.75 >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/barrie@look.ca Regards Barrie barrie@look.ca 705-721-9060 _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 3 10:02:47 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B7064068E for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 10:02:47 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-wi0-f176.google.com (mail-wi0-f176.google.com [209.85.212.176]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B38B94051D for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 10:02:09 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-wi0-f176.google.com with SMTP id hm6so11048548wib.3 for ; Thu, 03 Jan 2013 08:59:31 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:to:references:subject:date:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority :x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=Y9X9bKUrKYyh5qWY/+lSqGNCoKJIXkizCrASkgYUDWg=; b=NVh1hdSy9waf1M2PyB9NpGqNHKW23ilF4X5OrncTqDFGM6B/Z9obrsRdlU1Vk/lRoV zG28DB0HE7+mOH1RA0pfB/vMOYdaZS+5Djw8t7FWmXTD6UU1HYsxt/oFCqGAjY5LU6Ee hfXGN7AvJUcx17XV6olMGJ6+zL6UOl2w75DbWwFmqYzd0CA7aLekzsggMMqJcv7DH59p hWicyrBSb8Z/WSBg75jwRaeKrS57z9MOavf7pmngbkixRmlGaYI7Dznr2fuIY0s8ycZq zlF9Fdb2COokdlvpM44+qI+KUSl4cTRcsBmE4DNJNE++O2//B83OCPROVZD3zR0odJMg f0qA== lr2mr79514413wjb.55.1357232371214; Thu, 03 Jan 2013 08:59:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-1.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.97]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id bd6sm59084839wib.10.2013.01.03.08.59.29 (version=SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Thu, 03 Jan 2013 08:59:30 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" To: "Mgs@autox.team.net" , "Barrie Robinson" References: <50E49A1D.9070903@ktc.com><1357164654.16815.YahooMailNeo@web164902.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2013 16:54:42 -0000 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Wassup? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Also explains why pilots sometimes fall asleep at the wheel ... ----- Original Message ----- > Just thought I would add my experiences. I had my MGB GT seats done > up by a local craftsman and he put in the memory foam I was given by > a local mattress manufacturer - again locally. The result is > fantastic and now I know why commercial airplane pilots seats are > built that way !!!!! _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 3 15:12:58 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 567E540356 for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 15:12:58 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F38D440439 for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 15:12:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-193.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.193]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r03MA0EA010017 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 14:10:02 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Thu, 03 Jan 2013 13:58:17 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] Gasket stuff Thread-Index: Ac3p/W973DmjcF4qKk6N152ivV/jHA== Subject: Re: [Mgs] Gasket stuff Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I am sure those are fine for some applications. But there are also thinner gaskets, for which various weights of gasket paper are available. -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 1/3/13 1:43 PM, Barrie Robinson at barrie@look.ca wrote: > I have to make all sorts of gaskets for my being-restored motor > car. What is the best stuff to use? Overkill is fine so I want the > very best. Canadian Tyre offers cork/rubber which looks > traditional, and composite stuff that looks like leather > > Regards, > > Barrie Robinson > barrie@look.ca > 705-721-9060 > MGB GT V8 in great nick > Aston Martin 1957 DB 2/4 MkII under restoration > www.britishv8.org/MG/BarrieRobinson.htm > www.britcot.com > www.AMFClub.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 3 15:44:59 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6406F40564 for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 15:44:59 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ie0-f173.google.com (mail-ie0-f173.google.com [209.85.223.173]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85ACA40440 for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 15:44:41 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-ie0-f173.google.com with SMTP id e13so19039224iej.32 for ; Thu, 03 Jan 2013 14:42:03 -0800 (PST) h=x-received:subject:mime-version:content-type:from:in-reply-to:date :cc:content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to:x-mailer; bh=7XPdjCpiQWORWjM21Ra1s5V7tca6KcjibNCc+ZO5QnU=; b=wiYbjv5KT/qHPkzSHXUBF/H2GyZwn0uoA5ts2h2pG0v0oS0kQ2sCt5J+RU4Cb7F+qu zxV/nQ+eNdQQLsNaBBnScttKkw6ryC9Lwv7dzhRpEaUzYFYo6FkuS70W/sG3zrmC7FCB WdTbZIfWGFi1sM9N412us5xj86w5bAQlqXG2f8EbcrQ8I4iHFHx+FKv9p6Qsu8Fqpp+2 pLf48ZjE851FOuPBMXatqNZA6EpQ9rlLiz9zRV6Hu+O5kGbneVvatxzrG5drW4Fvhdq4 CkJYOm9mtx0I56Nk+cuJAq6BqttucilojrrG3hlVg/Fykx0sOXDC4NgESl9CE9sB1vlj ZOUg== m3mr45033768igw.64.1357252922897; Thu, 03 Jan 2013 14:42:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.0.11] (65-128-180-163.mpls.qwest.net. [65.128.180.163]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id lu10sm35148185igc.15.2013.01.03.14.42.01 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Thu, 03 Jan 2013 14:42:02 -0800 (PST) From: Paul Root Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2013 16:42:00 -0600 References: To: Max Heim Cc: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] Gasket stuff Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I seem to remember John Twist (University Motors) making a gasket out of grocery bags. I don't think that qualifies as the best though. :-) I'm guessing this is for the DB 2/4? On Jan 3, 2013, at 3:58 PM, Max Heim wrote: > I am sure those are fine for some applications. But there are also thinner > gaskets, for which various weights of gasket paper are available. > > -- > > Max Heim > '66 MGB GHN3L76149 > If you're near Menlo Park, CA, > it's the primer red one with chrome wires > > > on 1/3/13 1:43 PM, Barrie Robinson at barrie@look.ca wrote: > >> I have to make all sorts of gaskets for my being-restored motor >> car. What is the best stuff to use? Overkill is fine so I want the >> very best. Canadian Tyre offers cork/rubber which looks >> traditional, and composite stuff that looks like leather >> >> Regards, >> >> Barrie Robinson >> barrie@look.ca >> 705-721-9060 >> MGB GT V8 in great nick >> Aston Martin 1957 DB 2/4 MkII under restoration >> www.britishv8.org/MG/BarrieRobinson.htm >> www.britcot.com >> www.AMFClub.com > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/ptrmgb@gmail.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 3 16:31:27 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A7CF40E33 for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 16:31:27 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from pacmmta53.windstream.net (pacmmta53.windstream.net [162.39.147.112]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4679D4043B for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 16:27:55 -0700 (MST) cv=Q144tqixSR1YYiEEgqcDGpPuwwbWKU3BiBZsaiVVqQQ= c=1 sm=0 a=OvIMvpSEN2sA:10 a=We2GSUcPNccA:10 a=fOpwdquTRaQA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=mfbrCa-fAAAA:8 a=22p6D_2QAAAA:8 a=a0vQxpsLAAAA:8 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=pGLkceISAAAA:8 a=Ov22w-J6AAAA:8 a=mgYLZg88BgvE0b4LS-oA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=J0aUVQLP0FIA:10 a=3tI3Ae-RVZAA:10 a=m3MdUl94G8cA:10 a=MSl-tDqOz04A:10 a=SdvNMj5PkgcA:10 a=Jl+/9GyIwpk1LVwaOiOdfA==:117 Authentication-Results: pacmmta53 smtp.user=ccrobins@ktc.com; auth=pass (PLAIN) Received: from [75.91.226.63] ([75.91.226.63:55288] helo=[127.0.0.1]) by pacmmta53 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39824M)) with ESMTPA id B5/A0-16037-C5316E05; Thu, 03 Jan 2013 18:25:16 -0500 Date: Thu, 03 Jan 2013 17:25:08 -0600 From: Charley & Peggy Robinson Organization: Computer Helpers User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/17.0 Thunderbird/17.0 To: "mgs@Autox.Team.Net" References: <3AC6F915-8CDA-4B42-AC77-CE8A7B722382@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Mgs] Gasket stuff Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I made one out of a cereal box for the accessory drive cover for a Corvair flat 6 in a pinch. I was out in the desert near the Four Corners when the old gasket blew out. There was oil all over the place! Er, except in the sump. :-) That was the only time I was gratified by the Corvair heater system design. I think Barry's best bet is to pay careful attention to what kind of gasket material used for each assembly whilst taking things apart. CR On 1/3/2013 4:42 PM, Paul Root wrote: > I seem to remember John Twist (University Motors) making a gasket out of > grocery bags. > > I don't think that qualifies as the best though. :-) > > I'm guessing this is for the DB 2/4? > > > > On Jan 3, 2013, at 3:58 PM, Max Heim wrote: > >> I am sure those are fine for some applications. But there are also thinner >> gaskets, for which various weights of gasket paper are available. >> >> -- >> >> Max Heim >> '66 MGB GHN3L76149 >> If you're near Menlo Park, CA, >> it's the primer red one with chrome wires >> >> >> on 1/3/13 1:43 PM, Barrie Robinson at barrie@look.ca wrote: >> >>> I have to make all sorts of gaskets for my being-restored motor >>> car. What is the best stuff to use? Overkill is fine so I want the >>> very best. Canadian Tyre offers cork/rubber which looks >>> traditional, and composite stuff that looks like leather >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Barrie Robinson >>> barrie@look.ca >>> 705-721-9060 >>> MGB GT V8 in great nick >>> Aston Martin 1957 DB 2/4 MkII under restoration >>> www.britishv8.org/MG/BarrieRobinson.htm >>> www.britcot.com >>> www.AMFClub.com >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Mgs@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.75 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/ptrmgb@gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/ccrobins@ktc.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 3 16:48:21 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81C7D40440 for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 16:48:21 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from bradakis.com (bradakis.com [166.70.156.35]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 483F34043B for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 16:48:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from mark.bradakis.com (bradakis.com [166.70.156.35]) by bradakis.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7BDDA136B for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2013 16:46:45 -0700 (MST) Date: Thu, 03 Jan 2013 16:46:45 -0700 From: Mark J Bradakis User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:11.0) Gecko/20120315 Firefox/11.0 SeaMonkey/2.8 To: mgs References: <3AC6F915-8CDA-4B42-AC77-CE8A7B722382@gmail.com> <50E61354.7040500@ktc.com> Subject: Re: [Mgs] Gasket stuff Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net The Right Stuff from Permatex - expensive but it works. mjb. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 4 03:24:13 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 59AA14069D for ; Fri, 4 Jan 2013 03:24:13 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-we0-f178.google.com (mail-we0-f178.google.com [74.125.82.178]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D44640563 for ; Fri, 4 Jan 2013 03:20:09 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-we0-f178.google.com with SMTP id x43so7609314wey.37 for ; Fri, 04 Jan 2013 02:17:28 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:to:references:subject:date:mime-version :content-type:x-priority:x-msmail-priority:x-mailer:x-mimeole :x-gm-message-state; bh=LDOaL/C4CmAZa9DmhBKHn3Nd6m9iJgsk4+8i+q0Gq9E=; b=Jn9SYkPhND7cnS4LjbMUAg5J0RtAAkElqHJHUMA01qwbm+cuqCUQDTBIAeeyOJyt41 09XxwpXtUXT2rwbhOJNCkTPQfwzvbhN+jQ/l1P5riyZ1HZhi7GWKDgzVa94bovYxzDWx AiBNk3V2mpxecWEdsYBQdX/PCeYAPJPzSPRTaic77RA/doJWQzSq06MM6PbXqhxJOMpL uciKjI0EmqIGmmRbpG0pv9chFgdN2PeonPf0ff7R7Ekz44KnKED5wi4hHao1m0fMm9an byppbNwGwuScwfOs8e0dPp8FKeSQ+WrfxfUC/lCKkLMuBij23dIEhfy79pI5OAhDWkUE 0Orw== bu4mr82531857wjc.35.1357294648051; Fri, 04 Jan 2013 02:17:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-1.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.97]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id w5sm93361631wif.11.2013.01.04.02.17.27 (version=SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Fri, 04 Jan 2013 02:17:27 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" To: References: <50E49A1D.9070903@ktc.com>, <1357164654.16815.YahooMailNeo@web164902.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> <6293A2101A544800AABA1E4CFFB7A5DE@paul> <8CFB7C797E19AF6-BA0-BBC@webmail-d051.sysops.aol.com> Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 10:08:19 -0000 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Foam: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Standard procedure is to pull the sides down to remove all the slack. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- Yeah but if you remove an inch the foam won't fill the cover completely. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 4 07:31:42 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 926FE40E4D for ; Fri, 4 Jan 2013 07:31:42 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com (outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com [64.136.55.36]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 297374064D for ; Fri, 4 Jan 2013 07:28:01 -0700 (MST) s=alpha; t=1357309518; bh=47DEQpj8HBSa+/TImW+5JCeuQeRkm5NMpJWZG3hSuFU=; l=0; h=From:Date:To:Cc:Subject:Message-Id:Content-Type; b=YxZmFxY9gwHCBBDzKlnabiZVk/yBOGLDmMExJZBC1vjPyUjq+tsiTVCLrsvCYyBqh CdxICXv7oeVypx20rupB7ooRo2Y6pKhP10KZIDkEC4KbZ/I1asvaYyVzlfyYsxkT0Y NhkHkkhnseaMU2FDlYr6bT4Y6W5IIvMvgKF+fe1U= Received: from outbound-bu1.vgs.untd.com (webmail-beta03.vgs.untd.com [10.181.12.103]) by smtpout01.vgs.untd.com with SMTP id AABJQP3SYAF7ZPFA for (sender ); Fri, 4 Jan 2013 06:24:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from [108.88.216.197] by webmail-beta03.vgs.untd.com with HTTP: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 14:23:13 GMT From: "mgbob@juno.com" Full-Name: "mgbob@juno.com" Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 14:23:13 GMT To: paulhunt73@virginmedia.com Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] Foam: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net The seat foam is set on the diaphragm or straps, then the cover is pulled over the foam and the sides wrapped under the frame tubing. The sides are then fastened onto the frame tubing with spring clips that are easy to install and only mildly difficult to remove. MGs did not use those evil hog-ring clips that puncture the fabric. There are 20-22 of these spring clips per seat bottom, so the material cam be tensioned and adjusted perfectly. Bob ---------- Original Message ---------- From: "PaulHunt73" To: Subject: Re: [Mgs] Foam: Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 10:08:19 -0000 Standard procedure is to pull the sides down to remove all the slack. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- Yeah but if you remove an inch the foam won't fill the cover completely. _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 4 12:04:04 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 34AA74227B for ; Fri, 4 Jan 2013 12:04:04 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from gamma.look.ca (gamma.look.ca [216.66.192.4]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0D02742264 for ; Fri, 4 Jan 2013 12:02:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from e120-pool-d89a5a09.brdbnd.telnetcommunications.com ([216.154.90.9] helo=tower.look.ca) by gamma.look.ca with esmtpa (user vectis@look.ca)(Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1TrCV3-0006qG-Vb; Fri, 04 Jan 2013 14:00:14 -0500 Date: Fri, 04 Jan 2013 11:33:52 -0500 To: Mark J Bradakis ,mgs From: Barrie Robinson References: <3AC6F915-8CDA-4B42-AC77-CE8A7B722382@gmail.com> <50E61354.7040500@ktc.com> <50E61865.70604@bradakis.com> Subject: Re: [Mgs] Gasket stuff Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mark, Thanks for the info. I looked at the site and I see it is a goop sort of stuff. Unfortunately I have to have an easily removable gasket as one tends to have to fit, then unfit, then fit again because some things require that, and I also (you may not believe this) make mistakes! The head, for instance, sometimes requires it coming off, changing he shims under the cylinder liner and re-torquing down, then taking off the head again to check that the liner is EXACTLY 1mm proud ! Thank heavens this is already done. The W.O. Bentley designed Aston 3L engine is a pig - but once together is brilliant. So I have to get soe sheet type material and seems I will need a couple of differenr thicknesses and materials. Can you tell me how many people are in the Aston Martin list please? Can I give you a whole pile of email addresses to add? I was thinking of getting the members of the Aston Martin Feltham Club to join (73 so far) see www.AMFClub.com. At 04:46 PM 1/3/2013 -0700, Mark J Bradakis wrote: >The Right Stuff from Permatex - expensive but it works. > >mjb. >_______________________________________________ > >Mgs@autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Suggested annual donation $12.75 >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/barrie@look.ca Regards Barrie barrie@look.ca 705-721-9060 _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 4 12:04:29 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71E1D422E1 for ; Fri, 4 Jan 2013 12:04:29 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from gamma.look.ca (gamma.look.ca [216.66.192.4]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 053864225B; Fri, 4 Jan 2013 12:02:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from e120-pool-d89a5a09.brdbnd.telnetcommunications.com ([216.154.90.9] helo=tower.look.ca) by gamma.look.ca with esmtpa (user vectis@look.ca)(Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1TrCV3-0006qG-IG; Fri, 04 Jan 2013 14:00:13 -0500 Date: Fri, 04 Jan 2013 11:00:00 -0500 To: "Ficalora, Robert" , "mgb-v8@autox.team.net" , "mgs@autox.team.net" From: Barrie Robinson hpqcorp.net> References: <0193D586D853DD4A9175FBA28049389892956BBD@G4W3205.americas.hpqcorp.net> Subject: Re: [Mgs] [Mgb-v8] Gasket stuff Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thanks Rob, I rather think that one gasket material fits all is not right - so I will buy the various types for various uses !! Thanks, you made me think !!! At 09:54 PM 1/3/2013 +0000, Ficalora, Robert wrote: >Depends where the gaskets are going... A good auto-parts store >(around here that'd be a Carquest or NAPA) will have a selection of >different gasket materials. As an example, for fuel tank (e.g., >sender opening) you'll want to use something like natural cork (not >rubberized) or maybe Karropak (which is a fiber material) because >the gas - especially if it has a lot of ethanol like we do here in >TX will attack rubber. For other areas, rubber fiber or rubberized >cork would be ok. > >Rob > >-----Original Message----- >From: mgb-v8-bounces@autox.team.net >[mailto:mgb-v8-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Barrie Robinson >Sent: Thursday, January 03, 2013 3:43 PM >To: mgb-v8@autox.team.net; mgs@autox.team.net >Subject: [Mgb-v8] Gasket stuff > >I have to make all sorts of gaskets for my being-restored motor >car. What is the best stuff to use? Overkill is fine so I want the >very best. Canadian Tyre offers cork/rubber which looks >traditional, and composite stuff that looks like leather > >Regards, > >Barrie Robinson >barrie@look.ca >705-721-9060 >MGB GT V8 in great nick >Aston Martin 1957 DB 2/4 MkII under restoration >www.britishv8.org/MG/BarrieRobinson.htm >www.britcot.com >www.AMFClub.com >_______________________________________________ > >Mgb-v8@autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Suggested annual donation $11.47 >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe/Manage: >http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgb-v8/robert.ficalora@hp.com Regards Barrie barrie@look.ca 705-721-9060 _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 5 21:09:33 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 510D742467 for ; Sat, 5 Jan 2013 21:09:33 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm30-vm0.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com (nm30-vm0.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com [98.139.44.194]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2D7C42460 for ; Sat, 5 Jan 2013 21:09:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.139.44.100] by nm30.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2013 04:06:24 -0000 Received: from [67.195.14.95] by tm5.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2013 04:06:24 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp110.sbc.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2013 04:06:24 -0000 8PpZbRSd0KZWkeoz9h0mJGtELlg1.kY_L0JrTI_OUzpcyUZSWHWCLdZlX7tk tAWWRXnFKPQsTIf_BrLmhbjjA4Rc6OOkSMFPtuOeuGyLA0VIkJpQIEZjkjpn _PK.JyHbND.Nj6n9m5_80TyMIStCGLNGYSQFXmVDJlDy92dvcHljGsbl465T OpaYCSwBLqtzO2d8zAxnCENP6mzQYgnZM.Rb36UpIR6qojanq.s_JtnPxyNI Y_NYKSVM_NCpSsp3Dp8R7z9rdnNSzm0ov81WUX8XxwmZ3zjRaWHud9Qkxn8g KRaWPvqaX4EQTc_4UaPUvwZYa6sysDjuhGFgPtnIZ4bVCrJqiAV2dQ1olG1R xZXNU5W2Wqh30gpW9wR1zeh96n9H2aAJhhwpeXyzplffkXrB_4Rx4RoUzRan m73dPlQ-- Received: from [10.0.1.8] (mike@70.226.193.217 with plain) by smtp110.sbc.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 05 Jan 2013 20:06:24 -0800 PST From: Duvall Video Productions Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2013 22:06:23 -0600 To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] loctite question Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Anyone use red loctite instead of mechanical fasteners on main cap nuts? I have an MPJG engine from a TA when I torque down the mains, the holes don't line up to the castle nuts for the wire. I don't want to over torque and if I back them up to match the hole, I loose my torque. Suggestions? _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 5 21:24:46 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2953542494 for ; Sat, 5 Jan 2013 21:24:46 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm18.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com (nm18.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com [66.94.237.219]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B4B7D4246C for ; Sat, 5 Jan 2013 21:24:40 -0700 (MST) Received: from [66.94.237.198] by nm18.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2013 04:21:50 -0000 Received: from [68.142.198.104] by tm9.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2013 04:21:50 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp106.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2013 04:21:50 -0000 s=s1024; t=1357446110; bh=bdnEqORblYDmsI+vTD38kjnEjE6N6naICdQTJMF/WKA=; h=X-Yahoo-Newman-Id:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-SMTP:Received:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=AOF9iaIl/lCJ/y5A2HQ8P5Z1XoAcvhdLMwQC2pXL3vcdifbdjRUYgd14XWoOWqICGYK+GsyKmZ5zDAzDvJz1o7VYTovk2cAoqOr95TV8lLPqz3OwtpDonFBz6I7bIe8hwLsv6b5Yh9JMckXrDF60o0eiIi/iwdN1UzbSSQL9hL8= IQ4C6gZvJ_dPf2WN4KXPO0MFI1HV0XP9cNVukMkU3tjpeC_kUDtArDMEVMuC b27yiyCmFIofCt2itXm2.P5Al_neFCL8DxOn9LRk1Q5rX78IkrOHk.OwdiHt lnIhPnpWmHuFeIAK6xC5kKtk2SBoDdhdoL_FsZ_FnIkRClTNHKWQJBd3pBj4 EUQOEvMVv14ZyD7tDJs8DB2JGpT25rug0zSY7WvixOKzkJnGxqQWsBLmRzZk a_mKTii_A.jK5m08mG9bfDKz89DB13q9f5mhWRVnMxO1CdUV6bzzrDPHs35E 1bWpc3AtvyXw127WWMKnqArQNPpXL7qfuVYNxOPcEBY.zSbuEov_zyS.O3Lt d1ggrwxNRIx956tKxDPfxnSrcqZsNsDHA4.WdKsFWoUyz0xKqX6ot1jxv8sd CcFaU7GH8Np50oNXZW3Gs4c1I Received: from [127.0.0.1] (chillmog@99.9.234.42 with plain) by smtp106.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com with SMTP; 06 Jan 2013 04:21:50 +0000 UTC Date: Sat, 05 Jan 2013 22:21:48 -0600 From: Charles Hill User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/17.0 Thunderbird/17.0 To: mgs@autox.team.net References: Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I'm not sure that Locktite will hold up to the heat inside the engine. In the situation you describe some people will sand the mating surface of the nut to get the holes to line up. I'm not sure I would want to do that to the main cap nuts though. You might try swapping them around to see if it makes a difference. Regards, Charles Hill On 1/5/2013 10:06 PM, Duvall Video Productions wrote: > Anyone use red loctite instead of mechanical fasteners on main cap nuts? I > have an MPJG engine from a TA when I torque down the mains, the holes don't > line up to the castle nuts for the wire. I don't want to over torque and if > I back them up to match the hole, I loose my torque. > > Suggestions? > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/chillmog@sbcglobal.net _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 5 21:50:19 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5379042483 for ; Sat, 5 Jan 2013 21:50:19 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-bk0-f47.google.com (mail-bk0-f47.google.com [209.85.214.47]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 795944246F for ; Sat, 5 Jan 2013 21:44:47 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-bk0-f47.google.com with SMTP id j4so7765957bkw.20 for ; Sat, 05 Jan 2013 20:41:57 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=SpPtwdxKa15M5krMJ5mIcQ9YMb/8iZ5WZpE/NLq3cGw=; b=tUyqNnbqrlQzbWls+4wf7YDOM2tQG/l5WBI/rSk1yDyto7RDK9TiD81r3kAEMSnYwm osWj40Wm8Ct3TxyoNwR4XLCk6k/8uTnRH0tp84qcSDJi9Imdb8nSL8KqzRs4qtUiqRUy gFtDnUEdkyJi8XDmUKoabuOHIgEWD40qzM7rl5fDtlKc/sdn+0YqrEaGgn4iudT3ZOq+ T9Z1fCjnLt3NTUFqVWE1wiDhw0WTELzi+fvcjptvAO5vr+6z8PAjz7G2Y9WtQPT/31SM z5ZpU8C8XzVrUAYw+IiNWYD6BGXxsK/sPECyvo27T3RkFoiEE1RYDkFixCKYDX4wh01w aU+g== Received: by 10.204.146.92 with SMTP id g28mr27625930bkv.127.1357447317188; Sat, 05 Jan 2013 20:41:57 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.204.78.139 with HTTP; Sat, 5 Jan 2013 20:41:57 -0800 (PST) References: Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2013 20:41:57 -0800 From: Richard Ewald To: Duvall Video Productions Cc: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I would not use red. When properly applied red is stronger than the thread it is applied to. Properly applied and cured red Loctite will strip the male threads right off a stud/bolt. I've done this trying to unscrew TR7 head studs Double nutted them, no good. Cleaned everything up, used Loctite primer and red loctite. Spun the threads right off the head stud, which didn't budge. Use green, it is better suited for this use. Some car makers specified green for use on rod cap and main nuts. As far as temperature goes loctite is good to 450F at which point it turns to powder. This should not be an issue for a main stud. Rick On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:06 PM, Duvall Video Productions < mike@duvallvideo.com> wrote: > Anyone use red loctite instead of mechanical fasteners on main cap nuts? > I > have an MPJG engine from a TA when I torque down the mains, the holes don't > line up to the castle nuts for the wire. I don't want to over torque and > if > I back them up to match the hole, I loose my torque. > > Suggestions? > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/richard.ewald@gmail.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jan 6 04:31:27 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19C5642494 for ; Sun, 6 Jan 2013 04:31:27 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-we0-f178.google.com (mail-we0-f178.google.com [74.125.82.178]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3368142287 for ; Sun, 6 Jan 2013 04:29:45 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-we0-f178.google.com with SMTP id x43so8905805wey.37 for ; Sun, 06 Jan 2013 03:26:54 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:to:references:subject:date:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority :x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=b79KGkIltF+evfqJmOQb+sz3Pb4ZBTSErW+6Xr17y+c=; b=CzdW5aELQmWo4kMSgdGunDHeeRVWRwFeEOA+gg8c95UURoKq6oy5nE0F5WJ3lEWdXi H7Sy46bUn1BjBNxd5oU6PqR2OrBPyqun3WEMsDJoHBBSxaetOA1zAeFvASPM1frEsrtI 0Vp8x2c9/ahPm+GaT1772zLFAqgaao8H4sj3uJwSxqPvild1Oo7dzxshLXh/xEbKcJqO 8fvZe514jK0XF8x0++J40cugJhGVdAimWTVYHeq+SEm3cFxuGTwyyElG6ciGdnrZzB76 gP/nCMmY2nh4KhSJ8QErOic3EcscZfOnFlSl63Dh/KhLki5etkMK5TyMht7xUzntaGJs KW7A== v9mr4628634wiz.26.1357471613948; Sun, 06 Jan 2013 03:26:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-1.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.97]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id w5sm7032881wif.11.2013.01.06.03.26.52 (version=TLSv1.1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Sun, 06 Jan 2013 03:26:53 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" To: "Duvall Video Productions" , References: Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2013 11:10:07 -0000 Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Shims under the nuts? ----- Original Message ----- > ... when I torque down the mains, the holes don't > line up to the castle nuts for the wire. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jan 6 12:43:12 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4404D425B3 for ; Sun, 6 Jan 2013 12:43:12 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com (outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com [64.136.55.36]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 39D174258F for ; Sun, 6 Jan 2013 12:41:22 -0700 (MST) s=alpha; t=1357501109; bh=47DEQpj8HBSa+/TImW+5JCeuQeRkm5NMpJWZG3hSuFU=; l=0; h=From:Date:To:Cc:Subject:Message-Id:Content-Type; b=eDygIz9A8p6JSwwA+tX8BRIbL7vUdUoGoJU1JcVLC4M8+GhRPTJFwATfNlNyXkwxu juSzAmfMLmtdO6tpNITmfznvn3vkWZN8ZADORytO/B2dx6XC6WplZEX1CYq3NV8I31 QMzv5zf/JVUXAe43Ky5/tdaFut7Lvrrj7otDg/HI= Received: from outbound-bu1.vgs.untd.com (webmail-beta01.vgs.untd.com [10.181.12.101]) by smtpout03.vgs.untd.com with SMTP id AABJQVWXTA2P4H9S for (sender ); Sun, 6 Jan 2013 11:38:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from [108.88.216.197] by webmail-beta01.vgs.untd.com with HTTP: Sun, 6 Jan 2013 19:37:01 GMT From: "mgbob@juno.com" Full-Name: "mgbob@juno.com" Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2013 19:37:01 GMT To: mike@duvallvideo.com Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Have you tried swapping the nuts to different bolts? If, after finding nearest fit, a couple do not quite align at acceptable torque, rubbing the nut a couple of strokes on abrasive paper can give the additional turn needed. Shims could be used, but they would be tiny pieces of metal, the integrity of which could not be seen once nuts are torqued, inside the engine. Bob ---------- Original Message ---------- From: Duvall Video Productions To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] loctite question Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2013 22:06:23 -0600 Anyone use red loctite instead of mechanical fasteners on main cap nuts? I have an MPJG engine from a TA when I torque down the mains, the holes don't line up to the castle nuts for the wire. I don't want to over torque and if I back them up to match the hole, I loose my torque. Suggestions? _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mgbob@juno.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 7 02:08:43 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF76B428DA for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 02:08:43 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-bk0-f48.google.com (mail-bk0-f48.google.com [209.85.214.48]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AF7940E20 for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 02:03:18 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-bk0-f48.google.com with SMTP id jc3so8188143bkc.21 for ; Mon, 07 Jan 2013 01:00:23 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:to:cc:references:subject:date :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority :x-msmail-priority:x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=GVeYzEH++4fP83+FQLkIMF4EDmIYYojWZjCSxo7gSxs=; b=oP0FBZoNzelfL73L9hXLtibumIN1mGwmUxRkB6fRJWExILjVrsrmHUt891vM358koz aad0tY+l/Ycsl3KgYVI1aWT0uxtp8upFqZDUVQQXyQuOGY2/LW7FIhe2Bbt/mGdcx3oz Hd1XY6eGufg6xbDGIi4B5o7kGarmgA0kDi/4orYkJdIYxvOZwmLkQNaVRkecbamAMXMq iE/7Xe00Xj1ErMjgQAhVK5Ch1nWCBjfTG0MwsEq9G3xD4LtUukioi6wu9ov1qvZQG5qy tEz34g6anpQQO2WlVWV6fe7w/G0mQn6RGC3VDV8kpnLDZrgPK6MoQM8zWw5IvSO3TLi1 pcsA== j7mr30131261bkv.125.1357549222913; Mon, 07 Jan 2013 01:00:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-1.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.97]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id d16sm41285914bkw.2.2013.01.07.01.00.22 (version=SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Mon, 07 Jan 2013 01:00:22 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" To: References: <20130106.143701.15815.3@webmail-beta01.vgs.untd.com> Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 08:43:34 -0000 Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net It works for front wheel bearings on the MGB ... ----- Original Message ----- > Shims could be used, but they would be tiny pieces of metal, the > integrity > of which could not be seen once nuts are torqued, inside the engine. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 7 08:54:45 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50A5E4299D for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 08:54:45 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nlpi176.prodigy.net (nlpi176.sbcis.sbc.com [207.115.36.48]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C8ED42998 for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 08:54:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from barney-gaylord.mgaguru.com (adsl-76-202-231-217.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net [76.202.231.217]) (authenticated bits=0) by nlpi176.prodigy.net (8.14.4 smptauth/8.14.4) with ESMTP id r07FpN2s002495; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 09:51:24 -0600 Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 09:47:48 -0600 To: "PaulHunt73" , From: Barney Gaylord References: <20130106.143701.15815.3@webmail-beta01.vgs.untd.com> Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net In that application the nut is not bearing directly on the shims. A nut bearing directly on a thin shim will destroy the shim as the nut is tightened. If you are going to shim a nut for rotation reference, you need a hard flat washer between nut and shim, and the washer should be keyed so it doesn't rotate. At 08:43 AM 1/7/2013 +0000, PaulHunt73 wrote: >It works for front wheel bearings on the MGB ... >----- Original Message ----- >> Shims could be used, but they would be tiny pieces of metal, the integrity >>of which could not be seen once nuts are torqued, inside the engine. >>.... _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 7 11:27:08 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9DE2429BF for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 11:27:08 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com (outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com [64.136.55.36]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 8175B42977 for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 11:26:37 -0700 (MST) s=alpha; t=1357583019; bh=47DEQpj8HBSa+/TImW+5JCeuQeRkm5NMpJWZG3hSuFU=; l=0; h=From:Date:To:Cc:Subject:Message-Id:Content-Type; b=mS38nBcEnmj1rlI757TE7fxRikEP8UfIytWXLP+i4Z5pCpyMmw9pr75XGn5KsP/rh GvXE/wkEk7fWUz3gPzkXWPkDbzPCqrCKXg9RVyojkQVO1AkQYXrZkBNeY0z2lTISg+ gqDbEsMvG3j/fZqJ8oFijQWrMbhMlc6tLLsB6/BM= Received: from outbound-bu1.vgs.untd.com (webmail-beta03.vgs.untd.com [10.181.12.103]) by smtpout04.vgs.untd.com with SMTP id AABJQYEWVADH6XW2 for (sender ); Mon, 7 Jan 2013 10:23:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from [108.88.216.197] by webmail-beta03.vgs.untd.com with HTTP: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 18:22:42 GMT From: "mgbob@juno.com" Full-Name: "mgbob@juno.com" Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 18:22:42 GMT To: paulhunt73@virginmedia.com Cc: mgs@autox.team.net, mike@duvallvideo.com Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net No question about that, but those shims are large enough to see easily, and to have some strength because of their size. My concern is that shims small enough to fit into that tight recess for connecting rod nuts would be concealed by the nut and washer, and that the split washer could cut or tear a tiny shim that is only a couple of thou thick. This may be needless worry, but I have never seen a shim used in this application. Bob ---------- Original Message ---------- From: "PaulHunt73" To: Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 08:43:34 -0000 It works for front wheel bearings on the MGB ... ----- Original Message ----- > Shims could be used, but they would be tiny pieces of metal, the > integrity > of which could not be seen once nuts are torqued, inside the engine. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mgbob@juno.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 7 11:48:38 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 15090429DA for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 11:48:38 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from qmta03.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net (qmta03.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net [76.96.30.32]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10AFB4297D for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 11:48:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from omta23.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.30.90]) by qmta03.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net with comcast id l1Yu1k0061wfjNsA36lF8Y; Mon, 07 Jan 2013 18:45:15 +0000 Received: from mail-la0-f42.google.com ([209.85.215.42]) by omta23.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net with comcast id l6jD1k00A0vTaEh8j6jEvp; Mon, 07 Jan 2013 18:43:14 +0000 Received: by mail-la0-f42.google.com with SMTP id fe20so16832217lab.29 for ; Mon, 07 Jan 2013 10:43:12 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:x-originating-ip:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:cc:content-type:x-gm-message-state; bh=iSXw68jR+iFLBWnvA4h6/lK74HK5DL4KeAr3YpMyWeU=; b=nB3KfYfQFbbsvRU75MI0fOcxo3JLAtwv/1jKvdv3fJLv+4PLfdhdvJz3TP6ocLw5nV lFKP8kR/cuT5Jj3WRfW0Xzzti1YzLZQzY8BtRclpME3o3rfIPyTOYKjDNxS2eCaIXxmN HZfj8PrK0qouOUp4NEM/MSLYU6Acm2LZr57ihDfaknQnWeYzaY1SLuftHVS+wyWI3Ac5 R9L+cieUmkkCJdJWsnQFqy0tSqkIVEypjdy7/e3ygNRjhSkquDwC/18uisJLPKx+K5c/ gjTCx8UPvd5WScPmS6RjmXyCJ7BYj6lHGj+OJK0Bcpk6npLbiHU+ee0sP55jZAnf9MtZ WOsA== Received: by 10.152.131.137 with SMTP id om9mr58189539lab.18.1357584192620; Mon, 07 Jan 2013 10:43:12 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.112.147.201 with HTTP; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 10:43:12 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.112.147.201 with HTTP; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 10:43:12 -0800 (PST) References: <20130107.132242.27187.1@webmail-beta03.vgs.untd.com> Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 11:43:12 -0700 From: Andrew Lundgren Cc: mgs@autox.team.net s=q20121106; t=1357584315; bh=iSXw68jR+iFLBWnvA4h6/lK74HK5DL4KeAr3YpMyWeU=; h=Received:Received:Received:MIME-Version:Received:Received: Received:Date:Message-ID:Subject:From:Content-Type; b=kBuUqSL8MjMPJE0O6Yew9ypWYkYX5n2XvtQGTJ07QKTOoaQQl05faEEpEcYT+6v1o JsDM3qgWRGJHWLV2Js3vfpJ6xIMR1TolYLdxGGZYW2JaD/3gZtv4d+8yLKDUPPkHEF /Ux5HmNYZ5hvgI4nxvhKUFKGUcZLQbtTEfw9hMiPvcJrb8C22cBrdQITkn/rUIU7fd 1J4i7vYRaBnaI28cwo6fMqT+BzKiBHZBeeqDOuak0GAizptrh33OwULGnlUmtTC8Rj 8iF2MTREhUzQssi7YXHDtCHOS3TVgm3WIZyIOxDttFp/FrmgM9C3pYYsPP9gh5Yzla m8MaHUKYCLHuw== Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net What would they have done on the assembly line when one didn't line up perfectly? I would bet they would back off the nut or advance it to the closest hole. On Jan 7, 2013 11:24 AM, "mgbob@juno.com" wrote: > No question about that, but those shims are large enough to see easily, > and > to have some strength because of their size. My concern is that shims > small > enough to fit into that tight recess for connecting rod nuts would be > concealed by the nut and washer, and that the split washer could cut or > tear a > tiny shim that is only a couple of thou thick. > This may be needless worry, but I have never seen a shim used in this > application. > Bob > > ---------- Original Message ---------- > From: "PaulHunt73" > To: > Cc: mgs@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question > Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 08:43:34 -0000 > > It works for front wheel bearings on the MGB ... > > ----- Original Message ----- > > Shims could be used, but they would be tiny pieces of metal, the > > integrity > > of which could not be seen once nuts are torqued, inside the engine. > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mgbob@juno.com > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/lundgren@byu.net _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 7 12:04:02 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F90F42A12 for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 12:04:02 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm14-vm0.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com (nm14-vm0.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com [66.94.236.15]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7171C429D5 for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 12:03:40 -0700 (MST) Received: from [66.94.237.193] by nm14.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Jan 2013 19:00:43 -0000 Received: from [68.142.198.104] by tm4.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Jan 2013 19:00:43 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp106.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Jan 2013 19:00:43 -0000 s=s1024; t=1357585243; bh=vQgR+Uh9IeK73+eO00Pd/4Ezj5kwvl9mntRYDqdbrWs=; h=X-Yahoo-Newman-Id:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-SMTP:Received:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=BbIOIy73Y5AxQMwKNhSyuDF50r94KvyzaifA7lEawlNpclvCowivMfWIUnRZeUhvEWkbgOZYhgKXNyt6cHwRsPmjrVS7rh0AJ6Xf71gO2mEA82R4Ia4tgVXXF2KZ5Tc4zIJ08lZR8dp4d7T5gKDGzo4t4Ny2xj1wH2CWND8phNw= Xmm5VCcZLYcC9hllTzWqotQFblUnMcLtNAGDHzf05S4sqIBq_iUG.Mbur_uO vhjj1wTPYWtwr0bJMNp34iKa1KT8j3WS_rSrdodqyF9x6VC0mY_xYk89vxBB diBNKEEROOZZDwC9PvOffTsQTzbnDc_yP7IqhXwHS5gcuI0ql7u13Y0PviEc PYf3tkDssw.F5xpeGaMdhhLa1veeIItmn4Q4vWehLROAPg5Uy3cMtVr4zCPP uS5.98TFPr6BB_6mrfs8Lw98hm.KLhpvPuoQ_enC7vQaUMkX7ckzqYMT54Ey 7W4CGrY9Z4sNKd6qJLYxfGfkMitKxZrKPTX00.MEtqMlpge.hzloR7FpB.9D 2ZI1QwQ1NxUH_.SDB7GG_QPJVaWi1KpKgddw5z_qbdkMkk.4myDT.mpec9cl o6T0s_dPE9iEihxFpccA.G3doA.78WpCkJP57U7773pQyhLUh Received: from [127.0.0.1] (chillmog@99.9.234.42 with plain) by smtp106.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com with SMTP; 07 Jan 2013 19:00:43 +0000 UTC Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 13:00:39 -0600 From: Charles Hill User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/17.0 Thunderbird/17.0 To: mgs@autox.team.net References: <20130107.132242.27187.1@webmail-beta03.vgs.untd.com> Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I don't think they were using torque wrenches back then. Charles Hill On 1/7/2013 12:43 PM, Andrew Lundgren wrote: > What would they have done on the assembly line when one didn't line up > perfectly? _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 7 12:10:27 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E858C42A10 for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 12:10:27 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from pacmmta51.windstream.net (pacmmta51.windstream.net [162.39.147.110]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2ECB442977 for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 12:08:19 -0700 (MST) cv=lfjML3bQkTsh5H+cJ65BAulV5zVM2pgB13D795OEGio= c=1 sm=0 a=OvIMvpSEN2sA:10 a=We2GSUcPNccA:10 a=fOpwdquTRaQA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=c-XdwLnv30UlUmKDzSIA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=Q2K8hKtRzNtQKB5fvDXRIQ==:117 Authentication-Results: pacmmta51 smtp.user=ccrobins@ktc.com; auth=pass (PLAIN) Received: from [75.91.227.235] ([75.91.227.235:51723] helo=[127.0.0.1]) by pacmmta51 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39824M)) with ESMTPA id 2C/C4-24841-17C1BE05; Mon, 07 Jan 2013 14:05:22 -0500 Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 13:05:06 -0600 From: Charley & Peggy Robinson Organization: Computer Helpers User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/17.0 Thunderbird/17.0 To: Duvall Video Productions References: Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Let's keep in mind that torque specs are meant to set the fastener (bolt, stud) into the approximate middle of its elasticity range and the torque specs are given in a range too. If a torque spec is given as, say 40 - 50 ft-lbs I'll set my wrench for 45 and sneak up on it. One crenelation in a castellated nut, more or less, isn't that big a deal, IMO. CR On 1/5/2013 10:06 PM, Duvall Video Productions wrote: > Anyone use red loctite instead of mechanical fasteners on main cap nuts? I > have an MPJG engine from a TA when I torque down the mains, the holes don't > line up to the castle nuts for the wire. I don't want to over torque and if > I back them up to match the hole, I loose my torque. > > Suggestions? _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 7 15:16:47 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3CD3642A51 for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 15:16:47 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com (outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com [64.136.55.36]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 2DB4C4003E for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 15:16:20 -0700 (MST) s=alpha; t=1357596802; bh=47DEQpj8HBSa+/TImW+5JCeuQeRkm5NMpJWZG3hSuFU=; l=0; h=From:Date:To:Cc:Subject:Message-Id:Content-Type; b=C9ham1bCSG4BeNvMkDinGvurUBnTt+Hr+6sAtY9tcRXH3fkQPnJ9AfqWfC8EYmv0s Cub1X/b3o6cP42WPv2DEOHqn9kxzC2RwxzELsSyGM0yOej5/sO8u5l631+vrY+2nAF Mr+RZyvU+KP1soF3h3cz9TaYf3hlq/BR/qctdsSI= Received: from outbound-bu1.vgs.untd.com (webmail-beta01.vgs.untd.com [10.181.12.101]) by smtpout02.vgs.untd.com with SMTP id AABJQYUDFAS7H8KA for (sender ); Mon, 7 Jan 2013 14:12:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from [108.88.216.197] by webmail-beta01.vgs.untd.com with HTTP: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 22:11:10 GMT From: "mgbob@juno.com" Full-Name: "mgbob@juno.com" Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 22:11:10 GMT To: chillmog@sbcglobal.net Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Try YouTube for British Pathe movies, then look up MG and other cars. Pathe did newsreels and movies about businesses. Wade through them for a while and you can enjoy B&W movies of T-series MGs being assembled without a power tool in sight. Parts were lifted onto assemblies, assemblies might then be chain hoisted onto the chassis. By MGA time, a few power tools appear. I have not spotted a torque wrench in any I have seen.All the workers wore neckties tucked into aprons or their shirts. Bob ---------- Original Message ---------- From: Charles Hill To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 13:00:39 -0600 I don't think they were using torque wrenches back then. Charles Hill On 1/7/2013 12:43 PM, Andrew Lundgren wrote: > What would they have done on the assembly line when one didn't line up > perfectly? _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mgbob@juno.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 7 20:20:00 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 907AC42A6B for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 20:20:00 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from qmta12.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net (qmta12.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net [76.96.27.227]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF09242A55 for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 20:16:36 -0700 (MST) Received: from omta11.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.30.36]) by qmta12.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net with comcast id l1MJ1k0030mlR8UACFDdHC; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 03:13:37 +0000 Received: from [IPv6:2601:5:600:2e:d83e:6ea4:3f12:b88c] ([IPv6:2601:5:600:2e:d83e:6ea4:3f12:b88c]) by omta11.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net with comcast id lFDa1k0080Vp8pg8XFDcJ5; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 03:13:37 +0000 Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 21:13:37 -0600 From: Glenn Schnittke User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:8.0) Gecko/20111105 Thunderbird/8.0 To: mgs@autox.team.net References: s=q20121106; t=1357614817; bh=RhhTJ2Co2THr7CsA5LDJzD1mYXAa/Q1Q2B5VCFIE9q8=; h=Received:Received:Message-ID:Date:From:MIME-Version:To:Subject: Content-Type; b=QZ0k1pckNpy+2SfLAX2+6XlHTMccxCNi6RISrJXX2OCBOizfP53KuVUEstDxXBFWd dD81BJY6Nr+RnK3mZKB32e+Fc9kCL4oG62VbELbGVp8E5h58djn90ht/FvA7SJ+u/m J92lvz92P2ZZHJP8g/MJqYZoI//wjezGG1hxhA+qZSdMswuvvMg6m2EmCfa+/cTru3 HcqfIJ1Eb5yiYzy2TAabyZ6djVtfyLrVGrWclj3txtI3bco26PHbzjQFIncIv9mFLZ fcg61XpBuYgeOo0xpbjKGLUzBI9/QAWHAGd1348Bo4QawPqXCRrnHKyfK03T6MBCo2 BacQ6wxbp3ifg== Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I've been working on this same question on an XPEG. The response from the old hands I've talked to has always been ' rearrange the nuts to best fit and then shave the bottom of the rest on a glass plate to fit'. My thought on that is 'what keeps the stud itself in place'? There's never a torque value for bottoming the stud into the block. And there's no mechanical device to keep the stud from backing out, so what's keeping the whole assembly from backing out even with the cotter pin through the castellated nut or nylock or whatever you're using on the top side? It's just one of those things that has puzzled me through the years - what keeps a stud from backing out when the nut holding whatever it is in place has a VERY specific torque value? Moss's answer seems to be nylock nuts. I don't trust them. On top of having to figure the friction value onto the eventual torque value, I'm concerned about how the heat will affect the nylon over time. If I have to go to a locking nut I should rather trust an aircraft nut which has a metal-to-metal contact and I'd still have to factor in the friction to the eventual torque value. I've seen all kinds of discussion on specific torque values for heads, main caps, conrods, etc. I've found nothing in any manual or discussion about the proper torque for bottoming a stud. I'm sure I'm going to excite all the engineers on the list by bringing this up, but why can't I just back off the stud just a little bit to move the cotter pin hole to meet the castle nut? Glenn > From: Duvall Video Productions > To:mgs@autox.team.net > Subject: [Mgs] loctite question > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Anyone use red loctite instead of mechanical fasteners on main cap nuts? I > have an MPJG engine from a TA when I torque down the mains, the holes don't > line up to the castle nuts for the wire. I don't want to over torque and if > I back them up to match the hole, I loose my torque. > > Suggestions? _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 7 21:07:47 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 441CA42AE5 for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 21:07:47 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from smtp202.iad.emailsrvr.com (smtp202.iad.emailsrvr.com [207.97.245.202]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 476A942A85 for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 21:07:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by smtp30.relay.iad1a.emailsrvr.com (SMTP Server) with ESMTP id 98A6120346 for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 23:04:01 -0500 (EST) Received: by smtp30.relay.iad1a.emailsrvr.com (Authenticated sender: don-AT-napanet.net) with ESMTPSA id 2A8B72019A for ; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 23:04:01 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 20:03:47 -0800 To: mgs@autox.team.net From: Don References: <20130106.143701.15815.3@webmail-beta01.vgs.untd.com> Subject: [Mgs] loctite question Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I have seen these on Japanese cars usually on hubs, but don't know what they are called. Perhaps a set of them could be used with non-castellated nuts, assuming you can find proper nuts having the right threads. You would be able to torque the nuts properly and then just fit the little locking devices atop the nuts and insert cotters. These devices can be rotated to where they align with the hole in the stud. http://cdn1.autopartsnetwork.com/images/catalog/brand/dorman/640/05183-007.jpg ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Don Scott Calistoga CA USA 1955 MGTF 1962 MGA Mk 2 1967 MGB 1963-7 MGB (seeking) Misc. Japanese cars _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 8 01:41:25 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80B47403F2 for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 01:41:25 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-wg0-f41.google.com (mail-wg0-f41.google.com [74.125.82.41]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 76C89403CF for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 01:38:38 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-wg0-f41.google.com with SMTP id ds1so264720wgb.2 for ; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 00:35:38 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:to:cc:references:subject:date :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority :x-msmail-priority:x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=A00SSxHB4C60bkKkryG68WJNnPPIppNWPqhACRg1e6Q=; b=ESDdtGzGjw8Czl90yk2ImLRiCJ187ICr+DXjnI6C8kjskSTYzwaj7fDDjjP+QbQVJi SIRMws2exIieDecAhRt9OnHgS7vPIDdgQOtves8iUE0kYq67Zl2aRVkiaDfclnC0KlY4 EMYbJHaQ7w98pUluOnSTCYeVUaf54Tx8FXPb2bxE7ZTWwPUnolT683waERaCL+9EnaGn fCYLF91QJ2/Zr62BCV5fNdOoRrjKH9+9qfVOQBNKMsqcIdBsL1hFj0xeNpZr3h7EM1jY YQ1FIMHPA6QD627rVnqJoSbdN2CDyanws5uAiHjwSX5XERVRwsjTVvKdJvFN9Mo16m1G 63WQ== c7mr13373798wiw.10.1357634138395; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 00:35:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-1.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.97]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id bd7sm17399901wib.8.2013.01.08.00.35.36 (version=SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Tue, 08 Jan 2013 00:35:37 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" To: , "Barney Gaylord" References: <20130106.143701.15815.3@webmail-beta01.vgs.untd.com> <201301071551.r07FpN2s002495@nlpi176.prodigy.net> Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 16:48:16 -0000 Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fairy nuff. It does depend just how much thickness is going to be needed to bring the holes into line, it could need a washer. ----- Original Message ----- > In that application the nut is not bearing directly on the shims. A nut > bearing directly on a thin shim will destroy the shim as the nut is > tightened. If you are going to shim a nut for rotation reference, you > need a hard flat washer between nut and shim, and the washer should be > keyed so it doesn't rotate. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 8 02:11:37 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D507140433 for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 02:11:37 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-we0-f178.google.com (mail-we0-f178.google.com [74.125.82.178]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4580403D0 for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 02:09:53 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-we0-f178.google.com with SMTP id x43so128973wey.37 for ; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 01:06:52 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:to:cc:references:subject:date :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority :x-msmail-priority:x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=Q6ynfbe4Qja/w1DoPefGGvjswp51T3iBWubXccvSywo=; b=aIwoHRKa+Mw0ovSRNqAWB0yyWH0BZ2ypdzXmzrtFMzophQJ07bdToBZbu9QtXIyNxq D9rt5NGXJiC7z3X/W/kzuHoB3BXv2JZZVDICUMHC/D2ZPPuJCrLBjN4f9UXdRsb3xbKB 1Lokpn/qvmGA/S/EAeCL7SReoWwwxrp92G4krN0bOOp4IimBtJjqOQCPIcyb7DhuzZH6 EOMXF8Qfy+PNJEIbaaPaRMMfxHDTtbA4JXZXvHhjzuVFFxESSj9UL5brYqyNOTLVaN9J iI5YwlDRHDEpd2mNsG0cATNNZW2o3IyJNj5gp5JM+Lo6wb//CoeATByAiI/C45RPUxnC ftsA== n10mr13536620wiv.17.1357636012765; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 01:06:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-1.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.97]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id s16sm16238719wii.0.2013.01.08.01.06.51 (version=TLSv1.1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Tue, 08 Jan 2013 01:06:51 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" To: "Andrew Lundgren" References: <20130107.132242.27187.1@webmail-beta03.vgs.untd.com> Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2013 08:46:23 -0000 Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net That was to have been the basis of my next post, I can't believe those engines were manufactured to such close tolerances that it always lined up on an exact torque figure. The MGB hub nut has a range of 40 to 70 ft lb. You tighten it to 40, then if neither of the holes line up with any of the castellations you keep tightening until something does, and that should happen before 70 ft lb. Going for the middle straight away would not be the right way to go for a nut with a security feature such as split pin or wire. How much are they out anyway? Nothing wrong with Loctite or similar, manufacturers have depended on that instead of wired nuts or split-pins for donkey's years. However it *may* be that those engines do need a positive security locking. I'd be asking somewhere like The Octagon Club. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- > What would they have done on the assembly line when one didn't line up > perfectly? _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 8 05:53:15 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E995240401 for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 05:53:14 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com (outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com [64.136.55.36]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 90406403F0 for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 05:52:54 -0700 (MST) s=alpha; t=1357649392; bh=47DEQpj8HBSa+/TImW+5JCeuQeRkm5NMpJWZG3hSuFU=; l=0; h=From:Date:To:Cc:Subject:Message-Id:Content-Type; b=ZnLjXGgDJi1+HQAFAfodfUXikHXgs62fHDAtmGUV1YdmRtuW92aUKs5//UIqGaKFX qX27IAFJREh0ny9O1DCqsM+BdTFj7br4y2btSPo4+ho72h0vEaTG6bfm9JSNaq/3Y0 MOy04GI1dV6rKeYvgXg5SsMmRmKFqqEF5hX2RsQ4= Received: from outbound-bu1.vgs.untd.com (webmail-beta01.vgs.untd.com [10.181.12.101]) by smtpout02.vgs.untd.com with SMTP id AABJQ2FQZAGWYQWS for (sender ); Tue, 8 Jan 2013 04:49:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from [108.88.216.197] by webmail-beta01.vgs.untd.com with HTTP: Tue, 8 Jan 2013 12:48:44 GMT From: "mgbob@juno.com" Full-Name: "mgbob@juno.com" Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2013 12:48:44 GMT To: g.schnittke@comcast.net Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Interesting thought. One never torques a stud into a casting. Rule of thumb is to turn it in finger tight, then back off a little. If one were to put for reference a scratch across the nut end of the stud, it would seem to make your idea ideal. It's new to me; thanks for suggesting it. Bob ---------- Original Message ---------- From: Glenn Schnittke To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5 Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 21:13:37 -0600 I've been working on this same question on an XPEG. The response from the old hands I've talked to has always been ' rearrange the nuts to best fit and then shave the bottom of the rest on a glass plate to fit'. My thought on that is 'what keeps the stud itself in place'? There's never a torque value for bottoming the stud into the block. And there's no mechanical device to keep the stud from backing out, so what's keeping the whole assembly from backing out even with the cotter pin through the castellated nut or nylock or whatever you're using on the top side? It's just one of those things that has puzzled me through the years - what keeps a stud from backing out when the nut holding whatever it is in place has a VERY specific torque value? Moss's answer seems to be nylock nuts. I don't trust them. On top of having to figure the friction value onto the eventual torque value, I'm concerned about how the heat will affect the nylon over time. If I have to go to a locking nut I should rather trust an aircraft nut which has a metal-to-metal contact and I'd still have to factor in the friction to the eventual torque value. I've seen all kinds of discussion on specific torque values for heads, main caps, conrods, etc. I've found nothing in any manual or discussion about the proper torque for bottoming a stud. I'm sure I'm going to excite all the engineers on the list by bringing this up, but why can't I just back off the stud just a little bit to move the cotter pin hole to meet the castle nut? Glenn > From: Duvall Video Productions > To:mgs@autox.team.net > Subject: [Mgs] loctite question > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Anyone use red loctite instead of mechanical fasteners on main cap nuts? I > have an MPJG engine from a TA when I torque down the mains, the holes don't > line up to the castle nuts for the wire. I don't want to over torque and if > I back them up to match the hole, I loose my torque. > > Suggestions? _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mgbob@juno.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 8 07:44:07 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 933FA40522 for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 07:44:07 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nlpi162.prodigy.net (nlpi162.sbcis.sbc.com [207.115.36.34]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0069403D3 for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 07:44:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from barney-gaylord.mgaguru.com (adsl-76-202-231-217.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net [76.202.231.217]) (authenticated bits=0) by nlpi162.prodigy.net (8.14.4 smptauth/8.14.4) with ESMTP id r08EewRu007490; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 08:40:59 -0600 Date: Tue, 08 Jan 2013 08:40:56 -0600 To: Glenn Schnittke , mgs@autox.team.net From: Barney Gaylord References: <50EB8EE1.5010900@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net The answer for seating torque on the stud (any stud) is finger tight, not to exceed 5 lb-ft of torque. The recpetical is a deep threaded hole, and the stud has a shorter thread. The stud screws in until it runs out of threads on the stud, at which time the last incomplete thread on the stud will bind in the first thread on the receptacle. Applying more torque at that time will damage the top female thread, raising a burr and possibly damaging a casting. Too much torque on the stud could crack the casting. Most studs (not all) will have course thread on the bottom end and fine thread on the top end. The steeper ramp angle on the bottom thread will prevent the stud from turning while the nut is being tightened. Otherwise prevailing torque on the last incomplete thread is all that prevents the stud from turning. Binding on the incomplete thread is also all that keeps the stud from unscrewing when the nut is being removed. This is why self-locking nuts have a tendency to unscrew the stud when being removed. That also makes it difficult to back the nut off 1/4 turn if you want to re-torque it later. If you back the stud out a little in attempt to synchronize location of a cross pin hole, chances are pretty good that the stud will rotate again and end up in a non-predictable final position when tightening the nut. Barney Gaylord 1958 MGA with an attitude http://MGAguru.com At 09:13 PM 1/7/2013 -0600, Glenn Schnittke wrote: >I've been working on this same question on an XPEG. The response >from the old hands I've talked to has always been ' rearrange the >nuts to best fit and then shave the bottom of the rest on a glass >plate to fit'. > >My thought on that is 'what keeps the stud itself in place'? There's >never a torque value for bottoming the stud into the block. And >there's no mechanical device to keep the stud from backing out, so >what's keeping the whole assembly from backing out even with the >cotter pin through the castellated nut or nylock or whatever you're >using on the top side? > >It's just one of those things that has puzzled me through the years >- what keeps a stud from backing out when the nut holding whatever >it is in place has a VERY specific torque value? > >Moss's answer seems to be nylock nuts. I don't trust them. On top of >having to figure the friction value onto the eventual torque value, >I'm concerned about how the heat will affect the nylon over time. If >I have to go to a locking nut I should rather trust an aircraft nut >which has a metal-to-metal contact and I'd still have to factor in >the friction to the eventual torque value. > >I've seen all kinds of discussion on specific torque values for >heads, main caps, conrods, etc. I've found nothing in any manual or >discussion about the proper torque for bottoming a stud. I'm sure >I'm going to excite all the engineers on the list by bringing this >up, but why can't I just back off the stud just a little bit to move >the cotter pin hole to meet the castle nut? >.... >>From: Duvall Video Productions >>To:mgs@autox.team.net >>Subject: [Mgs] loctite question >>.... >> >>Anyone use red loctite instead of mechanical fasteners on main cap nuts? I >>have an MPJG engine from a TA when I torque down the mains, the holes don't >>line up to the castle nuts for the wire. I don't want to over torque and if >>I back them up to match the hole, I loose my torque. >>.... _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 8 10:33:35 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A69140510 for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 10:33:35 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from bosmailout04.eigbox.net (bosmailout04.eigbox.net [66.96.186.4]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 300F1403F5 for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 10:33:11 -0700 (MST) Received: from bosmailscan06.eigbox.net ([10.20.15.6]) by bosmailout04.eigbox.net with esmtp (Exim) id 1Tsd05-0007lt-9d for mgs@autox.team.net; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 12:30:09 -0500 Received: from bosimpout02.eigbox.net ([10.20.55.2]) by bosmailscan06.eigbox.net with esmtp (Exim) id 1Tsd04-0005v8-8t; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 12:30:08 -0500 Received: from bosauthsmtp11.eigbox.net ([10.20.18.11]) by bosimpout02.eigbox.net with NO UCE id lVW81k01b0EKspE01VW8Bv; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 12:30:08 -0500 a=xFGZHQJTfFmg0JpGsz00GA==:17 a=Qd0dgZ-1Fk0A:10 a=Ux0RRTDBqMIA:10 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=SwN5TLA9AAAA:8 a=MUqL7Y-3zpsA:10 a=cxfP7VNbAAAA:8 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=a6KihzuV5J5Mpt9QNbgA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=J0aUVQLP0FIA:10 a=m3MdUl94G8cA:10 a=PrzH1Fi9JD4A:10 a=anyYG9rjTBM1sAjEBQ8Cew==:117 Received: from adsl-69-108-12-192.dsl.scrm01.pacbell.net ([69.108.12.192] helo=sportscarsltd) by bosauthsmtp11.eigbox.net with esmtpa (Exim) id 1Tsd04-0001cT-CZ; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 12:30:08 -0500 From: "Michael Singleton" To: , "'Duvall Video Productions'" References: <50EB1C62.3050600@ktc.com> Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2013 09:30:03 -0800 Thread-Index: AQIsfCPJvbbQipm9M9Hv5AaRk9TsqQFVsYqol3fliBA= Content-Language: en-us Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net It has been interesting to see all the various theories on nut and bolt tightening. However, in all cases it is advisable to consult the factory service manual first. In the MGTD/F Workshop Manual under "Torque Spanner Data," which should provide an indication that the factory did, in fact, believe in torque wrenches, The listed torque value for both Connecting rod big-end bolts, as well as Main bearing cap nuts, the values are listed as "320 lbs. in. (to the next split pin hole) and 750 lbs. in. (to the next split pin hole)" respectively. I realize that Mike is referring to a MPJG engine, not a XPEG or XPAG engine and might not have the proper documentation on it, but the general thinking from the factory did not change much until significantly after the war, when they discovered the self locking nut. Additionally, it is always advisable to use the proper Loctite sealant and properly install it. Suggestions and directions on use are available on the Loctite site: http://www.loctite.com/ -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Charley & Peggy Robinson Sent: Monday, January 07, 2013 11:05 AM To: Duvall Video Productions Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question Let's keep in mind that torque specs are meant to set the fastener (bolt, stud) into the approximate middle of its elasticity range and the torque specs are given in a range too. If a torque spec is given as, say 40 - 50 ft-lbs I'll set my wrench for 45 and sneak up on it. One crenelation in a castellated nut, more or less, isn't that big a deal, IMO. CR On 1/5/2013 10:06 PM, Duvall Video Productions wrote: > Anyone use red loctite instead of mechanical fasteners on main cap nuts? I > have an MPJG engine from a TA when I torque down the mains, the holes don't > line up to the castle nuts for the wire. I don't want to over torque and if > I back them up to match the hole, I loose my torque. > > Suggestions? _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mike@sportscarslimited.net _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 8 13:04:25 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DCF144053B for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 13:04:25 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from p3plsmtpa01-10.prod.phx3.secureserver.net (p3plsmtpa01-10.prod.phx3.secureserver.net [72.167.82.90]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 986B140403 for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 13:04:19 -0700 (MST) Received: (qmail 19760 invoked from network); 8 Jan 2013 20:01:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (205.197.253.3) by p3plsmtpa01-10.prod.phx3.secureserver.net (72.167.82.90) with ESMTP; 08 Jan 2013 20:01:15 -0000 From: "Clayton Kirkwood" To: References: <50EB8EE1.5010900@comcast.net> <201301081440.r08EewRu007490@nlpi162.prodigy.net> Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2013 12:01:10 -0800 Thread-Index: Ac3trkyrwNr+lhYjTG6SCr4hlaP09wALBp9Q Content-Language: en-us Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net That's interesting. But so often the stud or bolt in similar applications gets chemically welded in - rusted. Nuts the same way. So, should the threads be coated with an anti-seize or oil, or should they be "dry"? I don't think loctite works very well with any anti seize. Clayton -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Barney Gaylord Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2013 6:41 AM To: Glenn Schnittke; mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) The answer for seating torque on the stud (any stud) is finger tight, not to exceed 5 lb-ft of torque. The recpetical is a deep threaded hole, and the stud has a shorter thread. The stud screws in until it runs out of threads on the stud, at which time the last incomplete thread on the stud will bind in the first thread on the receptacle. Applying more torque at that time will damage the top female thread, raising a burr and possibly damaging a casting. Too much torque on the stud could crack the casting. Most studs (not all) will have course thread on the bottom end and fine thread on the top end. The steeper ramp angle on the bottom thread will prevent the stud from turning while the nut is being tightened. Otherwise prevailing torque on the last incomplete thread is all that prevents the stud from turning. Binding on the incomplete thread is also all that keeps the stud from unscrewing when the nut is being removed. This is why self-locking nuts have a tendency to unscrew the stud when being removed. That also makes it difficult to back the nut off 1/4 turn if you want to re-torque it later. If you back the stud out a little in attempt to synchronize location of a cross pin hole, chances are pretty good that the stud will rotate again and end up in a non-predictable final position when tightening the nut. Barney Gaylord 1958 MGA with an attitude http://MGAguru.com At 09:13 PM 1/7/2013 -0600, Glenn Schnittke wrote: >I've been working on this same question on an XPEG. The response from >the old hands I've talked to has always been ' rearrange the nuts to >best fit and then shave the bottom of the rest on a glass plate to >fit'. > >My thought on that is 'what keeps the stud itself in place'? There's >never a torque value for bottoming the stud into the block. And there's >no mechanical device to keep the stud from backing out, so what's >keeping the whole assembly from backing out even with the cotter pin >through the castellated nut or nylock or whatever you're using on the >top side? > >It's just one of those things that has puzzled me through the years >- what keeps a stud from backing out when the nut holding whatever it >is in place has a VERY specific torque value? > >Moss's answer seems to be nylock nuts. I don't trust them. On top of >having to figure the friction value onto the eventual torque value, I'm >concerned about how the heat will affect the nylon over time. If I have >to go to a locking nut I should rather trust an aircraft nut which has >a metal-to-metal contact and I'd still have to factor in the friction >to the eventual torque value. > >I've seen all kinds of discussion on specific torque values for heads, >main caps, conrods, etc. I've found nothing in any manual or discussion >about the proper torque for bottoming a stud. I'm sure I'm going to >excite all the engineers on the list by bringing this up, but why can't >I just back off the stud just a little bit to move the cotter pin hole >to meet the castle nut? >.... >>From: Duvall Video Productions >>To:mgs@autox.team.net >>Subject: [Mgs] loctite question >>.... >> >>Anyone use red loctite instead of mechanical fasteners on main cap nuts? I >>have an MPJG engine from a TA when I torque down the mains, the holes don't >>line up to the castle nuts for the wire. I don't want to over torque and if >>I back them up to match the hole, I loose my torque. >>.... _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/crk@godblessthe.us _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 8 13:21:09 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF7864044F for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 13:21:08 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from pacmmta53.windstream.net (pacmmta53.windstream.net [162.39.147.112]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C925C403B9 for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 13:21:04 -0700 (MST) cv=Q144tqixSR1YYiEEgqcDGpPuwwbWKU3BiBZsaiVVqQQ= c=1 sm=0 a=OvIMvpSEN2sA:10 a=b8HWJsW4dBAA:10 a=We2GSUcPNccA:10 a=fOpwdquTRaQA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=zo8hvysWAAAA:8 a=VGxG94oaAAAA:8 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=Ov22w-J6AAAA:8 a=b_RzRKN6M_MoP8gcUSIA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=J0aUVQLP0FIA:10 a=m3MdUl94G8cA:10 a=gkfSzkTfGfcA:10 a=SdvNMj5PkgcA:10 a=VwY09K5NJDLMOJWr:21 a=5GQ78R6H8mgh9Y0y:21 a=Q2K8hKtRzNtQKB5fvDXRIQ==:117 Authentication-Results: pacmmta53 smtp.user=ccrobins@ktc.com; auth=pass (PLAIN) Received: from [75.91.227.235] ([75.91.227.235:56969] helo=[127.0.0.1]) by pacmmta53 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39824M)) with ESMTPA id B1/7C-16037-8FE7CE05; Tue, 08 Jan 2013 15:18:01 -0500 Date: Tue, 08 Jan 2013 14:17:45 -0600 From: Charley & Peggy Robinson Organization: Computer Helpers User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/17.0 Thunderbird/17.0 To: Barney Gaylord References: <50EB8EE1.5010900@comcast.net> <201301081440.r08EewRu007490@nlpi162.prodigy.net> Cc: Glenn Schnittke , mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Now, that's darned interesting! I have always wondered why some head studs were coarse thread on the end into the casting and fine thread for the nut. Just never bothered to look it up. Thanks for the post, CR On 1/8/2013 8:40 AM, Barney Gaylord wrote: > The answer for seating torque on the stud (any stud) is finger tight, > not to exceed 5 lb-ft of torque. > > The recpetical is a deep threaded hole, and the stud has a shorter > thread. The stud screws in until it runs out of threads on the stud, > at which time the last incomplete thread on the stud will bind in the > first thread on the receptacle. Applying more torque at that time > will damage the top female thread, raising a burr and possibly > damaging a casting. Too much torque on the stud could crack the casting. > > Most studs (not all) will have course thread on the bottom end and > fine thread on the top end. The steeper ramp angle on the bottom > thread will prevent the stud from turning while the nut is being > tightened. Otherwise prevailing torque on the last incomplete thread > is all that prevents the stud from turning. Binding on the incomplete > thread is also all that keeps the stud from unscrewing when the nut is > being removed. This is why self-locking nuts have a tendency to > unscrew the stud when being removed. That also makes it difficult to > back the nut off 1/4 turn if you want to re-torque it later. > > If you back the stud out a little in attempt to synchronize location > of a cross pin hole, chances are pretty good that the stud will rotate > again and end up in a non-predictable final position when tightening > the nut. > > Barney Gaylord > 1958 MGA with an attitude > http://MGAguru.com > > > At 09:13 PM 1/7/2013 -0600, Glenn Schnittke wrote: >> I've been working on this same question on an XPEG. The response from >> the old hands I've talked to has always been ' rearrange the nuts to >> best fit and then shave the bottom of the rest on a glass plate to >> fit'. >> >> My thought on that is 'what keeps the stud itself in place'? There's >> never a torque value for bottoming the stud into the block. And >> there's no mechanical device to keep the stud from backing out, so >> what's keeping the whole assembly from backing out even with the >> cotter pin through the castellated nut or nylock or whatever you're >> using on the top side? >> >> It's just one of those things that has puzzled me through the years - >> what keeps a stud from backing out when the nut holding whatever it >> is in place has a VERY specific torque value? >> >> Moss's answer seems to be nylock nuts. I don't trust them. On top of >> having to figure the friction value onto the eventual torque value, >> I'm concerned about how the heat will affect the nylon over time. If >> I have to go to a locking nut I should rather trust an aircraft nut >> which has a metal-to-metal contact and I'd still have to factor in >> the friction to the eventual torque value. >> >> I've seen all kinds of discussion on specific torque values for >> heads, main caps, conrods, etc. I've found nothing in any manual or >> discussion about the proper torque for bottoming a stud. I'm sure I'm >> going to excite all the engineers on the list by bringing this up, >> but why can't I just back off the stud just a little bit to move the >> cotter pin hole to meet the castle nut? >> .... > > >>> From: Duvall Video Productions >>> To:mgs@autox.team.net >>> Subject: [Mgs] loctite question >>> .... >>> >>> Anyone use red loctite instead of mechanical fasteners on main cap >>> nuts? I >>> have an MPJG engine from a TA when I torque down the mains, the >>> holes don't >>> line up to the castle nuts for the wire. I don't want to over >>> torque and if >>> I back them up to match the hole, I loose my torque. >>> .... > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/ccrobins@ktc.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 8 21:59:05 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A44D040569 for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 21:59:05 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from smtp192.iad.emailsrvr.com (smtp192.iad.emailsrvr.com [207.97.245.192]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40B294051F for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 21:58:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by smtp29.relay.iad1a.emailsrvr.com (SMTP Server) with ESMTP id B0542148497 for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 23:55:35 -0500 (EST) Received: by smtp29.relay.iad1a.emailsrvr.com (Authenticated sender: don-AT-napanet.net) with ESMTPSA id 31544148315 for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2013 23:55:35 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 08 Jan 2013 20:54:24 -0800 To: "mgs-autox.team.net" From: Don Subject: [Mgs] MGB_accessories Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net http://blog.earlymgb.com/files/6/5/4/4/0/311733-304456/MGB_accessories_196200 01.pdf A friend of mine back about 1970 or so had two Mk1 MGB roadsters. One of the cars had imitation leopard skin seat covers which my friend thought were a real plus for the car. I thought they looked very declassi, and that they must have been sourced from K-Mart. I later read somewhere that these seat covers were an option, and were a genuine BMC factory accessory. Someone at BMC must have visited India and been enamored with the look of a wildcat for seat covering and convinced management to offer these things to MG buyers as an accessory. (Thanks to BLOG.EARLYMGB.COM) ------------------------------------------------------------------ Don Scott Calistoga CA USA 1955 MGTF 1962 MGA Mk 2 1967 MGB 1963-7 MGB (seeking) Misc. Japanese cars _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 9 02:01:40 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 716C04043C for ; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 02:01:40 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-wi0-f175.google.com (mail-wi0-f175.google.com [209.85.212.175]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3388403F7 for ; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 02:01:11 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-wi0-f175.google.com with SMTP id hm11so380325wib.2 for ; Wed, 09 Jan 2013 00:58:05 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:to:references:subject:date:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority :x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=TyL+c0e8fbWiYQTJ+CO/aexWn34LNw1pSkSgAIfLjUw=; b=djLalaX7X/sew07tb4+JJ8N0Imtbq+PVs9v4LISQhPwLwh7CdzXgYzmsUtLW2KzBHr euLvFFdroQZqFeNbGz+JiDI9I6ELTdoE+kHiaMES8gwPZ5Rna3GOptn/gPGt8FC9hqSC lDoBwViPLzda1tAj+hVPAZJ960JbP+yB0INPMZaXfxNqbfZEQi+oqz9TFdcD50M6vyw2 qXMm0/WD8kj7XvvF3kDOYFJ02oGRwMX5tUnz4mlL/npCYGJkzsZ6r1Dw31YtQxTXKjYH e0YqUyJvSau6NqhllVkit4H96zz36hqZa16I28nO0cL90gaqddNjVq6qhJgZ1BI9Khew drEA== z2mr1891207wiw.23.1357721885874; Wed, 09 Jan 2013 00:58:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-1.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.97]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id t17sm3284855wiv.6.2013.01.09.00.58.05 (version=SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Wed, 09 Jan 2013 00:58:05 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" To: References: <50EB8EE1.5010900@comcast.net><201301081440.r08EewRu007490@nlpi162.prodigy.net> <019c01cdedda$e7ec9f30$b7c5dd90$@us> Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 08:38:53 -0000 Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Torque specs are usually given for oiled threads. ----- Original Message ----- > ... So, should the > threads be coated with an anti-seize or oil, or should they be "dry"? _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 9 02:07:07 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C588C40511 for ; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 02:07:07 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-we0-f170.google.com (mail-we0-f170.google.com [74.125.82.170]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B41B403F7 for ; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 02:06:51 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-we0-f170.google.com with SMTP id r1so981478wey.1 for ; Wed, 09 Jan 2013 01:03:46 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:cc:references:subject:date:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority :x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=logX9Uqae1neaWMdfKRsj3sr+PNnTRZ3dAxPuvVM6TU=; b=lORvMatpnpkJnwyEf0/Sfv5Oop9qTG7KlHcuDJ1dQv12Peg5/dxlhUOW2LUlBwH4l7 lGfcS1OZSJAvSZtisLy/h2TYRW1e/r3Swfy6YjVXEGZ2Ga3YJ+myccUVpqIAY1D4WBM6 z59LHPNCKhY1rH5zs4mhT+Q1gnRPuhq7rRXDWrbX/456njHFl+SGkbNFh2aATcoJ0X4R RcHQTovvEfiiLPrD1+HIAEaiLLx8nZ3AkmVE3C+7Ibctg9h9OTW8XDhZJC8yJBa22pm/ ZL8nkiyWqLdUQJ6viEuuFmZHTSweRWSCLi2U83ndQq2UYsHxUUBWDtm527KIwpXu6lSt 2Aag== em1mr1876077wib.20.1357721884959; Wed, 09 Jan 2013 00:58:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-1.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.97]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id t17sm3284855wiv.6.2013.01.09.00.58.03 (version=SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Wed, 09 Jan 2013 00:58:04 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" Cc: References: <50EB8EE1.5010900@comcast.net><201301081440.r08EewRu007490@nlpi162.prodigy.net> <50EC7EE9.9030105@ktc.com> Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 08:37:52 -0000 Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Coarse one end and fine the other is normally used in alloy blocks, can't see why cast iron would need a coarse thread. ----- Original Message ----- > Now, that's darned interesting! I have always wondered why some head > studs were coarse thread on the end into the casting and fine thread for > the nut. Just never bothered to look it up. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 9 05:29:12 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F27E14041E for ; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 05:29:11 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm39-vm4.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com (nm39-vm4.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com [72.30.239.148]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8048C403F7 for ; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 05:28:31 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.139.212.151] by nm39.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Jan 2013 12:25:24 -0000 Received: from [98.139.212.206] by tm8.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Jan 2013 12:25:24 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1015.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Jan 2013 12:25:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 84600 invoked by uid 60001); 9 Jan 2013 12:25:24 -0000 s=s1024; t=1357734324; bh=F/3rW4CAdxjvD2R/D610wlQf9KfZnMOCNk8nYv6d4DE=; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=Qaa2BStRFbl6nX7kXInXB/c3nzLZjfBGs91no2fNpmmImeJ87lcfsJz9Dhi5nzq9PBlk0MgSrnitnODGu/yoQQyB2ayqpyvYaQehzdGIJqKm6Z0KwuNhNEKjZfcKSjH8IxjBkyTadLJDW7TwMSf/if/ThEs+fYDAYG4+fIbop5w= s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=MbkplesOcVSyIGza/O6kDV5TLz7si62pNhrHOooV8zHEk1p0+nlgafjrGX2Y5H9GG/iLdNQ5uPfPlesBx3+RAu7ysPJnL7Gv3Hlkez05xhLp5u2ae6jtm9rWKgpM6lmvrnp23JrgMEpBP4fdLYoc1uF/82IIuvtnAyZBIrSO7AI=; 9dZEbw0vxn8KkpN_8lv3Y_0nDYvyZvFfQx1Z9ZlcWdyYZuvczU_ZMqgTUnWr sb2CNohUUnpAFUFrJs2PejME0WBeuHvhrLiI63FIMKau754RpNANYs_yVuKL gbGLXQ7noV5T1mlmzoCGS_yNNkaHEt1p_EynHt0YRrT4C16.1N4JzhG.8OHJ fo779xQIOD4EJMnF2G8Ac36fQ1kKH0.CCJs3abKHgbkL4R1xHpGNuGSrzhAP uAsZrEMYIOSp5BjDaODdjBodoKkNNNF_fDav5LqTpO8CZXxAHmrd0HXYveze fhRPtf8I4xfT6.TlW_iPMmtr4IsqhduD0q2caXDVGahWuVZX0oCdRDOFfIEZ 1zEgA5azBDRP8d6XjoJVvlpl2752m96ahbdZIfDgDnnTp3eacCGKOsmOxwMj fO13IW8WUqHBV8QHnInsDWz0cgO2oEx9YbY7Lge6ZeUE6odTNzjbYLWahuTn YNGPTVjWNMn8Q7w3c4UnHkCT7pyJFOKxpCjF0fjgDQNPqFzqF7SGv_RBG8mV CRm_lcAT.XGX0g.iFI_S57LWgwBRg042aBS2yvso_fWFd6XyV.AsVxFC2MRW 4d98Cgw-- Received: from [68.44.138.78] by web164904.mail.bf1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 09 Jan 2013 04:25:24 PST V2VsbCwgaXQgV0FTIHRoZSAnNjAncywgYWZ0ZXIgYWxsLi4uLi4KCkRhbiBECic3NiBCCic2NSBCCkNlbnRyYWwgTkogVVNBCgoKCgpfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXwogRnJvbTogRG9uIDxkb25AbmFwYW5ldC5uZXQ.ClRvOiBtZ3MtYXV0b3gudGVhbS5uZXQgPG1nc0BhdXRveC50ZWFtLm5ldD4gClNlbnQ6IFR1ZXNkYXksIEphbnVhcnkgOCwgMjAxMyAxMTo1NCBQTQpTdWJqZWN0OiBbTWdzXSBNR0JfYWNjZXNzb3JpZXMKIApodHRwOi8vYmxvZy5lYXJseW1nYi5jb20vZmlsZXMvNi8BMAEBAQE- References: Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 04:25:24 -0800 (PST) From: Dan DiBiase To: Don , "mgs-autox.team.net" Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGB_accessories Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Well, it WAS the '60's, after all..... Dan D '76 B '65 B Central NJ USA ________________________________ From: Don To: mgs-autox.team.net Sent: Tuesday, January 8, 2013 11:54 PM Subject: [Mgs] MGB_accessories http://blog.earlymgb.com/files/6/5/4/4/0/311733-304456/MGB_accessories_196200 01.pdf A friend of mine back about 1970 or so had two Mk1 MGB roadsters. One of the cars had imitation leopard skin seat covers which my friend thought were a real plus for the car. I thought they looked very declassi, and that they must have been sourced from K-Mart. I later read somewhere that these seat covers were an option, and were a genuine BMC factory accessory. Someone at BMC must have visited India and been enamored with the look of a wildcat for seat covering and convinced management to offer these things to MG buyers as an accessory. (Thanks to BLOG.EARLYMGB.COM) ------------------------------------------------------------------ Don Scott Calistoga CA USA 1955 MGTF 1962 MGA Mk 2 1967 MGB 1963-7 MGB (seeking) Misc. Japanese cars _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Suggested annual donation $12.75 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/d_dibiase@yahoo.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 9 06:18:27 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50BB7403F7 for ; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 06:18:27 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nlpi176.prodigy.net (nlpi176.sbcis.sbc.com [207.115.36.48]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BFF0403F7 for ; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 06:17:44 -0700 (MST) Received: from barney-gaylord.mgaguru.com (adsl-75-57-169-70.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net [75.57.169.70]) (authenticated bits=0) by nlpi176.prodigy.net (8.14.4 smptauth/8.14.4) with ESMTP id r09DEbik011429; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 07:14:38 -0600 Date: Wed, 09 Jan 2013 07:14:34 -0600 To: "PaulHunt73" From: Barney Gaylord References: <50EB8EE1.5010900@comcast.net> <201301081440.r08EewRu007490@nlpi162.prodigy.net> <50EC7EE9.9030105@ktc.com> Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Want more confusion? Head studs (in the block) have coarse threads. Manifold studs (in side of the head) have fine threads. Water valve studs (in side of the head) have fine threads. Thernostat studs (in top of the head) have coarse threads. In the gearbox, bolts for the remote shift extension housing to tail housing joint may be either coarse or fine thread depending on time of produvtion of the gearbox (and that's an aluminum housing going either way). At 08:37 AM 1/9/2013 +0000, PaulHunt73 wrote: >Coarse one end and fine the other is normally used in alloy blocks, >can't see why cast iron would need a coarse thread. >.... _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 9 08:31:51 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3458340403 for ; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 08:31:51 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from m1plsmtpa01-01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (m1plsmtpa01-01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.173]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 907D5403BA for ; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 08:31:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from aragorn ([205.197.253.3]) by m1plsmtpa01-01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net with id lrTq1k00L05A0oD01rTrNH; Wed, 09 Jan 2013 08:27:52 -0700 From: "Clayton Kirkwood" To: References: <50EB8EE1.5010900@comcast.net><201301081440.r08EewRu007490@nlpi162.prodigy.net> <019c01cdedda$e7ec9f30$b7c5dd90$@us> <51323D4C05034D909C6D06B81AD41410@paul> Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 07:27:41 -0800 Thread-Index: Ac3uR4JQphyVcSZzQ6C8A84JniLcawANiUqA Content-Language: en-us Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net But can oiled threads be locked with loctite. Clayton -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of PaulHunt73 Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2013 12:39 AM To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) Torque specs are usually given for oiled threads. ----- Original Message ----- > ... So, should the > threads be coated with an anti-seize or oil, or should they be "dry"? _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/crk@godblessthe.us _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 9 08:44:49 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E14214041E for ; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 08:44:48 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from relay03.pair.com (relay03.pair.com [209.68.5.17]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 8E7ED403BA for ; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 08:44:32 -0700 (MST) Received: (qmail 20057 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2013 15:41:24 -0000 Received: from 97.96.111.81 (HELO mullet) (97.96.111.81) by relay03.pair.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2013 15:41:24 -0000 From: "Stephen West-Fisher" To: References: <50EB8EE1.5010900@comcast.net><201301081440.r08EewRu007490@nlpi162.prodigy.net> <019c01cdedda$e7ec9f30$b7c5dd90$@us> <51323D4C05034D909C6D06B81AD41410@paul> <004201cdee7d$de670ab0$9b352010$@us> Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 10:41:00 -0500 Thread-Index: Ac3uR4JQphyVcSZzQ6C8A84JniLcawANiUqAAABdvpA= Content-Language: en-us Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I'm not sure of the original premise, my experience is that torque specs are given as dry clean threads unless stated otherwise. The addition of Loctite or lubricant requires a reduction in torque or the fastener will be over-stressed. -- Stephen West-Fisher N4IK -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Clayton Kirkwood Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2013 10:28 AM To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) But can oiled threads be locked with loctite. Clayton -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of PaulHunt73 Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2013 12:39 AM To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) Torque specs are usually given for oiled threads. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 9 09:32:41 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58DBD4043C for ; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 09:32:41 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-bk0-f42.google.com (mail-bk0-f42.google.com [209.85.214.42]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0DEAE403CF for ; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 09:32:09 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-bk0-f42.google.com with SMTP id ji2so1041061bkc.1 for ; Wed, 09 Jan 2013 08:29:02 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=uMudeaVq7R9pKq78//W1ZDkT0fRWnsaQtRJQlWf5SLI=; b=Qc68DMNnSU6/6YEXlcK/lel62pzE+BqNA3dz2cmavrweZQ7MNaUlKo7awtmpvZx1Ii 9wfN5CLGimfdaLhvMTjaAQq2GKQ5iQOkMEbju/NZdOlQGYSNxxwjfRjhWG6sF+EfJ/Oe cuIJdfGNFtuhqXT3kNqNGpecJcyFLqYf5yOJxKGaB4ldvVpbGSJ6YXsRpZfj8OT0P3gO iTjoqbSaS9BDJrgNjKBnqTmRYd96Tbp7APDT5j12AoxB3+J71gVIIJGLomernVO0k7KS 89AVxwRYxDaZmXHn5hX0ZptKW7CjmP2yt/scwJ9O0UHFG3pRELzEJRM6qWdCaZViwgUh DaUQ== Received: by 10.204.146.92 with SMTP id g28mr33256952bkv.127.1357748942448; Wed, 09 Jan 2013 08:29:02 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.204.78.139 with HTTP; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 08:29:02 -0800 (PST) References: <50EB8EE1.5010900@comcast.net> <201301081440.r08EewRu007490@nlpi162.prodigy.net> <019c01cdedda$e7ec9f30$b7c5dd90$@us> <51323D4C05034D909C6D06B81AD41410@paul> <004201cdee7d$de670ab0$9b352010$@us> Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 08:29:02 -0800 From: Richard Ewald To: Clayton Kirkwood Cc: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net No, loctite is a glue. Glue won't stick if there is oil present. On Wed, Jan 9, 2013 at 7:27 AM, Clayton Kirkwood wrote: > But can oiled threads be locked with loctite. > > Clayton > > -----Original Message----- > From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On > Behalf Of PaulHunt73 > Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2013 12:39 AM > To: mgs@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) > > Torque specs are usually given for oiled threads. > > ----- Original Message ----- > > ... So, should the > > threads be coated with an anti-seize or oil, or should they be "dry"? > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/crk@godblessthe.us > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/richard.ewald@gmail.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 9 09:43:54 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51AE540413 for ; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 09:43:54 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-oa0-f43.google.com (mail-oa0-f43.google.com [209.85.219.43]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A101403BA for ; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 09:43:50 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-oa0-f43.google.com with SMTP id k1so1205462oag.16 for ; Wed, 09 Jan 2013 08:40:43 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type :x-gm-message-state; bh=iS5YjKW0zeeL4H9ycH0M+o4myMGQlB6GsDpWssNs7S0=; b=abiNVzDrirK01xmOJosj/6Bd2y14u8lE8Q6fdCgJ1m8ZRjhjIwwTtv5ujq+qcaqTU6 1IvQNR+1pSnwVVmTh/qVXMaAGeDqpZpWML5u1uNMvF9/7wQVaKhnX4bnUE9ZKZrgUopi 4HCbsffgjUN42q4m2jGWGnaRzzccHPbqN+UWR0fSZGfUU4ghBwZjZJHJxicUxjY1/k9+ ice5nsnUONufgtpyuY+TgChf5D1xTMS47ssc1rIDwOBHDov7ThI1iwZ2JTm7HTojJ25n OjV+ve4eM/BSOPpzAgFI1hRGbvc4an8OYWT6yZjK7jUgPxAL8zGvm0uBlDT6nduabaiF h1gQ== Received: by 10.60.29.66 with SMTP id i2mr38830409oeh.2.1357749643414; Wed, 09 Jan 2013 08:40:43 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.60.58.202 with HTTP; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 08:40:43 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 09:40:43 -0700 From: PHIL BATES To: barneymg@mgaguru.com, Mga List Subject: [Mgs] Moss MGA/MGB Laygear upgrade Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Barney, I have an MGA gearbox I need to rebuild. Basically, just bearings, thrust washers, 1st gear etc. I wondered if you have (or know of anyone that has) experience with the Moss upgrade kit that includes a new laygear with new needle bearings (the loose bearing style), spacers to keep the bearings in place, and dummy shaft?? I read most if not all of your layshaft improvement page and the info on the improvements. It appears the Moss kit takes care of that, although it also contains a layshaft....which may or may not be needed (you say they are very hard wearing). Phil Bates _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 9 09:45:39 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9507640420 for ; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 09:45:39 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm8.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com (nm8.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com [98.139.44.135]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 565B1403BA for ; Wed, 9 Jan 2013 09:45:34 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.139.44.97] by nm8.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Jan 2013 16:42:27 -0000 Received: from [67.195.22.119] by tm2.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Jan 2013 16:42:27 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp114.sbc.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Jan 2013 16:42:27 -0000 zESDo5qy55XrLaoiPtdEKyof3ko7sgAzTFsiIwfYv1bjmC_7V74UZR4aiIyv qAzUkXGE0prJ30DOcnEOs.G8cq5cLAKd.U7jTe1q_3RBsXo7cLC56m0CC.iq DnWcC7LEo0Na88.2yEQ2ITxzwnS4rCqTJ.vdg.G8jjjga8FAJsY20YsMOcHS JFh78okDwVbyJ6IKOItNtUxHqvqjlCmVQRnVlmkdCPkA83q__8qaXupzRDFX KJAzKyuZW1UbIv8qwxrI4kve_r.x4qJa9Rc7vHzs00ywoKE4NsnRqGDK0ogA Z_aigz6Z55yyodPaoAfw_kiqCRvZRrQrQMbr1GNewRGCa.9W4bpOEItogrA0 CKUCnmaO75XcCAIrVkjYFwQ_F5ICy12VYgUVqTq7VANGV9aCSV92t3ghMYMT 5NCkDOyH7ZH970WLk0dTmTNeWC8N5XpjM0GegMYVa9cxPrIFXwdRn9DKZrWo RXdwecAHEF19oPqZra6RaGls.6DhUoV9O9bZY3U83EcNjkOixOeAZ6XvQCXx H3jTxZOM1U0fWFrB3E2cukmTIJZBTUBFQkms- Received: from [10.0.1.8] (mike@70.226.193.217 with plain) by smtp114.sbc.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 09 Jan 2013 08:42:27 -0800 PST From: Duvall Video Productions Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 10:42:25 -0600 References: To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 9 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Clayton, There is a lot of good info here... it doesn't act as a chemical bonding agent but it fills in gaps. You have to clean the threads to get the results. http://useloctite.com/filephotos/documents/LT4985TLCapabilityGd.pdf > > 1. Re: loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) > (Clayton Kirkwood) > > From: "Clayton Kirkwood" > To: > Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) > Message-ID: <019c01cdedda$e7ec9f30$b7c5dd90$@us> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > That's interesting. But so often the stud or bolt in similar applications > gets chemically welded in - rusted. Nuts the same way. So, should the > threads be coated with an anti-seize or oil, or should they be "dry"? I > don't think loctite works very well with any anti seize. > > Clayton _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 12:07:45 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB7384044B for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:07:45 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from vms173011pub.verizon.net (vms173011pub.verizon.net [206.46.173.11]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0CE3D40067 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:07:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from frankdcczr6l6k ([unknown] [100.40.18.211]) by vms173011.mailsrvcs.net (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7u2-7.02 32bit (built Apr 16 2009)) with ESMTPA id <0MGF00M8WBN3WV30@vms173011.mailsrvcs.net> for mgs@autox.team.net; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 13:04:16 -0600 (CST) From: To: "MG List" Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 14:04:27 -0500 Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Has anyone found a source for ZDDP that is reasonable? I checked MOss and the shipping is 50% of the cost of the ZDDP. My local NAPA store has never heard of it. Frank Krajewski _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 12:18:15 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB4F540419 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:18:14 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from relay02.pair.com (relay02.pair.com [209.68.5.16]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id AB4E340067 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:17:05 -0700 (MST) Received: (qmail 57784 invoked from network); 10 Jan 2013 19:13:52 -0000 Received: from 97.96.111.81 (HELO mullet) (97.96.111.81) by relay02.pair.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2013 19:13:52 -0000 From: "Stephen West-Fisher" To: "'MG List'" References: <6CC07A1ABB0247669C78EB570549AF7F@frankdcczr6l6k> Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 14:12:41 -0500 Thread-Index: Ac3vZVwgbq25QMwlQFC2a41hbKmBxwAANReg Content-Language: en-us Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net At the risk of another war- Just buy a good quality oil and forget about the ZDDP. Current oils have levels about the same as late 50s, early 60s oils. -- Stephen West-Fisher N4IK -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of frankk12@verizon.net Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2013 2:04 PM To: MG List Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP Has anyone found a source for ZDDP that is reasonable? I checked MOss and the shipping is 50% of the cost of the ZDDP. My local NAPA store has never heard of it. Frank Krajewski _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 12:22:33 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B41EE4040C for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:22:33 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16D1A40329 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:22:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-182.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.182]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0AJJA6u030577 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 11:19:11 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 11:19:05 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] ZDDP Thread-Index: Ac3vZ1rwSid4ZfdbSkSRx4MCBAUqiQ== Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mobil 1 Synthetic in the 15W-50 weight ONLY contains 1200ppm of phosphorus and 1300ppm of zinc ("recommended for racing and flat tappet applications"). I switched to this oil for my vintage cars once I discovered this fact. It's expensive ($8+/qt), but probably less expensive (and certainly less hassle) than dealing with additives. on 1/10/13 11:04 AM, frankk12@verizon.net at frankk12@verizon.net wrote: > Has anyone found a source for ZDDP that is reasonable? I checked MOss and the > shipping is 50% of the cost of the ZDDP. My local NAPA store has never heard > of it. > Frank Krajewski > -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 12:25:27 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 059AC40533 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:25:27 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from vms173001pub.verizon.net (vms173001pub.verizon.net [206.46.173.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1BCC140417 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:25:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from frankdcczr6l6k ([unknown] [100.40.18.211]) by vms173001.mailsrvcs.net (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7u2-7.02 32bit (built Apr 16 2009)) with ESMTPA id <0MGF00KNXCGCH330@vms173001.mailsrvcs.net> for mgs@autox.team.net; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 13:21:50 -0600 (CST) From: To: "MG List" , "Max Heim" References: Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 14:22:02 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Max: I have never used synthetics and wonder about the wisdom of switching when my engines have so many miles on them. I have heard stories of seals leaking after such a switch. Frank ----- Original Message ----- From: "Max Heim" To: "MG List" Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2013 2:19 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP > Mobil 1 Synthetic in the 15W-50 weight ONLY contains 1200ppm of phosphorus > and 1300ppm of zinc ("recommended for racing and flat tappet > applications"). > I switched to this oil for my vintage cars once I discovered this fact. > It's > expensive ($8+/qt), but probably less expensive (and certainly less > hassle) > than dealing with additives. > > > > on 1/10/13 11:04 AM, frankk12@verizon.net at frankk12@verizon.net wrote: > >> Has anyone found a source for ZDDP that is reasonable? I checked MOss >> and the >> shipping is 50% of the cost of the ZDDP. My local NAPA store has never >> heard >> of it. >> Frank Krajewski > >> > > -- > > Max Heim > '66 MGB GHN3L76149 > If you're near Menlo Park, CA, > it's the primer red one with chrome wires > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/frankk12@verizon.net _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 12:26:26 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85D5B4044F for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:26:26 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from vms173003pub.verizon.net (vms173003pub.verizon.net [206.46.173.3]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B02340417 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:26:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from frankdcczr6l6k ([unknown] [100.40.18.211]) by vms173003.mailsrvcs.net (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7u2-7.02 32bit (built Apr 16 2009)) with ESMTPA id <0MGF00IK3CIGPW10@vms173003.mailsrvcs.net> for mgs@autox.team.net; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 13:23:05 -0600 (CST) From: To: "MG List" , "Stephen West-Fisher" References: <6CC07A1ABB0247669C78EB570549AF7F@frankdcczr6l6k> <024301cdef66$76b79da0$6426d8e0$@com> Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 14:23:19 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net You are probably right about starting a war which is not my intent. I only thought someone who has used the additive might have a better source. Frank ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stephen West-Fisher" To: "'MG List'" Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2013 2:12 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP > At the risk of another war- > Just buy a good quality oil and forget about the ZDDP. Current oils have > levels about the same as late 50s, early 60s oils. > > -- > Stephen West-Fisher > N4IK > > > -----Original Message----- > From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On > Behalf Of frankk12@verizon.net > Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2013 2:04 PM > To: MG List > Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP > > Has anyone found a source for ZDDP that is reasonable? I checked MOss and > the shipping is 50% of the cost of the ZDDP. My local NAPA store has > never > heard of it. > Frank Krajewski > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/frankk12@verizon.net _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 12:43:36 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2BEC040531 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:43:36 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FC9E40324 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:43:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-182.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.182]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0AJe1Nn021952 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 11:40:09 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 11:32:45 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] ZDDP Thread-Index: Ac3vZVwgbq25QMwlQFC2a41hbKmBxwAANRegAADEzUc= Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net You may be correct about 1950s oil, but I think your conclusion is wrong. There are many reports of premature cam and lifter wear using current oils. My MGB cam wore itself down to about .25" lift, for example. Look at it from an engineering perspective: zinc and phosphorus are ingredients included specifically to protect against flat tappet cam wear. Modern oils reduce the amounts of these elements because phosphorus destroys catalytic converters, and they do not add any substitutes since they are formulated for modern engines with roller cams and are targeted for low friction/high fuel efficiency, not anti-wear characteristics. So it stands to reason that modern oils do not protect flat tappet cams as well as formulations with high zinc and phosphorus. Maybe premature cam wear was an issue in the 1950s, too, but that doesn't mean we have to live with it now. By the 1970s, at least, high ZDDP oils were commonplace. Should we go back to oil bath air filters, or leather disc shock absorbers, because they used them in the 1930s? -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 1/10/13 11:12 AM, Stephen West-Fisher at steve@coastaldatasystems.com wrote: > At the risk of another war- > Just buy a good quality oil and forget about the ZDDP. Current oils have > levels about the same as late 50s, early 60s oils. > > -- > Stephen West-Fisher > N4IK > > > -----Original Message----- > From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On > Behalf Of frankk12@verizon.net > Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2013 2:04 PM > To: MG List > Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP > > Has anyone found a source for ZDDP that is reasonable? I checked MOss and > the shipping is 50% of the cost of the ZDDP. My local NAPA store has never > heard of it. > Frank Krajewski _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 12:54:12 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 70B604052F for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:54:12 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from smtp450.redcondor.net (smtp450.redcondor.net [208.80.204.50]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 883CC40324 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:53:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from cgp.netins.net ([167.142.229.73]) by smtp450.redcondor.net ({4ad064a1-3618-4418-b4ee-963987bff397}) via TCP (outbound) with ESMTP id 20130110195022307; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 19:50:22 +0000 Received: from [208.126.78.151] (account riverside@southslope.net HELO rileyPC) by cgpf2.cgp.netins.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.13) with ESMTPA id 454579391; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 13:50:13 -0600 From: To: "Max Heim" , "MG List" References: Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 13:50:11 -0600 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Look at the material data sheet for any oil you consider. I use Brad Penn in my flat tappet motors. Google this issue and find numerous credible arguments regarding the differences between oils for modern engines and oils for the old pre cat motors. Art de armond -----Original Message----- From: Max Heim Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2013 1:32 PM To: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP You may be correct about 1950s oil, but I think your conclusion is wrong. There are many reports of premature cam and lifter wear using current oils. My MGB cam wore itself down to about .25" lift, for example. Look at it from an engineering perspective: zinc and phosphorus are ingredients included specifically to protect against flat tappet cam wear. Modern oils reduce the amounts of these elements because phosphorus destroys catalytic converters, and they do not add any substitutes since they are formulated for modern engines with roller cams and are targeted for low friction/high fuel efficiency, not anti-wear characteristics. So it stands to reason that modern oils do not protect flat tappet cams as well as formulations with high zinc and phosphorus. Maybe premature cam wear was an issue in the 1950s, too, but that doesn't mean we have to live with it now. By the 1970s, at least, high ZDDP oils were commonplace. Should we go back to oil bath air filters, or leather disc shock absorbers, because they used them in the 1930s? -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 1/10/13 11:12 AM, Stephen West-Fisher at steve@coastaldatasystems.com wrote: > At the risk of another war- > Just buy a good quality oil and forget about the ZDDP. Current oils have > levels about the same as late 50s, early 60s oils. > > -- > Stephen West-Fisher > N4IK > > > -----Original Message----- > From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On > Behalf Of frankk12@verizon.net > Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2013 2:04 PM > To: MG List > Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP > > Has anyone found a source for ZDDP that is reasonable? I checked MOss and > the shipping is 50% of the cost of the ZDDP. My local NAPA store has > never > heard of it. > Frank Krajewski _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/riverside@southslope.net ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2013.0.2805 / Virus Database: 2637/6023 - Release Date: 01/10/13 _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 13:08:19 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 007654042E for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 13:08:18 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2B924041C for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 13:08:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-182.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.182]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0AK4kwc016848 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:04:47 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:04:35 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] ZDDP Thread-Index: Ac3vbbYlKu/OBqv7WkmN84nR/PgWug== Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Maybe if your engine doesn't leak ANY oil, you might worry about it. Mine leaks plenty, and I haven't noticed any difference. -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 1/10/13 11:22 AM, frankk12@verizon.net at frankk12@verizon.net wrote: > Max: I have never used synthetics and wonder about the wisdom of switching > when my engines have so many miles on them. I have heard stories of seals > leaking after such a switch. > Frank > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Max Heim" > To: "MG List" > Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2013 2:19 PM > Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP > > >> Mobil 1 Synthetic in the 15W-50 weight ONLY contains 1200ppm of phosphorus >> and 1300ppm of zinc ("recommended for racing and flat tappet >> applications"). >> I switched to this oil for my vintage cars once I discovered this fact. >> It's >> expensive ($8+/qt), but probably less expensive (and certainly less >> hassle) >> than dealing with additives. >> >> >> >> on 1/10/13 11:04 AM, frankk12@verizon.net at frankk12@verizon.net wrote: >> >>> Has anyone found a source for ZDDP that is reasonable? I checked MOss >>> and the >>> shipping is 50% of the cost of the ZDDP. My local NAPA store has never >>> heard >>> of it. >>> Frank Krajewski >> >>> >> >> -- >> >> Max Heim >> '66 MGB GHN3L76149 >> If you're near Menlo Park, CA, >> it's the primer red one with chrome wires _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 13:30:01 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75D4440451 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 13:30:01 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ia0-f176.google.com (mail-ia0-f176.google.com [209.85.210.176]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED1F74041C for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 13:29:45 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-ia0-f176.google.com with SMTP id y26so903316iab.21 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:26:32 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:x-received:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=aJgSkrOVEGXNE7WMcb76YcTlgk0LfFfmQAn1+g2VBC8=; b=KzhTNpQks0FOqj6O55tIlwwuAolokjK790D0y8ov7rzSSE4lFeMtE2jLG2o5F4gFvN Cd7p4Gzj9GBxWbUw7/WXErorQfvntqW9dZKjShOO6g4HSFQJLrzxO8cj1I5+pH8Lo15U X59kRuha4Y4+NTaDMnyDVc8uzLH+gIM5evRF79GpiKSYyhB8gx27PHfDM/vlHnFei1H1 Sl2IyZR/EvhPLdgpvb7f/pYvtoSyUofJJ5tN4kyua5vHk4PfOkynNiQnRecFK9voCo2r Zn3M5NhcaWW2n6MBFdWOiA6GkhAfHb3k3632ctgAloItQ3hNO/0JBB3uYQQjOLu0M2SN z90w== cf8mr7068007igb.20.1357849592264; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:26:32 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.64.77.33 with HTTP; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:26:32 -0800 (PST) References: Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:26:32 -0800 From: Simon Matthews To: frankk12@verizon.net Cc: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net On Thu, Jan 10, 2013 at 11:22 AM, wrote: > Max: I have never used synthetics and wonder about the wisdom of switching > when my engines have so many miles on them. I have heard stories of seals > leaking after such a switch. I think that the leaking issues was a problem with early synthetics. Not a problem now. Amsoil sells oils with a "high zinc formulationto prevent wear on flat-tappet camshafts". I don't know how "high" it is. Simon > Frank > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Max Heim" > To: "MG List" > Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2013 2:19 PM > Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP > > >> Mobil 1 Synthetic in the 15W-50 weight ONLY contains 1200ppm of phosphorus >> and 1300ppm of zinc ("recommended for racing and flat tappet >> applications"). >> I switched to this oil for my vintage cars once I discovered this fact. >> It's >> expensive ($8+/qt), but probably less expensive (and certainly less >> hassle) >> than dealing with additives. >> >> >> >> on 1/10/13 11:04 AM, frankk12@verizon.net at frankk12@verizon.net wrote: >> >>> Has anyone found a source for ZDDP that is reasonable? I checked MOss >>> and the >>> shipping is 50% of the cost of the ZDDP. My local NAPA store has never >>> heard >>> of it. >>> Frank Krajewski >> >> >>> >> >> -- >> >> Max Heim >> '66 MGB GHN3L76149 >> If you're near Menlo Park, CA, >> it's the primer red one with chrome wires >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Mgs@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.75 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/frankk12@verizon.net > > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/simon.d.matthews@gmail.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 15:24:37 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 489E940441 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 15:24:37 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from qmta01.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net (qmta01.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net [76.96.30.16]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23B1840419 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 15:24:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from omta20.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.30.87]) by qmta01.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net with comcast id mEV21k0021smiN4A1NM09g; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 22:21:00 +0000 Received: from stargate ([67.167.187.93]) by omta20.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net with comcast id mNLy1k00T21LTYK8gNLzJk; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 22:20:59 +0000 From: "gordies garage" To: "MG list" References: Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 17:21:20 -0500 s=q20121106; t=1357856460; bh=YJ/9ww2YRInStB9U5JaK+6zShD+R8G6Eh6t1Wvf0CJw=; h=Received:Received:Message-ID:Reply-To:From:To:Subject:Date: MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=dK+2lV2rtA8iGBWKgMcaRk4LlpgwjDlBPX1JI408ye+tKXqEymOgScTQey1ekAuUk ugRFT/ru9EbET7d0BejBvGe0eMVt7PRbbZM4rPrGh6toNY2PkYVYfrotQtOflwTLQQ g/6W6x1rpyaQ3kw1bnjjFHIFyBljijUALmE7Jyo0VspSdsUGoxD2tvghjycAdgY1UG VkiX/bDPGM7lx23R03/9dXcMbExPuSCYVrIxDn7byPsmiuI2h6CCDhmLQivipGmS/x Yju8F8CC0jC1/bTYzXauMw9sIPzNy3DJYDvFl4xKbsqF4nWjKXZg2t7veNICtYUPPP dU8B6JMK4awVg== Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net There seems to be plenty of evidence of excessive cam wear all over the net. I first heard of it in, maybe, 2004 or so. A few years ago I was using Shell Rotella, a diesel oil, for higher ZDDP, but they have since changed their formulation. I switched to synthetic after the Rotella went away and have not experienced any problems... yet. By then, the engine will need a rebuild anyway. I believe that Little British Car Co. has an additive and possibly even a specialty classic car oil available. IMO, switching to full synthetic at anytime is about the single best thing you can do to prolong life. Gordie Bird '62 MGA couple of old Audis > On Thu, Jan 10, 2013 at 11:22 AM, wrote: >> Max: I have never used synthetics and wonder about the wisdom of switching >> when my engines have so many miles on them. I have heard stories of seals >> leaking after such a switch. > > > > I think that the leaking issues was a problem with early synthetics. > Not a problem now. > > Amsoil sells oils with a "high zinc formulationto prevent wear on > flat-tappet camshafts". I don't know how "high" it is. > > Simon > >> Frank >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Max Heim" >> To: "MG List" >> Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2013 2:19 PM >> Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP >> >> >>> Mobil 1 Synthetic in the 15W-50 weight ONLY contains 1200ppm of phosphorus >>> and 1300ppm of zinc ("recommended for racing and flat tappet >>> applications"). >>> I switched to this oil for my vintage cars once I discovered this fact. >>> It's >>> expensive ($8+/qt), but probably less expensive (and certainly less >>> hassle) >>> than dealing with additives. >>> >>> >>> >>> on 1/10/13 11:04 AM, frankk12@verizon.net at frankk12@verizon.net wrote: >>> >>>> Has anyone found a source for ZDDP that is reasonable? I checked MOss >>>> and the >>>> shipping is 50% of the cost of the ZDDP. My local NAPA store has never >>>> heard >>>> of it. >>>> Frank Krajewski >>> >>> >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> Max Heim >>> '66 MGB GHN3L76149 >>> If you're near Menlo Park, CA, >>> it's the primer red one with chrome wires >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> Mgs@autox.team.net >>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> Suggested annual donation $12.75 >>> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >>> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >>> Unsubscribe: >>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/frankk12@verizon.net >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Mgs@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.75 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/simon.d.matthews@gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mg_garage@comcast.net _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 15:53:27 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F0E44041C for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 15:53:27 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from gamma.look.ca (gamma.look.ca [216.66.192.4]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 504C840416 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 15:53:11 -0700 (MST) Received: from e120-pool-d89a5a09.brdbnd.telnetcommunications.com ([216.154.90.9] helo=tower.look.ca) by gamma.look.ca with esmtpa (user vectis@look.ca)(Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1TtQwc-00064p-El; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 17:49:54 -0500 Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 17:06:26 -0500 To: "Stephen West-Fisher" , "'MG List'" From: Barrie Robinson References: <6CC07A1ABB0247669C78EB570549AF7F@frankdcczr6l6k> <024301cdef66$76b79da0$6426d8e0$@com> Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I did a test for Shell and it showed that ZDDP was not needed .....................unless you were at full bore for days....and even with ZDDP that would wear things !! At 02:12 PM 1/10/2013 -0500, Stephen West-Fisher wrote: >At the risk of another war- >Just buy a good quality oil and forget about the ZDDP. Current oils have >levels about the same as late 50s, early 60s oils. > >-- >Stephen West-Fisher >N4IK > > >-----Original Message----- >From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On >Behalf Of frankk12@verizon.net >Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2013 2:04 PM >To: MG List >Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP > >Has anyone found a source for ZDDP that is reasonable? I checked MOss and >the shipping is 50% of the cost of the ZDDP. My local NAPA store has never >heard of it. >Frank Krajewski >_______________________________________________ > >Mgs@autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Suggested annual donation $12.75 >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/barrie@look.ca Regards Barrie barrie@look.ca 705-721-9060 _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 16:11:31 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA70440431 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 16:11:31 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.4.199]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B41894041C for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 16:11:11 -0700 (MST) Received: from GATEWAY (ool-18beb3a2.dyn.optonline.net [24.190.179.162]) by mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-8.04 (built Feb 28 2007)) with ESMTP id <0MGF00H0CMXA1AL0@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for mgs@autox.team.net; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 18:07:58 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 18:07:57 -0500 From: John Di Fede To: mgs@autox.team.net Thread-index: Ac3vgN8DAJs1F4bPROm9ID6gxmSjHgABfw5A References: Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I use Shell Rotella oil. Originally designed for diesel engines it has increased levels of ZDDP. It is available in gallon containers in your local auto store or at Wal-Mart. John DiFede 1973 MGB *** _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 16:59:36 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C024F40425 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 16:59:36 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from p3plsmtpa08-06.prod.phx3.secureserver.net (p3plsmtpa08-06.prod.phx3.secureserver.net [173.201.193.107]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1FEB740067 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 16:59:15 -0700 (MST) Received: from Datsun ([76.184.166.234]) by p3plsmtpa08-06.prod.phx3.secureserver.net with id mPw01k00853lu5001Pw168; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 16:56:01 -0700 From: "Dave" To: "MG List" References: <6CC07A1ABB0247669C78EB570549AF7F@frankdcczr6l6k> Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 17:53:02 -0600 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I believe that valvoline racing oil has zddp. -----Original Message----- From: frankk12@verizon.net Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2013 1:04 PM To: MG List Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP Has anyone found a source for ZDDP that is reasonable? I checked MOss and the shipping is 50% of the cost of the ZDDP. My local NAPA store has never heard of it. Frank Krajewski _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 17:19:07 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 714D940453 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 17:19:07 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7FCFB4041C for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 17:18:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-182.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.182]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0B0FVkd016895 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 16:15:33 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 16:13:38 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] ZDDP Thread-Index: Ac3vZ1rwSid4ZfdbSkSRx4MCBAUqiQAKSXvp Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net The reason I recommended this specific oil is because I have a spec sheet listing the zinc and phosphorus content of all Mobil 1 grades. I am not relying on hearsay. If you are interested, Here is a link to the document: http://www.markheim.net/files/Mobil_1_Product_Guide.pdf You can also find it by Googling the document title, but I couldn't copy-and-paste that link. -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 1/10/13 11:19 AM, Max Heim at mvheim@sonic.net wrote: > Mobil 1 Synthetic in the 15W-50 weight ONLY contains 1200ppm of phosphorus > and 1300ppm of zinc ("recommended for racing and flat tappet applications"). > I switched to this oil for my vintage cars once I discovered this fact. It's > expensive ($8+/qt), but probably less expensive (and certainly less hassle) > than dealing with additives. > > > > on 1/10/13 11:04 AM, frankk12@verizon.net at frankk12@verizon.net wrote: > >> Has anyone found a source for ZDDP that is reasonable? I checked MOss and >> the >> shipping is 50% of the cost of the ZDDP. My local NAPA store has never heard >> of it. >> Frank Krajewski > >> > > -- > > Max Heim > '66 MGB GHN3L76149 > If you're near Menlo Park, CA, > it's the primer red one with chrome wires _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 17:19:24 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C7CC4044E for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 17:19:24 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA28D40425 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 17:18:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-182.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.182]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0B0FVke016895 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Thu, 10 Jan 2013 16:15:33 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 16:14:54 -0800 From: Max Heim To: Dave , MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] ZDDP Thread-Index: Ac3vkK4rpUb1agNlIEaPJl6sWcWnVA== Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net But you will find that racing oil is not recommended for day-to-day use. I have used it for break-in, and for track day. on 1/10/13 3:53 PM, Dave at dave@ranteer.com wrote: > I believe that valvoline racing oil has zddp. > > -----Original Message----- > From: frankk12@verizon.net > Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2013 1:04 PM > To: MG List > Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP > > Has anyone found a source for ZDDP that is reasonable? I checked MOss and > the > shipping is 50% of the cost of the ZDDP. My local NAPA store has never > heard > of it. > Frank Krajewski -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 18:29:08 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C43CA4044E for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 18:29:08 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm22.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com (nm22.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com [98.139.44.149]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5034240356 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 18:28:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.139.44.107] by nm22.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2013 01:25:34 -0000 Received: from [67.195.14.109] by tm12.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2013 01:25:34 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp106.sbc.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2013 01:25:34 -0000 PVic8Dav5lMURrLBB0U4rOhHrqIqwqQ4lMw9MuUmgMLF_c.GpT3_pzctzy1b 292ehDFha5GXIcIiGs6.mu4xZBKKSYOxLGY6yJQpP3W4XVwgm05q69mvuaIp Ryxiw5qbr6uzTYjfaC6xDc.alNHIeUq66id3Cq1b181bhNZBWrqa0_UM7LLk DQKxCnB8qLgeXoMjPJB1ArffWH0t9HPNCtN67wuABUy08cC3z0.uxLAdR1KS QyYK4Q5kF1V51RivuiH6jBtQi.3.YTkWpNIgRB3xvwIvkAYcKMsptlqRdmc8 yKz_FpfASr9obfTmynjTxeEAuFOCAro4VrRSu9IV.DylQ7_WuGDqXcjbDJUT 5bFqVRE23T6_YJLSjNmL59.sbIOxEtVtrfj9VB0w.dyFzrGsEZv6d_NHK2H8 vuzgE6Yz6jbSpuI6ZFuFae31x Received: from [10.0.1.8] (mike@70.226.193.217 with plain) by smtp106.sbc.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2013 17:25:34 -0800 PST From: Duvall Video Productions Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 19:25:32 -0600 References: To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP scam? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Marketers will sell you anything they think you will buy..... break in an engine to harden cam and tappets with break in oil and forget it..... A couple of GM engineers wrote this peer reviewed paper _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 18:56:09 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 37DE640516 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 18:56:09 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA8694042D for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 18:55:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-182.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.182]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0B1qWac018799 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 17:52:34 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 17:46:01 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] ZDDP scam? Thread-Index: Ac3vnWjBfnuVOJpH/U6kk5Btv3FjGw== Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP scam? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net How was it a "scam" when all motor oil produced over a period of a decade or two included ZDDP as an antiwear additive, as a matter of course, without any particular advertising or marketing emphasis? It was like lead in gas -- everyone did it because it worked, and because if they didn't, their product would not perform as well as the competition. The "scam" is that the manufacturers unilaterally removed it (for good reasons, in terms of modern pollution-controlled vehicles, but still...), without issuing any disclaimers for users of older vehicles, until they started receiving complaints. Only now are manufacturers releasing information about the Z and P levels, and it's because of the outcry. But no one is forcing you to pay any attention to the issue -- run those new low-viscosity, zero-zinc oils if you want to. -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 1/10/13 5:25 PM, Duvall Video Productions at mike@duvallvideo.com wrote: > Marketers will sell you anything they think you will buy..... break in an > engine to harden cam and tappets with break in oil and forget it..... > > A couple of GM engineers wrote this peer reviewed paper _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 19:49:55 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A0E04044E for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 19:49:55 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from admin.nni.com (admin.nni.com [216.107.0.100]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D850940426 for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 19:49:48 -0700 (MST) Received: from [24.91.61.211] (account eugeneb@nni.com) by admin.nni.com (CommuniGate Pro WebUser 4.1.8) with HTTP id 477893169; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 21:45:48 -0500 From: "Eugene Balinski" To: Max Heim ,MG List Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 21:45:48 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Valvoline VR-1 racing oil in 20W50 supposedly has the ZDDP required. I get mine at my local NAPA. Be aware - there is a track and a road version. You want the road version. Meets all of other automotive requirements for additives and detergents, etc http://www.valvoline.com/products/brands/racing/racing-motor-oil/6 Safety Fast! Gene 80 B On Thu, 10 Jan 2013 11:19:05 -0800 Max Heim wrote: > Mobil 1 Synthetic in the 15W-50 weight ONLY contains > 1200ppm of phosphorus > and 1300ppm of zinc ("recommended for racing and flat > tappet applications"). > I switched to this oil for my vintage cars once I > discovered this fact. It's > expensive ($8+/qt), but probably less expensive (and > certainly less hassle) > than dealing with additives. > > > > on 1/10/13 11:04 AM, frankk12@verizon.net at > frankk12@verizon.net wrote: > > > Has anyone found a source for ZDDP that is reasonable? > I checked MOss and the > > shipping is 50% of the cost of the ZDDP. My local NAPA > store has never heard > > of it. > > Frank Krajewski > > > > > -- > > Max Heim > '66 MGB GHN3L76149 > If you're near Menlo Park, CA, > it's the primer red one with chrome wires > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/eugeneb@nni.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider. http://www.nni.com/ _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 10 21:20:06 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A7F04044E for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 21:20:06 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from m1plsmtpa01-03.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (m1plsmtpa01-03.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.4]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 421FB4042D for ; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 21:19:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from Datsun ([76.184.166.234]) by m1plsmtpa01-03.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net with id mUGS1k00153lu5001UGTfR; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 21:16:27 -0700 From: "Dave" To: "MG List" References: Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 22:08:47 -0600 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I use that too -----Original Message----- From: Eugene Balinski Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2013 8:45 PM To: Max Heim ; MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Valvoline VR-1 racing oil in 20W50 supposedly has the ZDDP required. I get mine at my local NAPA. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 01:40:36 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0386640568 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 01:40:36 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-we0-f176.google.com (mail-we0-f176.google.com [74.125.82.176]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8978C40560 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 01:40:21 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-we0-f176.google.com with SMTP id r5so694686wey.7 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 00:37:06 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:to:references:subject:date:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority :x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=q+6fSdGOPsSe7B/qmIdaxN4xBMunCSyLTRtYGeGAsvw=; b=O8+v+FddPmFYoemwuD0BwOdjPvqpMFAPsOY/ld3L5VAfdwfrt5jt+DXa3+tWCh1aV7 ibuGz37bNuzX+U5aVBaThdOurRCMjUlfLhUZdu9/yjk6PMpAsjqEDOt2AoJ6smXoqBrf OiZReMV5xj8pY6Bnlo1dnHGhCwPSp4P0ALN13GwZHlsOBH0mdCQC4gul1YEV/o3CLGX3 JMTbNkTusdTAeYpaU4PdGCUEM363PWZa78Y70SzyNrdfdWfZS8vQrGcNtrMU/1yR70td y5Wr8PSDRRDKOKEEgqU/z6nkuRQcozYb4+SIYJw7jxF4mrFOpJR9qgZZOhofF8c9qHVW deXA== m13mr13928271wie.16.1357893426641; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 00:37:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-1.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.97]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id w5sm11807161wif.11.2013.01.11.00.37.05 (version=TLSv1.1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Fri, 11 Jan 2013 00:37:05 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" To: "'MG List'" References: <6CC07A1ABB0247669C78EB570549AF7F@frankdcczr6l6k> <024301cdef66$76b79da0$6426d8e0$@com> Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 08:23:02 -0000 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net They certainly do not. Opinion, for what that's worth, reckons 1200-1300ppm is what is needed as a minimum. Formulations for modern engines contain significantly less phosphorus and zinc as they reduce the life of the exhaust catalyst and are perceived to be harmful to the environment. Generally speaking the later the API spec the lower the phosphorus and zinc. It also varies with manufacturer, product and market. The claims from some manufacturers are also very suspect, one claiming that theirs meets the latest API spec i.e. SM but has higher levels of zinc. 50s oils like Castrol XL API SE also aren't as good for our engines as later 70s API SJ formulations. There is a huge amount of information and misinformation out there. API SJ for Diesel engine is probably one of the best as it contains more of the required additives to protect the little ends in those engines. For a specific in the UK Comma Sonic contains about 2000ppm. OTOH, as stated a good quality oil of a suitable formulation and viscosity isn't going to do much harm. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- > Just buy a good quality oil and forget about the ZDDP. Current oils have > levels about the same as late 50s, early 60s oils. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 02:10:36 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2094840562 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 02:10:36 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from smtp122.iad.emailsrvr.com (smtp122.iad.emailsrvr.com [207.97.245.122]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 262BA40560 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 02:10:31 -0700 (MST) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by smtp32.relay.iad1a.emailsrvr.com (SMTP Server) with ESMTP id 7B21414855C for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 04:07:16 -0500 (EST) Received: by smtp32.relay.iad1a.emailsrvr.com (Authenticated sender: don-AT-napanet.net) with ESMTPSA id 18ABB1484D7 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 04:07:15 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 01:07:01 -0800 To: mgs@autox.team.net From: Don Subject: [Mgs] interesting early MGB Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Check out the latest addition to the Early MGB website: http://earlymgb.com/Huntley_page.html ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Don Scott Calistoga CA USA 1955 MGTF 1962 MGA Mk 2 1967 MGB 1963-7 MGB (seeking) Misc. Japanese cars _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 06:43:32 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7671140E23 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 06:43:32 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ea0-f173.google.com (mail-ea0-f173.google.com [209.85.215.173]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94429403FC for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 06:43:23 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-ea0-f173.google.com with SMTP id i13so690658eaa.4 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 05:40:07 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=FiCMFyfcp3xWxLDcxfPR7kjO3IPuSe5g+eYp6uBHiNQ=; b=ZC5u6q7lc07Dnb1XAoYvzD+VcjTd2LH3WIC1cxtMApsa636fNtu8DG736u1twdfr5q CTt3a7rwAuxc/GNNO8m8EpRuPijq1JgcydXogLxSqdQatIv8fm+BNuJkIX6tbXBd9F3j KfwmAliAwwZdiwsfa5AdZMBdq3H8pLk7AwZ9d4280wm3vNBZf33knzzejlRjGHweAOwP vcRJX4l00IVwdJ7zMnIE/ME5CoE/KXzRJiH3UKUgbISh4tl666sWWbEwP0gtsML+l2S7 domliOBwBv/hT2qA6Z/E97oDijAlfB3j9q9vY9GVEQYumn6X24GeL7CQb+BEz0Zr6bh0 sNVA== Received: by 10.14.218.69 with SMTP id j45mr201925681eep.35.1357911607588; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 05:40:07 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.14.223.132 with HTTP; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 05:40:07 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 07:40:07 -0600 From: Jack Feldman To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I'm surprised that no one has mentioned that Valvolene racing oil contains ZDDP. It comes in 20W50, just right for our cars. They used to advertise it in large letters on the front label, but it now it is a fine print notice on the back. You either have to have a sharp salesperson, or spend time reading the fine print. Jack, who won't leave home without it. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 07:07:39 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB3D140E26 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 07:07:39 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from relay02.pair.com (relay02.pair.com [209.68.5.16]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 1BE8A407AC for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 07:07:34 -0700 (MST) Received: (qmail 11064 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2013 14:04:18 -0000 Received: from 97.96.111.81 (HELO mullet) (97.96.111.81) by relay02.pair.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2013 14:04:18 -0000 From: "Stephen West-Fisher" To: "'MG List'" References: <6CC07A1ABB0247669C78EB570549AF7F@frankdcczr6l6k> <024301cdef66$76b79da0$6426d8e0$@com> Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 09:03:53 -0500 Thread-Index: Ac3v1uW8pYBu32tWSG+E8DTzhKnpNQALS+mQ Content-Language: en-us Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Look up the formulations of 50s and early 60s oils, you will find the levels of ZDDP are about the same as modern oils. Levels went up in the late 60s. I prefer to go by testable facts, not opinions. Otherwise I would believe the world ended last month. -- Stephen West-Fisher N4IK -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of PaulHunt73 Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 3:23 AM To: 'MG List' Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP They certainly do not. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 07:26:27 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93D4C40E3B for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 07:26:27 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from msubillings.edu (bilexeg01.msubillings.edu [192.156.215.142]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF473403E9 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 07:25:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from BILEXCH01.msubillings.edu (192.156.215.140) by BILEXEG01.msubillings.edu (192.156.215.142) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.438.0; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 07:21:23 -0700 Received: from BILEXMB02.msubillings.edu ([169.254.2.28]) by BILEXCH01.msubillings.edu ([192.156.215.140]) with mapi id 14.01.0438.000; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 07:22:15 -0700 From: "Councill, David" To: MG list Thread-Topic: [Mgs] ZDDP Thread-Index: AQHN8AE2NtqQ1gXoCE6jbZnZx+nCY5hEK9Ug Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:22:14 +0000 References: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US x-originating-ip: [72.175.92.16] Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net The ZDDP conversations on this list have probably exceeded other illustrious topics such as towing with driveline attached or not or even pros/cons on weber carbs. The primary solution is the one Jack mentions - using Valvoline VR1 racing oil. The problem, at least for me, is that 20W50 is not practical for this time of year as I switch to 10W40 in the winter due to cold weather. And it looks like it is only available as 20W50. Currently it is 10 F outside. Yes, I drive my "fair weather" daily driver 64B when it is this cold out if it is dry weather. Single digit or below zero temps or snow will keep the B parked while I use my Land Rover - like today as we have about 3" of fresh snow in an ongoing storm with 6-10" predicted by tomorrow. David Councill -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Jack Feldman Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 6:40 AM To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP I'm surprised that no one has mentioned that Valvolene racing oil contains ZDDP. It comes in 20W50, just right for our cars. They used to advertise it in large letters on the front label, but it now it is a fine print notice on the back. You either have to have a sharp salesperson, or spend time reading the fine print. Jack, who won't leave home without it. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 07:29:57 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0510040E39 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 07:29:57 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-we0-f179.google.com (mail-we0-f179.google.com [74.125.82.179]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 31A1840E19 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 07:29:48 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-we0-f179.google.com with SMTP id r6so880191wey.24 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 06:26:30 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:to:references:subject:date:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority :x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=r3uxpV5G4BvuV/wV48uyWCyCdvCgKfJZ15go1lhdbf8=; b=e3GCC5dlcM9jSw/wKgZC42hBclkd2QP0s1iadztG0kDlk6eaa5df+uu74+7Qz4Q/xM YSU9MIVy5kOtGXO2l9ghB9aphNmRKBO0vn84h/VjEzYKhUNLhEjeeunqNxAL3MOOdnDM B/7UZ68RbZ7DXcaVWDWp4qBjJQlcdfp3g6xbGESlaXL67GeLLBh47Q6DZYVuV2b0ZU5a l778Q3I7B5I5EMNbA0q8ZffsfLmSrapQAtcjEHhjUqVKNQUDB59JoSmjt7ZMcuySXq3l 9WHmpO8as40jb8R9q3FZymsEM00ID0zKqK2t2aTkujN43pgR3tLKi0LRQn+1j9dwSvkT d78Q== l5mr120781985wjw.14.1357914390054; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 06:26:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-1.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.97]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id t17sm7494914wiv.6.2013.01.11.06.26.28 (version=TLSv1.1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Fri, 11 Jan 2013 06:26:29 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" To: References: Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:01:10 -0000 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net At least two people have. They all contain ZDDP to a greater to lesser extent. The Valvolene VR1 that is available in the UK comes in those cheap plastic containers that reclaimed oil is sold in, one 5L I bought only contained a gallon, and at least one of my engines got nosier when I used it. I'm also very suspicious of some of their advertising claims, and wouldn't touch it again with a barge-pole. My 2 penn'orth. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- > I'm surprised that no one has mentioned that Valvolene racing oil contains > ZDDP. It comes in 20W50, just right for our cars. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 08:19:44 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D726440E21 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 08:19:44 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from admin.nni.com (admin.nni.com [216.107.0.100]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A32E440E1E for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 08:19:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from [199.46.198.232] (account eugeneb@nni.com) by admin.nni.com (CommuniGate Pro WebUser 4.1.8) with HTTP id 477995112; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:15:38 -0500 From: "Eugene Balinski" To: Jack Feldman ,mgs@autox.team.net Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:15:38 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Actually, I did. I use the VR-1 in 20W-50 for my 80 B as does my friend with his 53 TD Gene 80 B On Fri, 11 Jan 2013 07:40:07 -0600 Jack Feldman wrote: > I'm surprised that no one has mentioned that Valvolene > racing oil contains > ZDDP. It comes in 20W50, just right for our cars. > > They used to advertise it in large letters on the front > label, but it now > it is a fine print notice on the back. You either have to > have a sharp > salesperson, or spend time reading the fine print. > > Jack, who won't leave home without it. > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/eugeneb@nni.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider. http://www.nni.com/ _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 08:52:19 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1293840E26 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 08:52:19 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from msubillings.edu (bilexeg02.msubillings.edu [192.156.215.143]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDE0040E1D for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 08:52:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from BILEXCH01.msubillings.edu (192.156.215.140) by BILEXEG02.msubillings.edu (192.156.215.143) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.438.0; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 08:47:40 -0700 Received: from BILEXMB02.msubillings.edu ([169.254.2.28]) by BILEXCH01.msubillings.edu ([192.156.215.140]) with mapi id 14.01.0438.000; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 08:48:24 -0700 From: "Councill, David" To: Dan DiBiase , MG list Thread-Topic: [Mgs] ZDDP Thread-Index: AQHN8AE2NtqQ1gXoCE6jbZnZx+nCY5hEK9UggACMMAD//4q3AA== Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 15:48:24 +0000 References: <1357918554.38409.YahooMailNeo@web164905.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US x-originating-ip: [10.112.94.35] Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Not usually. But when I took it to a glass shop to replace windshield and seals when I was fixing it up two years ago, I did drive it home, top off during a snow storm with temps in the teens. It was a memorable experience and got lots of stares as I drove down main street. A month ago I brought the 64B in the garage to fix a few things including anemic heat. I didn't realize until then that the very early MGBs actually have flaps to shut the heater outlet in the floor area. And mine were shut. I'll have to check my 67BGT and see if I have them as Moss indicates that they may have been used up until 1970 - http://www.mossmotors.com/Shop/ViewProducts.aspx?PlateIndexID=29084&SortOrder =390 Normally, like on my 72B, you have part 50 (plastic heater outlet piece). But it looks like part 45 of which they have a pdf accessible for info on an aftermarket replacement. A nice feature. David Councill From: Dan DiBiase [mailto:d_dibiase@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 8:36 AM To: Councill, David; MG list Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP But the real question, David, is - do you keep the top down?? ;-) Dan D '76 B '65 B central NJ USA _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 09:18:42 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 00C5040E50 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 09:18:42 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm11-vm1.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com (nm11-vm1.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com [66.94.237.184]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB57440E1D for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 09:18:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from [66.94.237.195] by nm11.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2013 16:15:09 -0000 Received: from [68.142.198.107] by tm6.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2013 16:15:09 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp112.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2013 16:15:09 -0000 eFImFmQvwyhUjo7PIJ0oeZXEGFgNeCRRUNgrK7nVglfrob9AS2bPOBhFETVS 0ulDLmzK9uPhxbzCpxvBCrcec0eRnqSxV5IDfGg.7ljN83dZ.JBBC_2BnVzT 5ClZ1GsErVIf5sAC63x5az_Y4VUHfLMrf.8DM26FGOBROEtw7L.5qLuMnG.A Dz0UW2QJ3cL4ywrK0OtavROJdiH_.dCMmnMgPBcZz1TjzJwXw7Cy7U1oki2B DAjhObD43D3NvWb.n8b6G4kbHtDl1jnUswM.rBYinnX.foRiyS9mhWyHETJJ yq5o8HBYNN.m3uMOsm_rKyQiybAkLynh3.AxkNS2cxoQSb2t6lcMnu1XhxtN .OOcqkG87r480iUrslUH1oE4_Z.3IgLx5rQSuC1d77Jf5vAOLDc55qNn7IYr zFopRS93jbIZ3xPSaaBIBspuCXw7S_1u4eWIxIPNEqSgIZ9ERVkYiqpfsPWP R3ZeV.XQmS9E4vA2UBCj_4Y22v6s6yXYBK.8MbUSjfmmdtIUiNST8i1Y- Received: from [10.0.1.8] (mike@70.226.193.217 with plain) by smtp112.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2013 08:15:09 -0800 PST From: Duvall Video Productions Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:15:09 -0600 References: To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 12 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Max it is a scam in that the internet is a modern network of bad information that marketers can take advantage of. From a statistical standpoint a few problems on the net is antidotal. When the Society of Automotive Engineers publishes a paper saying 960 ppm is enough and everyone sells break in oils for new cam/tappets, then marketers are preying on you. I'm curious if the study Barrie mentions below was published anywhere.... Message: 1 Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 17:06:26 -0500 From: Barrie Robinson To: "Stephen West-Fisher" , "'MG List'" Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP I did a test for Shell and it showed that ZDDP was not needed .....................unless you were at full bore for days....and even with ZDDP that would wear things !! On Jan 11, 2013, at 8:07 AM, mgs-request@autox.team.net wrote: > Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 17:46:01 -0800 > From: Max Heim > To: MG List > Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP scam? > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > How was it a "scam" when all motor oil produced over a period of a decade or > two included ZDDP as an antiwear additive, as a matter of course, without > any particular advertising or marketing emphasis? _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 09:38:07 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BC7F40E2C for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 09:38:07 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com (cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com [75.180.132.120]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4537F4069C for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 09:37:40 -0700 (MST) Authentication-Results: cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com smtp.user=melfrankus@carolina.rr.com; auth=pass (LOGIN) a=05ChyHeVI94A:10 a=IkcTkHD0fZMA:10 a=ayC55rCoAAAA:8 a=OdxvFhdxr0MA:10 a=xi6b9vubAAAA:8 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=mHr6GJ5fAAAA:8 a=n-BOvowNJN5vupcpjioA:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=J0aUVQLP0FIA:10 a=m3MdUl94G8cA:10 a=TaN5HHIrPEwA:10 a=PPoi31BriXMA:10 a=Hq/RogpPpXNZNjKhhIesBQ==:117 Received: from [10.127.132.108] ([10.127.132.108:42167] helo=cdptpa-web17-z01) by cdptpa-oedge02.mail.rr.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.46 r()) with ESMTPA id BE/B6-04946-F0F30F05; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 16:34:24 +0000 Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 11:34:23 -0500 From: To: mgs@autox.team.net, Duvall Video Productions Sensitivity: Normal Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 12 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wow this zzdp is a conversation starter. I get hi milage hd 10w/40 and a bottle of zzdp additive @ autozone. I pour almost half the in engine bottle contents in the gas tank when full and balance in engine at oil change. I don't really know if that is correct and don't advise or advocate this. I drive the mgbgt on local errands year round and occasionally 400 miles round trip to the beach. The engine has not been apart in over 50,000 miles. ..Mel ---- Duvall Video Productions wrote: > Max it is a scam in that the internet is a modern network of bad information > that marketers can take advantage of. From a statistical standpoint a few > problems on the net is antidotal. > > When the Society of Automotive Engineers publishes a paper saying 960 ppm is > enough and everyone sells break in oils for new cam/tappets, then marketers > are preying on you. > > > I'm curious if the study Barrie mentions below was published anywhere.... > > > Message: 1 > Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 17:06:26 -0500 > From: Barrie Robinson > To: "Stephen West-Fisher" , "'MG List'" > > Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed > > I did a test for Shell and it showed that ZDDP was not needed > .....................unless you were at full bore for days....and > even with ZDDP that would wear things !! > > > > > > > On Jan 11, 2013, at 8:07 AM, mgs-request@autox.team.net wrote: > > > Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 17:46:01 -0800 > > From: Max Heim > > To: MG List > > Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP scam? > > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > > > How was it a "scam" when all motor oil produced over a period of a decade > or > > two included ZDDP as an antiwear additive, as a matter of course, without > > any particular advertising or marketing emphasis? > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/melfrankus@carolina.rr.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 10:04:53 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0471040E1E for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:04:53 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-wi0-f172.google.com (mail-wi0-f172.google.com [209.85.212.172]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE6AE40E1E for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:04:36 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-wi0-f172.google.com with SMTP id o1so2079495wic.5 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 09:01:19 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:to:references:subject:date:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority :x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=DfTKCr562IcTndjsHYq1UIoypXRZ6xmcWUNtn0d6uo0=; b=VPY/Icrnp8yjwihsdWcYA4auYRQi/QyUVcaoW2SiSsWxoQDEA4z2UCT6b9sphci01A s5EhkPnrgw3e+AYQ/+hAuf7ezdJjvX3M7TIfs+0IVXLb6WXJ/4kTPhWfrxoyWmmwg1no GSfXHXlHs6gmMKZu/SnbLFuvdenp1SAHV06LhbDA7W9MHee5BYjyzZdrkIYzAoU4785b JE0V5mcU0Zluryo36rHCknu0B6isAT1vUDHtJvwL3Si/MEk6M0Killfjdocl16YYTqvE jAOo4Ty0sD4HcrxV6hO3eCq+UVzIxl5nJ7K34ZYaiAzpgZKE17vij8um1CHnSOQmLO9p +f+Q== eq1mr16406349wib.30.1357923679560; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 09:01:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-1.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.97]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id ew4sm8108934wid.11.2013.01.11.09.01.18 (version=TLSv1.1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Fri, 11 Jan 2013 09:01:19 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" To: , , "Duvall Video Productions" References: <20130111163424.FQQCV.249357.root@cdptpa-web17-z01> Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 16:59:14 -0000 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 12 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net ZDDP goes in the *engine*, not the fuel tank. You may be thinking of lead replacement additive. But half in each is really weird. ----- Original Message ----- > ...I get hi milage hd 10w/40 and a bottle of zzdp additive @ autozone. > I pour almost half the in engine bottle contents in the gas tank _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 11:10:43 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B80AD40E37 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 11:10:43 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E38BC40E25 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 11:10:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-182.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.182]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0BI6wG3030010 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:07:00 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:01:21 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] ZDDP Thread-Index: AQHN8AE2NtqQ1gXoCE6jbZnZx+nCY5hEK9UggAA/e0E= Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net If you ignore the stipulation that racing oil is not suitable for street use... The Mobil1 15w-50 is a street oil. This weight would be more suitable for winter use, too. -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 1/11/13 6:22 AM, Councill, David at dcouncill@msubillings.edu wrote: > The ZDDP conversations on this list have probably exceeded other illustrious > topics such as towing with driveline attached or not or even pros/cons on > weber carbs. The primary solution is the one Jack mentions - using Valvoline > VR1 racing oil. The problem, at least for me, is that 20W50 is not practical > for this time of year as I switch to 10W40 in the winter due to cold weather. > And it looks like it is only available as 20W50. Currently it is 10 F outside. > Yes, I drive my "fair weather" daily driver 64B when it is this cold out if it > is dry weather. Single digit or below zero temps or snow will keep the B > parked while I use my Land Rover - like today as we have about 3" of fresh > snow in an ongoing storm with 6-10" predicted by tomorrow. > > David Councill > > -----Original Message----- > From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf > Of Jack Feldman > Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 6:40 AM > To: mgs@autox.team.net > Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP > > I'm surprised that no one has mentioned that Valvolene racing oil contains > ZDDP. It comes in 20W50, just right for our cars. > > They used to advertise it in large letters on the front label, but it now it > is a fine print notice on the back. You either have to have a sharp > salesperson, or spend time reading the fine print. > > Jack, who won't leave home without it. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 11:11:05 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58C9A40E59 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 11:11:05 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8522440E25 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 11:10:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-182.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.182]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0BI6wG4030010 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:07:01 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:04:59 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 12 Thread-Index: Ac3wJitU5UKS4IhBBUGqLt2M/UBGHw== Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 12 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Well, personal experience counts for more than "antidotal" [sic] information in my book. So after replacing the cam and lifters I am taking the issue very seriously. I wonder, was the SAE testing a 1960s-era flat tappet engine? Or just performing laboratory wear tests on a jig? -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 1/11/13 8:15 AM, Duvall Video Productions at mike@duvallvideo.com wrote: > Max it is a scam in that the internet is a modern network of bad information > that marketers can take advantage of. From a statistical standpoint a few > problems on the net is antidotal. > > When the Society of Automotive Engineers publishes a paper saying 960 ppm is > enough and everyone sells break in oils for new cam/tappets, then marketers > are preying on you. > > > I'm curious if the study Barrie mentions below was published anywhere.... > > > Message: 1 > Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 17:06:26 -0500 > From: Barrie Robinson > To: "Stephen West-Fisher" , "'MG List'" > > Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed > > I did a test for Shell and it showed that ZDDP was not needed > .....................unless you were at full bore for days....and > even with ZDDP that would wear things !! > > > > > > > On Jan 11, 2013, at 8:07 AM, mgs-request@autox.team.net wrote: > >> Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 17:46:01 -0800 >> From: Max Heim >> To: MG List >> Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP scam? >> Message-ID: >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" >> >> How was it a "scam" when all motor oil produced over a period of a decade > or >> two included ZDDP as an antiwear additive, as a matter of course, without >> any particular advertising or marketing emphasis? _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 11:11:21 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8952040E58 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 11:11:21 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB5A640E27 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 11:10:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-182.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.182]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0BI6wG5030010 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:07:02 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:06:18 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 12 Thread-Index: Ac3wJlprO7NAnBJwiUawWmclLa4BYA== Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 12 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Perhaps the comment was tongue-in-cheek... -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 1/11/13 8:59 AM, PaulHunt73 at paulhunt73@virginmedia.com wrote: > ZDDP goes in the *engine*, not the fuel tank. You may be thinking of lead > replacement additive. But half in each is really weird. > > ----- Original Message ----- >> ...I get hi milage hd 10w/40 and a bottle of zzdp additive @ autozone. >> I pour almost half the in engine bottle contents in the gas tank _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 12:11:31 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AAC0140E40 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:11:30 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from relay02.pair.com (relay02.pair.com [209.68.5.16]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 87FD240E2E for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:10:33 -0700 (MST) Received: (qmail 18463 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2013 19:07:15 -0000 Received: from 97.96.111.81 (HELO mullet) (97.96.111.81) by relay02.pair.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2013 19:07:15 -0000 From: "Stephen West-Fisher" To: "'MG List'" References: <9B8D91E1-8921-425D-A372-90E637239F00@duvallvideo.com> Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:06:49 -0500 Thread-Index: Ac3wJitU5UKS4IhBBUGqLt2M/UBGHwACFmfg Content-Language: en-us Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 12 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Let's also not miss the point that it was a salvage yard engine previously overhauled by a group more renown for penny-pinching than high quality in their later years. -- Stephen West-Fisher N4IK -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Max Heim Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 1:05 PM To: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 12 Well, personal experience counts for more than "antidotal" [sic] information in my book. So after replacing the cam and lifters I am taking the issue very seriously. I wonder, was the SAE testing a 1960s-era flat tappet engine? Or just performing laboratory wear tests on a jig? -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 12:25:18 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2615540E63 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:25:18 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from p3plsmtpa08-06.prod.phx3.secureserver.net (p3plsmtpa08-06.prod.phx3.secureserver.net [173.201.193.107]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6CB0D40525 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:25:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from Datsun ([76.184.166.234]) by p3plsmtpa08-06.prod.phx3.secureserver.net with id mjMu1k00653lu5001jMvFZ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:21:55 -0700 From: "Dave" To: "MG List" References: Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 13:07:42 -0600 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net im pretty sure they say it is not for street use because it doesn't meet the pollution etc requirements - i.e., it has zddp in it -----Original Message----- From: Max Heim Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 12:01 PM To: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP If you ignore the stipulation that racing oil is not suitable for street use... The Mobil1 15w-50 is a street oil. This weight would be more suitable for winter use, too. -- _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 12:25:33 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E78D40E46 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:25:33 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from p3plsmtpa08-06.prod.phx3.secureserver.net (p3plsmtpa08-06.prod.phx3.secureserver.net [173.201.193.107]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72B0640E2D for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:25:13 -0700 (MST) Received: from Datsun ([76.184.166.234]) by p3plsmtpa08-06.prod.phx3.secureserver.net with id mjMu1k00653lu5001jMwFb; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:21:56 -0700 From: "Dave" To: "'MG List'" References: <6CC07A1ABB0247669C78EB570549AF7F@frankdcczr6l6k><024301cdef66$76b79da0$6426d8e0$@com> <00af01cdf004$7da84e90$78f8ebb0$@com> Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 13:15:12 -0600 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net so you are saying that this article is "misinformation on the internet"? http://classiccars.about.com/od/maintenancetips/a/Zddp-Debunking-The-Urban-Legend-This-Motor-Oil-Additive.htm or this one http://www.macysgarage.com/myweb6/ZDDP.htm -----Original Message----- From: Stephen West-Fisher Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 8:03 AM To: 'MG List' Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Look up the formulations of 50s and early 60s oils, you will find the levels of ZDDP are about the same as modern oils. Levels went up in the late 60s. I prefer to go by testable facts, not opinions. Otherwise I would believe the world ended last month. -- Stephen West-Fisher N4IK -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of PaulHunt73 Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 3:23 AM To: 'MG List' Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP They certainly do not. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/dave@ranteer.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 12:26:52 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E56240E3F for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:26:52 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from alpha.look.ca (alpha.look.ca [216.66.192.2]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6828040525 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:26:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from e120-pool-d89a5a09.brdbnd.telnetcommunications.com ([216.154.90.9] helo=Barrie-PC.look.ca) by alpha.look.ca with esmtpa (user vectis@look.ca)(Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1TtkCQ-0002M4-UO; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:23:31 -0500 Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:23:31 -0500 To: Duvall Video Productions ,mgs@autox.team.net From: Barrie Robinson References: <9B8D91E1-8921-425D-A372-90E637239F00@duvallvideo.com> Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 12 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Folks, I have no idea if Shell did anything with the results - I have a feeling that it was for their own consumption. I am very fond of Shell because I got sponsorship from them when, as an idiot, I messed around with TR2s which were then all the rage (oh god, that dates me!). But Mike is right - the advertising industry has turned a knowledge and data base open facility ( the Internet) into advert delivery system - just as it did with television. On top of that it plunged sport into a morass of eye blinding adverts and irritating visions. Engineering knowledge is the only thing we can rely on - but then how do you find unbiased engineering comments? At 10:15 AM 11/01/2013 -0600, Duvall Video Productions wrote: >Max it is a scam in that the internet is a modern network of bad information >that marketers can take advantage of. From a statistical standpoint a few >problems on the net is antidotal. > >When the Society of Automotive Engineers publishes a paper saying 960 ppm is >enough and everyone sells break in oils for new cam/tappets, then marketers >are preying on you. > > >I'm curious if the study Barrie mentions below was published anywhere.... > > >Message: 1 >Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 17:06:26 -0500 >From: Barrie Robinson >To: "Stephen West-Fisher" , "'MG List'" > >Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP >Message-ID: >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed > >I did a test for Shell and it showed that ZDDP was not needed >.....................unless you were at full bore for days....and >even with ZDDP that would wear things !! > > > > > > >On Jan 11, 2013, at 8:07 AM, mgs-request@autox.team.net wrote: > > > Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 17:46:01 -0800 > > From: Max Heim > > To: MG List > > Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP scam? > > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > > > How was it a "scam" when all motor oil produced over a period of a decade >or > > two included ZDDP as an antiwear additive, as a matter of course, without > > any particular advertising or marketing emphasis? >_______________________________________________ > >Mgs@autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Suggested annual donation $12.75 >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/barrie@look.ca Regards Barrie barrie@look.ca 705-721-9060 _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 12:36:19 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1758E40E63 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:36:19 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from relay02.pair.com (relay02.pair.com [209.68.5.16]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 8DF4740E30 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:36:05 -0700 (MST) Received: (qmail 28294 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2013 19:32:46 -0000 Received: from 97.96.111.81 (HELO mullet) (97.96.111.81) by relay02.pair.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2013 19:32:46 -0000 From: "Stephen West-Fisher" To: "'MG List'" References: <6CC07A1ABB0247669C78EB570549AF7F@frankdcczr6l6k><024301cdef66$76b79da0$6426d8e0$@com> <00af01cdf004$7da84e90$78f8ebb0$@com> <865F77481EBF48FDB08C9D44F49E7674@Datsun> Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:32:19 -0500 Thread-Index: Ac3wMPteteYJ4HzPTF6mQUvSAVQj/QAAVaoQ Content-Language: en-us Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Yup. -- Stephen West-Fisher N4IK -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Dave Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 2:15 PM To: 'MG List' Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP so you are saying that this article is "misinformation on the internet"? http://classiccars.about.com/od/maintenancetips/a/Zddp-Debunking-The-Urban-L egend-This-Motor-Oil-Additive.htm or this one http://www.macysgarage.com/myweb6/ZDDP.htm _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 12:48:46 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 780E140E2C for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:48:46 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm30.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com (nm30.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com [98.139.44.157]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4EBF40E2C for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:48:02 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.139.44.98] by nm30.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2013 19:44:45 -0000 Received: from [98.138.226.240] by tm3.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2013 19:44:45 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp111.sbc.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2013 19:44:45 -0000 0rY.zBq2YiiZj6cvGgSq3bC7Ku2Wk1395VYitNIgh6eernPguf6Shf70Wv6T 7A2oimWB58W5W1qyje1l5j2YXMzqNKBq2srinu5pNWnFzBqqK15JjxrqBCZJ BvZ92MrZYbhq3GVmmY85e1peCupF.8POugQOlUbDGw2z9TNtxaD8DGgaU.q5 D6fKc8s5EYUPeDipzoxJsgwyrvp4CxlRH5xUFAxpDeuFZV32DMDlgXJY_19Q u6UurSZ95MNz03twgHq1pWBFxqlQTMVfEM83kSG5YHHf494lBUOE4_Os0ENn RxxKsqdFbU8oBkM7SbzpygWgTVUvFUoiL.tp09_18A5uPx1uNhX1gFVc7Vr7 qWl8.RRCmCRjHOsq7cEog.vII5pox8zKN2QgyT4WryTVS7AuT7T_3czyukkT vTqOuo.hNdN8E5Rin6t86YPjO1phnQpyh_mk0xgb1ryfdKyvfWprezwTjjUC CGg-- Received: from [10.0.1.8] (mike@70.226.193.217 with plain) by smtp111.sbc.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2013 11:44:45 -0800 PST From: Duvall Video Productions Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 13:44:44 -0600 References: To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 13 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Max, Did you follow the manufacturers instructions for break in? Crane cams doesn't say you need to use special additives forever with only that you use break in oils...... CRANE FLAT TAPPET CAMSHAFT RECOMMENDED BREAK-IN PROCEDURE Due to the EPAs mandate for zinc removal from most motor oils, proper flat tappet camshaft break-in procedure is more critical than ever before. This is true for both hydraulic and mechanical flat tappet Camshafts. As a point of interest, the most critical time in the life of a flat tappet camshaft is the first 20 minutes of break-in during which the bottoms of the tappets mate-in with the cam lobes. On Jan 11, 2013, at 12:10 PM, mgs-request@autox.team.net wrote: > > Message: 9 > Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:04:59 -0800 > From: Max Heim > To: MG List > Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 12 > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > Well, personal experience counts for more than "antidotal" [sic] information > in my book. So after replacing the cam and lifters I am taking the issue > very seriously. I wonder, was the SAE testing a 1960s-era flat tappet > engine? Or just performing laboratory wear tests on a jig? _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 13:05:18 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7121140E51 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 13:05:18 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from admin.nni.com (admin.nni.com [216.107.0.100]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C464A403DF for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 13:05:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from [199.46.198.232] (account eugeneb@nni.com) by admin.nni.com (CommuniGate Pro WebUser 4.1.8) with HTTP id 478053060; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 15:01:00 -0500 From: "Eugene Balinski" To: Max Heim ,MG List Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 15:01:00 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net IMHO Valvoline VR-1 is suitable for the street IF you purchase the street version. It has all of the additivives for the various SAE ratings. Per the web site, "Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is a family of race-proven lubricants formulated to provide high load carrying characteristics, minimum foaming and maximum resistance to thermal degradation. Exclusive chemistry reduces internal friction and enhances power output under extreme service conditions. Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is recommended for engines burning gasoline and full or partial alcohol fuels in track and street service. Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is for use in any car, light truck, van, or SUV where API SN is recommended(see proper viscosity grade below)." API SN/SM/SL- 20W-50 API SH * 10W-30 20W-50 API CD/CF 10W-30 20W-50 http://www.valvoline.com/pdf/vr1_racing.pdf Please point out if I am missing something... Gene 80 B On Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:01:21 -0800 Max Heim wrote: > If you ignore the stipulation that racing oil is not > suitable for street > use... > > The Mobil1 15w-50 is a street oil. This weight would be > more suitable for > winter use, too. > > > -- > > Max Heim > '66 MGB GHN3L76149 > If you're near Menlo Park, CA, > it's the primer red one with chrome wires > > > on 1/11/13 6:22 AM, Councill, David at > dcouncill@msubillings.edu wrote: > > > The ZDDP conversations on this list have probably > exceeded other illustrious > > topics such as towing with driveline attached or not or > even pros/cons on > > weber carbs. The primary solution is the one Jack > mentions - using Valvoline > > VR1 racing oil. The problem, at least for me, is that > 20W50 is not practical > > for this time of year as I switch to 10W40 in the > winter due to cold weather. > > And it looks like it is only available as 20W50. > Currently it is 10 F outside. > > Yes, I drive my "fair weather" daily driver 64B when it > is this cold out if it > > is dry weather. Single digit or below zero temps or > snow will keep the B > > parked while I use my Land Rover - like today as we > have about 3" of fresh > > snow in an ongoing storm with 6-10" predicted by > tomorrow. > > > > David Councill > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net > [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf > > Of Jack Feldman > > Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 6:40 AM > > To: mgs@autox.team.net > > Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP > > > > I'm surprised that no one has mentioned that Valvolene > racing oil contains > > ZDDP. It comes in 20W50, just right for our cars. > > > > They used to advertise it in large letters on the front > label, but it now it > > is a fine print notice on the back. You either have to > have a sharp > > salesperson, or spend time reading the fine print. > > > > Jack, who won't leave home without it. > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/eugeneb@nni.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider. http://www.nni.com/ _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 13:21:15 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32C1440E44 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 13:21:15 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from iota.look.ca (iota.look.ca [216.66.192.10]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E70B40E27 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 13:21:09 -0700 (MST) Received: from e120-pool-d89a5a09.brdbnd.telnetcommunications.com ([216.154.90.9] helo=Barrie-PC.look.ca) by iota.look.ca with esmtpa (user vectis@look.ca)(Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Ttl32-0000eB-Cy; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 15:17:52 -0500 Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:55:54 -0500 To: "Stephen West-Fisher" , "'MG List'" From: Barrie Robinson References: <6CC07A1ABB0247669C78EB570549AF7F@frankdcczr6l6k> <024301cdef66$76b79da0$6426d8e0$@com> <00af01cdf004$7da84e90$78f8ebb0$@com> Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Stephen, If anyone though the end of the world would be on the 21st Dec then they are stupid. It obvious from all the products one can buy from stationers, and those gifts sent to us by banks, insurance companies and those "professional" :-) real estate sales people, show that the end will be on the 31st December 2013. I mean how can anyone doubt it? Every one of those calender things ends on that date, so how can that date be wrong? At 09:03 AM 11/01/2013 -0500, Stephen West-Fisher wrote: >Look up the formulations of 50s and early 60s oils, you will find the levels >of ZDDP are about the same as modern oils. Levels went up in the late 60s. > >I prefer to go by testable facts, not opinions. Otherwise I would believe >the world ended last month. > >-- >Stephen West-Fisher >N4IK >-----Original Message----- >From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On >Behalf Of PaulHunt73 >Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 3:23 AM >To: 'MG List' >Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP > >They certainly do not. >_______________________________________________ > >Mgs@autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Suggested annual donation $12.75 >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/barrie@look.ca Regards Barrie barrie@look.ca 705-721-9060 _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 13:43:13 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 975E640E34 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 13:43:13 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from smtp650.redcondor.net (smtp650.redcondor.net [208.80.206.50]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BCEB340E58 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 13:43:04 -0700 (MST) Received: from cgp.netins.net ([167.142.229.73]) by smtp650.redcondor.net ({9ef01f99-b982-4add-83fd-b7c41c74273c}) via TCP (outbound) with ESMTP id 20130111203937564; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 20:39:37 +0000 Received: from [208.126.78.151] (account riverside@southslope.net HELO rileyPC) by cgpf2.cgp.netins.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.13) with ESMTPA id 455225550; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:39:31 -0600 From: To: "Stephen West-Fisher" , "'MG List'" , "Barrie Robinson" References: <6CC07A1ABB0247669C78EB570549AF7F@frankdcczr6l6k><024301cdef66$76b79da0$6426d8e0$@com><00af01cdf004$7da84e90$78f8ebb0$@com> Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:39:28 -0600 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I wonder what the cam grinders recommend for break in oil and post break in oils. art de armond -----Original Message----- From: Barrie Robinson Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 1:55 PM To: Stephen West-Fisher ; 'MG List' Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Stephen, If anyone though the end of the world would be on the 21st Dec then they are stupid. It obvious from all the products one can buy from stationers, and those gifts sent to us by banks, insurance companies and those "professional" :-) real estate sales people, show that the end will be on the 31st December 2013. I mean how can anyone doubt it? Every one of those calender things ends on that date, so how can that date be wrong? At 09:03 AM 11/01/2013 -0500, Stephen West-Fisher wrote: >Look up the formulations of 50s and early 60s oils, you will find the >levels >of ZDDP are about the same as modern oils. Levels went up in the late 60s. > >I prefer to go by testable facts, not opinions. Otherwise I would believe >the world ended last month. > >-- >Stephen West-Fisher >N4IK >-----Original Message----- >From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On >Behalf Of PaulHunt73 >Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 3:23 AM >To: 'MG List' >Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP > >They certainly do not. >_______________________________________________ > >Mgs@autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Suggested annual donation $12.75 >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/barrie@look.ca Regards Barrie barrie@look.ca 705-721-9060 _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/riverside@southslope.net ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2013.0.2890 / Virus Database: 2637/6025 - Release Date: 01/11/13 _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 14:32:24 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F78340E81 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:32:24 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from smtp.mail.wowway.com (smtp.wow.synacor.com [64.8.70.55]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0A5040E30 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 14:32:18 -0700 (MST) X_CMAE_Category: 0,0 Undefined,Undefined c=1 sm=0 a=AhRLOILGsKkA:10 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=o1OHuDzbAAAA:8 a=QP5IY3kgAAAA:8 a=m19_uuZytuor-zJsrXcA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=J0aUVQLP0FIA:10 a=m3MdUl94G8cA:10 a=ILCZio5HsAgA:10 a=zEoJXyrrGmEA:10 a=h2iXxT9cPBYAUMbPaTmFYw==:117 Authentication-Results: smtp02.wow.synacor.com smtp.mail=runner01@wowway.com; spf=neutral Received-SPF: neutral (smtp02.wow.synacor.com: 96.27.166.67 is neither permitted nor denied by domain of wowway.com) Received: from [96.27.166.67] ([96.27.166.67:50867] helo=AcerPC) by smtp.mail.wowway.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.2.40 r(29895/29896)) with ESMTP id 0C/B2-31532-7A85FE05; Thu, 10 Jan 2013 19:11:22 -0500 From: "Ray Graham" To: "'Dave'" , "'MG List'" References: <6CC07A1ABB0247669C78EB570549AF7F@frankdcczr6l6k> Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 18:11:18 -0600 Thread-Index: AQKZsf3kynDK+7bj3tQVKA4Y8VNe2AIqc7wtlppoUhA= Content-Language: en-us Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Yep, Valvoline 20-50 racing oil is what I use. Ray Graham -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Dave Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2013 5:53 PM To: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP I believe that valvoline racing oil has zddp. -----Original Message----- From: frankk12@verizon.net Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2013 1:04 PM To: MG List Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP Has anyone found a source for ZDDP that is reasonable? I checked MOss and the shipping is 50% of the cost of the ZDDP. My local NAPA store has never heard of it. Frank Krajewski _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/runner01@wowway.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 16:57:21 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9C0040517 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 16:57:21 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm24-vm0.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com (nm24-vm0.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com [98.139.213.161]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91A3540421 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 16:57:15 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.139.212.149] by nm24.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2013 20:16:39 -0000 Received: from [98.139.212.241] by tm6.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2013 20:16:39 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1050.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2013 20:16:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 87406 invoked by uid 60001); 11 Jan 2013 20:16:39 -0000 s=s1024; t=1357935399; bh=hy4UWUoGVtpVJVfeZitgToFGkqIYM3dM54dl/fwEZBk=; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=fndbTZwBSqwunRSvKMpRm83RVsyqOfNbS71PiF+p2pgGj1gdQIjuKbi6jmFUhj7KqNIcRZ1XDOz2ZCZ0t/OxLhorLN2SGnHK49B6C9ohq01wTawBAASlImyqHGnoQyAWxlEHbfVW2cpvtqMQbFo/x2zk4zi/64mZC0frY6SQOmY= s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=kHTOIIvhmklCAj2UoQoAV13EHsS36PMyOof2RKGAId9YGNR1K3c122WaMPBOOu3YKOghsT3D7Wb9aGA6XqxH40IKOntKciRjNSwJEaKv7sb6khHOsQ7/s5Hj+5IbnoFTXzW2Ym7j4JyaW3rXodm5zhs9quDsCLvVG4DRLWqF9DY=; bkgOFnvNugSB1zlubAYySiBnfHT5nbFX.xqTAJQQauF6k1riOZxxX3XLeawp i394BNcMg5eJS1FDJw0ZnJzrRO9VzYRYN52PjTaFo0Xo9Ijmiq3D61J4TJoQ 9kpTpczBCM__niRL3nA2pWN9CTIcisw5hLskHZinfoo3AAbbbRfyvdCp.F.r 1zaFGLUIX5qiXuEVMtAMaTGtzxcbABIWLP.DHrxFLCtvyiWkH6cu2F71kUdz JCJ37JXv6LbvTunAZ7.jUfbd2rN6PsIJOz9pqjAbk9Uayrij2rwADO58Acm6 Kbkn7kYDPnl.2bCXfZfYPTQF0zgFbvoMrwOtm271q.88L6EJswm4Kq6Osltt 690xM5o5wPkWaOnwEtugjjJ1_5h3eI0soJHWb4Iwp8usxIw5NBCRzssiNedK Tzcnz4G511nBQMQop2hxRITM8Ljm2U_mx49Mh77fJ17PW1scOXOgB1YeNaRH NKBDc9jFT71IGu2ymc8cR64HNodQZumhUjdUdSy3keM.nPMWCb5arEtKKX83 J39aymSoV0igxhlM4xOve18oIeH0czYBewT1S6NELxtLW0I92.excrBT.zxS qDPUZXn5oiblVGllMPq7H32lFQyxVn8vmq_Ml Received: from [68.44.138.78] by web164905.mail.bf1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:16:39 PST SSBkaWQgZHJpdmUgbXkgJzc2IG9uY2UgaW4gYSBzbm93IGZsdXJyeSwgdG9wIGRvd24uIFRoYXQgd2FzIGZ1bi4KCkRhbiBECic3NiBCCic2NSBCCkNlbnRyYWwgTkogVVNBCgoKCgpfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXwogRnJvbTogIkNvdW5jaWxsLCBEYXZpZCIgPGRjb3VuY2lsbEBtc3ViaWxsaW5ncy5lZHU.ClRvOiBEYW4gRGlCaWFzZSA8ZF9kaWJpYXNlQHlhaG9vLmNvbT47IE1HIGxpc3QgPG1nc0BhdXRveC50ZWFtLm5ldD4gClNlbnQ6IEZyaWRheSwgSmFudWFyeSAxMSwgMjAxMyABMAEBAQE- References: <1357918554.38409.YahooMailNeo@web164905.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:16:39 -0800 (PST) From: Dan DiBiase To: "Councill, David" , MG list Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I did drive my '76 once in a snow flurry, top down. That was fun. Dan D '76 B '65 B Central NJ USA ________________________________ From: "Councill, David" To: Dan DiBiase ; MG list Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 10:48 AM Subject: RE: [Mgs] ZDDP Not usually. But when I took it to a glass shop to replace windshield and seals when I was fixing it up two years ago, I did drive it home, top off during a snow storm with temps in the teens. It was a memorable experience and got lots of stares as I drove down main street. B A month ago I brought the 64B in the garage to fix a few things including anemic heat. I didnbt realize until then that the very early MGBs actually have flaps to shut the heater outlet in the floor area. And mine were shut. Ibll have to check my 67BGT and see if I have them as Moss indicates that they may have been used up until 1970 b http://www.mossmotors.com/Shop/ViewProducts.aspx?PlateIndexID=29084&SortOrder =390 Normally, like on my 72B, you have part 50 (plastic heater outlet piece). But it looks like part 45 of which they have a pdf accessible for info on an aftermarket replacement. A nice feature. B David Councill B From:Dan DiBiase [mailto:d_dibiase@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 8:36 AM To: Councill, David; MG list Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP B But the real question, David, is - do you keep the top down?? ;-) Dan D '76 B '65 B central NJ USA _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 17:43:36 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E01E40439 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 17:43:36 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A87540439 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 17:43:19 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-182.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.182]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0C0e0F2021376 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 16:40:01 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 16:33:38 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] ZDDP Thread-Index: Ac3wXHaJEDG7byNSeUKBRNPK4iiQGg== Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net No, it would be because it doesn't contain detergents and anti-sludge addititves, since it assumes you will be changing it after every outing. They had Racing Oil before this whole catalytic converter thing cropped up, you know. -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 1/11/13 11:07 AM, Dave at dave@ranteer.com wrote: > im pretty sure they say it is not for street use because it doesn't meet the > pollution etc requirements - i.e., it has zddp in it > > -----Original Message----- > From: Max Heim > Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 12:01 PM > To: MG List > Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP > > If you ignore the stipulation that racing oil is not suitable for street > use... > > The Mobil1 15w-50 is a street oil. This weight would be more suitable for > winter use, too. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 17:43:49 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A1244054E for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 17:43:49 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E3D04043C for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 17:43:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-182.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.182]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0C0e0F3021376 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 16:40:02 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 16:39:16 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 13 Thread-Index: Ac3wXUAAJcGuT+ji8k2/8tDVqOtSCQ== Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 13 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I didn't break in the original cam -- the engine was used when I got it. It lasted a considerable period of time, using Castrol 20w-50 before that was reformulated. At some time after that, it suffered fairly rapid deterioration. Not necessarily cause and effect, I grant you, but I'm taking it as a data point. I used dino oil WITH ZDDP as well as cam lube on the replacement, and followed the break-in procedures. So far so good. -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 1/11/13 11:44 AM, Duvall Video Productions at mike@duvallvideo.com wrote: > Max, Did you follow the manufacturers instructions for break in? Crane cams > doesn't say you need to use special additives forever with only that you use > break in oils...... > > > > CRANE FLAT TAPPET CAMSHAFT RECOMMENDED BREAK-IN PROCEDURE > Due to the EPAs mandate for zinc removal from most motor oils, proper flat > tappet camshaft break-in procedure is more critical than ever before. This is > true for both hydraulic and mechanical flat tappet Camshafts. As a point of > interest, the most critical time in the life of a flat tappet camshaft is the > first 20 minutes of break-in during which the bottoms of the tappets > mate-in with the cam lobes. > > On Jan 11, 2013, at 12:10 PM, mgs-request@autox.team.net wrote: > >> >> Message: 9 >> Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:04:59 -0800 >> From: Max Heim >> To: MG List >> Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 12 >> Message-ID: >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" >> >> Well, personal experience counts for more than "antidotal" [sic] > information >> in my book. So after replacing the cam and lifters I am taking the issue >> very seriously. I wonder, was the SAE testing a 1960s-era flat tappet >> engine? Or just performing laboratory wear tests on a jig? _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 18:13:48 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D868403FD for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 18:13:48 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D160403BA for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 18:13:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-182.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.182]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0C1A0vT029103 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 17:10:04 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 17:03:42 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] ZDDP Thread-Index: Ac3wYKnOY+7A1I4DLUO39TMspWdg6g== Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Well, that looks fine. But what's the "racing" version, then? Does the label read "VR-1 Racing Racing Oil"? Weird marketing... I'm not sure that everyone is talking about the same stuff here, though. VR-1 is synthetic, right? But Valvoline also sells a dino racing oil. -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 1/11/13 12:01 PM, Eugene Balinski at eugeneb@nni.com wrote: > > > IMHO Valvoline VR-1 is suitable for the street IF you > purchase the street version. It has all of the additivives > for the various SAE ratings. Per the web site, > > "Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is a family of race-proven > lubricants formulated to provide high load carrying > characteristics, minimum foaming and maximum resistance to > thermal degradation. Exclusive chemistry reduces internal > friction and enhances power output under extreme service > conditions. Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is recommended > for engines burning gasoline and full or partial alcohol > fuels in track and street service. Valvoline VR-1 Racing > Motor Oil is for use in any car, light truck, van, or SUV > where API 3SN2 is recommended(see proper viscosity grade > below)." > > > API SN/SM/SL- 20W-50 > API SH * 10W-30 20W-50 > API CD/CF 10W-30 20W-50 > > http://www.valvoline.com/pdf/vr1_racing.pdf > > > Please point out if I am missing something... > > Gene > 80 B > > > > On Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:01:21 -0800 > Max Heim wrote: >> If you ignore the stipulation that racing oil is not >> suitable for street >> use... >> >> The Mobil1 15w-50 is a street oil. This weight would be >> more suitable for >> winter use, too. >> >> >> -- >> >> Max Heim >> '66 MGB GHN3L76149 >> If you're near Menlo Park, CA, >> it's the primer red one with chrome wires >> >> >> on 1/11/13 6:22 AM, Councill, David at >> dcouncill@msubillings.edu wrote: >> >>> The ZDDP conversations on this list have probably >> exceeded other illustrious >>> topics such as towing with driveline attached or not or >> even pros/cons on >>> weber carbs. The primary solution is the one Jack >> mentions - using Valvoline >>> VR1 racing oil. The problem, at least for me, is that >> 20W50 is not practical >>> for this time of year as I switch to 10W40 in the >> winter due to cold weather. >>> And it looks like it is only available as 20W50. >> Currently it is 10 F outside. >>> Yes, I drive my "fair weather" daily driver 64B when it >> is this cold out if it >>> is dry weather. Single digit or below zero temps or >> snow will keep the B >>> parked while I use my Land Rover - like today as we >> have about 3" of fresh >>> snow in an ongoing storm with 6-10" predicted by >> tomorrow. >>> >>> David Councill >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net >> [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf >>> Of Jack Feldman >>> Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 6:40 AM >>> To: mgs@autox.team.net >>> Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP >>> >>> I'm surprised that no one has mentioned that Valvolene >> racing oil contains >>> ZDDP. It comes in 20W50, just right for our cars. >>> >>> They used to advertise it in large letters on the front >> label, but it now it >>> is a fine print notice on the back. You either have to >> have a sharp >>> salesperson, or spend time reading the fine print. >>> >>> Jack, who won't leave home without it. >> _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 18:20:30 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C02AD40534 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 18:20:30 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from admin.nni.com (admin.nni.com [216.107.0.100]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 417DB4040F for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 18:20:15 -0700 (MST) Received: from [24.91.61.211] (account eugeneb@nni.com) by admin.nni.com (CommuniGate Pro WebUser 4.1.8) with HTTP id 478087997; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 20:16:12 -0500 From: "Eugene Balinski" To: Max Heim ,MG List Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 20:16:12 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Hi Max, VR-1 is a conventional oil. There is a road version and a track-only version. I believe that they call it racing oil because of added anti-foam and ZDDP. Only a guess though.... Safety Fast, Gene 80 B On Fri, 11 Jan 2013 17:03:42 -0800 Max Heim wrote: > Well, that looks fine. But what's the "racing" version, > then? Does the label > read "VR-1 Racing Racing Oil"? Weird marketing... > > I'm not sure that everyone is talking about the same > stuff here, though. > VR-1 is synthetic, right? But Valvoline also sells a dino > racing oil. > > > -- > > Max Heim > '66 MGB GHN3L76149 > If you're near Menlo Park, CA, > it's the primer red one with chrome wires > > > > on 1/11/13 12:01 PM, Eugene Balinski at eugeneb@nni.com > wrote: > > > > > > > IMHO Valvoline VR-1 is suitable for the street IF you > > purchase the street version. It has all of the > additivives > > for the various SAE ratings. Per the web site, > > > > "Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is a family of > race-proven > > lubricants formulated to provide high load carrying > > characteristics, minimum foaming and maximum resistance > to > > thermal degradation. Exclusive chemistry reduces > internal > > friction and enhances power output under extreme > service > > conditions. Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is > recommended > > for engines burning gasoline and full or partial > alcohol > > fuels in track and street service. Valvoline VR-1 > Racing > > Motor Oil is for use in any car, light truck, van, or > SUV > > where API 3SN2 is recommended(see proper viscosity > grade > > below)." > > > > > > API SN/SM/SL- 20W-50 > > API SH * 10W-30 20W-50 > > API CD/CF 10W-30 20W-50 > > > > http://www.valvoline.com/pdf/vr1_racing.pdf > > > > > > Please point out if I am missing something... > > > > Gene > > 80 B > > > > > > > > On Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:01:21 -0800 > > Max Heim wrote: > >> If you ignore the stipulation that racing oil is not > >> suitable for street > >> use... > >> > >> The Mobil1 15w-50 is a street oil. This weight would > be > >> more suitable for > >> winter use, too. > >> > >> > >> -- > >> > >> Max Heim > >> '66 MGB GHN3L76149 > >> If you're near Menlo Park, CA, > >> it's the primer red one with chrome wires > >> > >> > >> on 1/11/13 6:22 AM, Councill, David at > >> dcouncill@msubillings.edu wrote: > >> > >>> The ZDDP conversations on this list have probably > >> exceeded other illustrious > >>> topics such as towing with driveline attached or not > or > >> even pros/cons on > >>> weber carbs. The primary solution is the one Jack > >> mentions - using Valvoline > >>> VR1 racing oil. The problem, at least for me, is that > >> 20W50 is not practical > >>> for this time of year as I switch to 10W40 in the > >> winter due to cold weather. > >>> And it looks like it is only available as 20W50. > >> Currently it is 10 F outside. > >>> Yes, I drive my "fair weather" daily driver 64B when > it > >> is this cold out if it > >>> is dry weather. Single digit or below zero temps or > >> snow will keep the B > >>> parked while I use my Land Rover - like today as we > >> have about 3" of fresh > >>> snow in an ongoing storm with 6-10" predicted by > >> tomorrow. > >>> > >>> David Councill > >>> > >>> -----Original Message----- > >>> From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net > >> [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf > >>> Of Jack Feldman > >>> Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 6:40 AM > >>> To: mgs@autox.team.net > >>> Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP > >>> > >>> I'm surprised that no one has mentioned that > Valvolene > >> racing oil contains > >>> ZDDP. It comes in 20W50, just right for our cars. > >>> > >>> They used to advertise it in large letters on the > front > >> label, but it now it > >>> is a fine print notice on the back. You either have > to > >> have a sharp > >>> salesperson, or spend time reading the fine print. > >>> > >>> Jack, who won't leave home without it. > >> _______________________________________________ > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/eugeneb@nni.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider. http://www.nni.com/ _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 19:49:00 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14E8340453 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 19:49:00 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm13.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com (nm13.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com [98.139.212.172]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id F36A14044A for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 19:48:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.139.212.151] by nm13.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2013 15:35:54 -0000 Received: from [98.139.215.229] by tm8.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2013 15:35:54 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1069.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2013 15:35:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 48868 invoked by uid 60001); 11 Jan 2013 15:35:54 -0000 s=s1024; t=1357918554; bh=1y1RHPhuqPmWyJfnUxFU2zm6iv0nxqz/aTha7WYmuxM=; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=xSfHvtBXZeCea6i8vkbLS4CQuMqABLplPw3bibJm6wwpxN2b5NrsUB0LWQvEwImLwt1N5BNm1dF/RNSCLRe4/oVnRSB5hJ4ONhayx81f09h2mJm+L++l3HhIDygbt9g8PGqV3LGuzAPjVbm7FST7feHYgVPC6aFAhwlQnaEvlH4= s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=5pakdYy9dH3YuBIaHbFJT+xO9gzfa/kT3CmMb+lQnfSpiD3NFCk3UHsKxqa/J6w4FVoDgwzpSzKJgI1ScIr9rU8PB5U/pL+Q/N1rJbF6MXqfYkrgBV1iavWazN/Uy7ZF4FpyhNfXIRo9vvL1tAaeHG16DVUvGeIcOrFTIb7BJag=; YFbOmX4TgXbweHW8EMl3MuRpdEz6fCy.zQRijSR0AtDxjVwMdpEdPixuA82n 0AC.hVMMWY6BVcMex6FscZZUkK9r0QN0oWdWD4IPJsCJikZSHmLWC68xr9jX dBdBpFfHYS0Lf9ylj8_PAK.gLcs3VRNzR.F4ZsBBAU95KNZSBYfBHpkHllQ3 d.3n.Oaca50IjDyzbCbqpV6w4vLzebeIHPfnHjB1V1UC.FwPe_QYQ7VUCB4k IeXkohN8zs1CGRKGHwkJvbjjQ1xotq20XaJ80PMV.3vvYHFOAhK_j5XfQm8f 0NNT3SVEdXmMqNaemv0doA4HiKZG5JuT.7CxDKAGVyTZSEO82o8kEOCIId4F Tcwo7M_LtNDKaaNr1N8Xl1QCl65JA38anro7o5Bh.tzS7EsFt0YHxAU0cUob rnkPkvmaaKysRsyJsQd3s4pVWgZ.bUHSsmLK8z6h8PmI89YJnb5qSd1KN8HD mZBnuCzacmlpeMw-- Received: from [68.44.138.78] by web164905.mail.bf1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 07:35:54 PST QnV0IHRoZSByZWFsIHF1ZXN0aW9uLCBEYXZpZCwgaXMgLSBkbyB5b3Uga2VlcCB0aGUgdG9wIGRvd24_PyA7LSkKCkRhbiBECic3NiBCCic2NSBCCmNlbnRyYWwgTkogVVNBCgoKCgpfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXwogRnJvbTogIkNvdW5jaWxsLCBEYXZpZCIgPGRjb3VuY2lsbEBtc3ViaWxsaW5ncy5lZHU.ClRvOiBNRyBsaXN0IDxtZ3NAYXV0b3gudGVhbS5uZXQ.IApTZW50OiBGcmlkYXksIEphbnVhcnkgMTEsIDIwMTMgOToyMiBBTQpTdWJqZWN0OiBSZTogW01nc10gWkREUAogClQBMAEBAQE- References: Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 07:35:54 -0800 (PST) From: Dan DiBiase To: "Councill, David" , MG list Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net But the real question, David, is - do you keep the top down?? ;-) Dan D '76 B '65 B central NJ USA ________________________________ From: "Councill, David" To: MG list Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 9:22 AM Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP The ZDDP conversations on this list have probably exceeded other illustrious topics such as towing with driveline attached or not or even pros/cons on weber carbs. The primary solution is the one Jack mentions - using Valvoline VR1 racing oil. The problem, at least for me, is that 20W50 is not practical for this time of year as I switch to 10W40 in the winter due to cold weather. And it looks like it is only available as 20W50. Currently it is 10 F outside. Yes, I drive my "fair weather" daily driver 64B when it is this cold out if it is dry weather. Single digit or below zero temps or snow will keep the B parked while I use my Land Rover - like today as we have about 3" of fresh snow in an ongoing storm with 6-10" predicted by tomorrow. David Councill -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Jack Feldman Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 6:40 AM To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP I'm surprised that no one has mentioned that Valvolene racing oil contains ZDDP. It comes in 20W50, just right for our cars. They used to advertise it in large letters on the front label, but it now it is a fine print notice on the back. You either have to have a sharp salesperson, or spend time reading the fine print. Jack, who won't leave home without it. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Donate: Archive: Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/d_dibiase@yahoo.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 19:56:06 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82A3B40542 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 19:56:06 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm13-vm0.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com (nm13-vm0.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com [98.139.213.79]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 3C66D4044C for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 19:55:50 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.139.212.153] by nm13.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2013 15:41:18 -0000 Received: from [98.139.215.228] by tm10.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2013 15:41:18 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1068.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2013 15:41:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 64107 invoked by uid 60001); 11 Jan 2013 15:41:18 -0000 s=s1024; t=1357918878; bh=Q6589yfCJ+n3sRFZjQGUsLwRr18NstojB8leAqB/Yrs=; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=Cvn4I/GASo2Ksqcpd5kM82ZBnh00kC08/1XwczoSxkOjy9+qsvQmKn5UVRP1cfpB1lwNppQql9ObaJ9wL5aufAndE6MtchIjg/J1qLrXsoSCQCR6Vo+r+td2iiNj+OIy0gDvED0tJnyNnp/tvIH/ciPP47QzRL5FT/XivxBgzs0= s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=1rbMTbiMNS1xgtgl2zU2AKz1HRTQ4w0+VvhgENtMDRVsb8AWI978qU9G23nccvLWShfn1wgYeOkJlGko54Nl4rm/V1xFcvXo/7zAOV11oW9tWJ4TARlnwFDqNK93H5aGTx95lqElL4kN0yOYF2E8NVn6kWgbZlnChyqXe53Z9vc=; VktT3OhtnFy9cnxpzprvI Received: from [68.44.138.78] by web164906.mail.bf1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 07:41:18 PST V2hhdCBpcyB0aGUgZGlmZmVyZW5jZSBiZXR3ZWVuIHJhY2luZyBvaWwgYW5kIHN0cmVldCBvaWw_IEp1c3QgdGhlIFpERFA_IE9yIGFyZSB0aGVyZSBvdGhlciByZWFzb25zIHRoZXkgY2FsbCBpdCAncmFjaW5nJyBvaWw_CkkgaGF2ZSBiZWVuIHVzaW5nICdvbGQnIENhc3Ryb2wgMTB3LTQwIGZvciB5ZWFycywgYWZ0ZXIgd2lubmluZyAyIGZyZWUgY2FzZXMgbWFueSB5ZWFycyBhZ28uIEknbSBhbG1vc3QgYXQgdGhlIGVuZCBvZiB0aGVtCmFuZCBJIGd1ZXNzIEkgbmVlZCB0byBzdGFydCBwYXlpbmcgYXR0ZW4BMAEBAQE- References: Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 07:41:18 -0800 (PST) From: Dan DiBiase To: PaulHunt73 , "mgs@autox.team.net" Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net What is the difference between racing oil and street oil? Just the ZDDP? Or are there other reasons they call it 'racing' oil? I have been using 'old' Castrol 10w-40 for years, after winning 2 free cases many years ago. I'm almost at the end of them and I guess I need to start paying attention to these discussions about ZDDP now.... ;-) Dan D '76 B '65 B Central NJ USA ________________________________ From: PaulHunt73 To: mgs@autox.team.net Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 9:01 AM Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP At least two people have. They all contain ZDDP to a greater to lesser extent. The Valvolene VR1 that is available in the UK comes in those cheap plastic containers that reclaimed oil is sold in, one 5L I bought only contained a gallon, and at least one of my engines got nosier when I used it. I'm also very suspicious of some of their advertising claims, and wouldn't touch it again with a barge-pole. My 2 penn'orth. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- > I'm surprised that no one has mentioned that Valvolene racing oil contains > ZDDP. It comes in 20W50, just right for our cars. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Suggested annual donation $12.75 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/d_dibiase@yahoo.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 11 20:49:16 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4979040536 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 20:49:16 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm2.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com (nm2.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com [66.94.237.203]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECBD74044A for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2013 20:49:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from [66.94.237.196] by nm2.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Jan 2013 03:45:51 -0000 Received: from [98.139.221.54] by tm7.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Jan 2013 03:45:51 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp107.sbc.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Jan 2013 03:45:51 -0000 7PenEGIfVuhLb6jkcDgzoXD0ok8yUHSjBPjmP.KuevhnuiJVMfpLCWM.Fdq8 4LJL4Ra7oASnYXbPdEIzB8cQIzbI495JlfzNj8hvL9nwvwqvYlKnpURBFp6S pps.pbC1T2s_HekeIevI_IXICM_LCmOHhguGMLo8mBwaUb8WabEJXNkAFSlE I5KZrGgi83lB9RJ7O4acSvjRtY_Rm_Fb.i4pXcGgntMgtqqPjTRW5xYBXP.J 3JrVo2gH8_IqTG4Kek4d1E0B5eTAPOJ4jVorWgmhkDr6toWwbn.jUrV3m_qH h97drwMCWNXMnGNPQSUzO3UO.JER2N4AZ9w37VO5rxH2_OYNtnuDaloJXqrA gVMDC9xaQ8F6XJco7NxYH9vqFdb22IzIOrZDWLLM5d21mj7G1fA.g_IOJdHC jTkIyhw-- Received: from [10.0.1.8] (mike@70.226.193.217 with plain) by smtp107.sbc.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2013 19:45:51 -0800 PST From: Duvall Video Productions Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2013 21:45:49 -0600 References: To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] VR-1 "racing oil" scam Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Ok - everything is not a scam but if you real the literature on VR1 it says it is suitable for "street service" VALVOLINE VR-1 RACING MOTOR OIL Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is a family of race-proven lubricants formulated to provide high load carrying characteristics, minimum foaming and maximum resistance to thermal degradation. Exclusive chemistry reduces internal friction and enhances power output under extreme service conditions. Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is recommended for engines burning gasoline and full or partial alcohol fuels in track and street service. Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is for use in any car, light truck, van, or SUV where API SN is recommended(see proper viscosity grade below). Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is not recommended for use in wet clutches( use Valvoline 4-Stroke Motorcycle Oil). The Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil  The #1 selling Racing Oil of all time and race track proven.  Protects against high-temperature deposits for a cleaner engine.  ZDDP additive provides tough anti-wear protection.  Enhanced with fricition modifier to improve horsepower.  Formulated with enhanced anti-foam system. Approvals/Performance Levels API SN/SM/SL API SH * API CD/CF * Test Vis @ 1000C (cSt) Vis @ 400C (cSt) Viscosity Index Spec Gravity @ 600F Density (lbs/gal) Total Base No. Flash COC (0C) Pour Point (0C) CCS cP (0C) MRV TP-1 cP (0C) Noack % off @ 250C Sulfated Ash Zinc/Phosphorus Calcium Sodium . * Obsolete category Viscosity Grade/Other - - - - - - 10W-30 10W-30 10W-30 11.5 77.0 143 0.8722 7.27 8.5 212 -33 6200(-25C) 20,000(-30C) <15 1 0.14/0.13 0.210 0.049 20W-50 20W-50 20W-50 20W-50 20.5 181.8 132 0.888 7.39 8.5 248 -24 8000(-15C) 27,000(-20C) <15 1 0.14/0.13 0.210 0.049 > > > > No, it would be because it doesn't contain detergents and anti-sludge > addititves, since it assumes you will be changing it after every outing. > > They had Racing Oil before this whole catalytic converter thing cropped up, > you know. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 12 07:54:41 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90C534055A for ; Sat, 12 Jan 2013 07:54:41 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from admin.nni.com (admin.nni.com [216.107.0.100]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18B3940549 for ; Sat, 12 Jan 2013 07:54:34 -0700 (MST) Received: from [24.91.61.211] (account eugeneb@nni.com) by admin.nni.com (CommuniGate Pro WebUser 4.1.8) with HTTP id 478173430; Sat, 12 Jan 2013 09:50:28 -0500 From: "Eugene Balinski" To: Dan DiBiase ,PaulHunt73 , "mgs@autox.team.net" Date: Sat, 12 Jan 2013 09:50:28 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net >From what I understand, the pure racing (non-street) oil will generally not have the detergent and other long term type additives as the lifetime of racing oil is normally minutes to hours, and nominally less than 500 miles. It does not sit in someone's crankcase for months, run for a few minutes to run to the market at cold temperatures only to be shut off to sit again when one gets home. Gene 80 B On Fri, 11 Jan 2013 07:41:18 -0800 (PST) Dan DiBiase wrote: > What is the difference between racing oil and street oil? > Just the ZDDP? Or > are there other reasons they call it 'racing' oil? > I have been using 'old' > Castrol 10w-40 for years, after winning 2 free cases many > years ago. I'm > almost at the end of them > and I guess I need to start paying attention to > these discussions about ZDDP now.... ;-) > > Dan D > '76 B > '65 B > Central NJ USA > ________________________________ > From: PaulHunt73 > > To: mgs@autox.team.net > Sent: Friday, January 11, > 2013 9:01 AM > Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP > > At least two people have. > > They all > contain ZDDP to a greater to lesser extent. The > Valvolene VR1 that is > available in the UK comes in those cheap plastic > containers that reclaimed oil > is sold in, one 5L I bought only contained a gallon, and > at least one of my > engines got nosier when I used it. I'm also very > suspicious of some of their > advertising claims, and wouldn't touch it again with a > barge-pole. My 2 > penn'orth. > > PaulH. > > ----- Original Message ----- > > I'm surprised that no one > has mentioned that Valvolene racing oil contains > > ZDDP. It comes in 20W50, > just right for our cars. > _______________________________________________ > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual > donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: > http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/d_dibiase@yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/eugeneb@nni.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider. http://www.nni.com/ _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 15 11:50:06 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE82D422A1 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 11:50:06 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from pacmmta53.windstream.net (pacmmta53.windstream.net [162.39.147.112]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FD6A422A1 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 11:49:35 -0700 (MST) cv=Q144tqixSR1YYiEEgqcDGpPuwwbWKU3BiBZsaiVVqQQ= c=1 sm=0 a=jl2ymW9NZSsA:10 a=b8HWJsW4dBAA:10 a=We2GSUcPNccA:10 a=fOpwdquTRaQA:10 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=Ov22w-J6AAAA:8 a=YCFjnaMTuxWEhZr0QmoA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=J0aUVQLP0FIA:10 a=m3MdUl94G8cA:10 a=SdvNMj5PkgcA:10 a=StphdUovPmGBgJoT:21 a=iB_T4teo5JuaTmAn:21 a=63bYps7pQgoLUlXpr0oA:9 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=8NU0cMA6Dm7EjlJ9:21 a=u9HzHawfpQJT6sPnBHxslg==:117 Authentication-Results: pacmmta53 smtp.user=ccrobins@ktc.com; auth=pass (PLAIN) Received: from [75.91.229.18] ([75.91.229.18:50817] helo=[127.0.0.1]) by pacmmta53 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39824M)) with ESMTPA id F3/21-16037-5E3A5F05; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:45:58 -0500 Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 12:45:51 -0600 From: Charley & Peggy Robinson Organization: Computer Helpers User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130107 Thunderbird/17.0.2 To: Stephen West-Fisher References: <50EB8EE1.5010900@comcast.net><201301081440.r08EewRu007490@nlpi162.prodigy.net> <019c01cdedda$e7ec9f30$b7c5dd90$@us> <51323D4C05034D909C6D06B81AD41410@paul> <004201cdee7d$de670ab0$9b352010$@us> <003001cdee7f$b9a26f60$2ce74e20$@com> Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Dunno where you got your experience :-) but every auto repair manual _I_'ve read specified clean, lightly oiled bolt threads, with the usual exception being spark plugs because they're pre-lubricated. BTW; how did you luck into that 1x2 call sign? DE af5ao On 1/9/2013 9:41 AM, Stephen West-Fisher wrote: > I'm not sure of the original premise, my experience is that torque specs are > given as dry clean threads unless stated otherwise. The addition of Loctite > or lubricant requires a reduction in torque or the fastener will be > over-stressed. > > -- > Stephen West-Fisher > N4IK > -----Original Message----- > From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On > Behalf Of Clayton Kirkwood > Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2013 10:28 AM > To: mgs@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) > > But can oiled threads be locked with loctite. > > Clayton > > -----Original Message----- > From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On > Behalf Of PaulHunt73 > Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2013 12:39 AM > To: mgs@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) > > Torque specs are usually given for oiled threads. > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/ccrobins@ktc.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 15 12:33:57 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F177D425B7 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 12:33:56 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from relay02.pair.com (relay02.pair.com [209.68.5.16]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 8A44942574 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 12:33:50 -0700 (MST) Received: (qmail 11650 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2013 19:30:11 -0000 Received: from 97.96.111.81 (HELO mullet) (97.96.111.81) by relay02.pair.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2013 19:30:11 -0000 From: "Stephen West-Fisher" To: References: <50EB8EE1.5010900@comcast.net><201301081440.r08EewRu007490@nlpi162.prodigy.net> <019c01cdedda$e7ec9f30$b7c5dd90$@us> <51323D4C05034D909C6D06B81AD41410@paul> <004201cdee7d$de670ab0$9b352010$@us> <003001cdee7f$b9a26f60$2ce74e20$@com> <50F5A3DF.5030207@ktc.com> Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 14:29:32 -0500 Thread-Index: Ac3zU1u02mRcew5XQC6ClI5n17VicQAAaB6Q Content-Language: en-us Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net The standard torque values are clean and dry. Some applications specify oiled, if they don't then they should be dry. The difference is a 25-30% reduction in torque values if you oil them - unless of course it is specifically stated to oil them in which case they have already taken it into account. I have never seen a workshop manual which states that all torque values are for oiled threads, so I'd appreciate it if you could send me a reverence. I believe the original question was about big end rod bolts and I believe (without looking) the torque is specified as oiled. The 1x2 is a vanity call, 1x2 and 2x1 calls disappeared here in the south a long, long time ago. Previously I was N8KTZ and KQ4NO. -- Stephen West-Fisher N4IK From: Charley & Peggy Robinson [mailto:ccrobins@ktc.com] Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2013 1:46 PM To: Stephen West-Fisher Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) Dunno where you got your experience :-) but every auto repair manual I've read specified clean, lightly oiled bolt threads, with the usual exception being spark plugs because they're pre-lubricated. BTW; how did you luck into that 1x2 call sign? DE af5ao On 1/9/2013 9:41 AM, Stephen West-Fisher wrote: I'm not sure of the original premise, my experience is that torque specs are given as dry clean threads unless stated otherwise. The addition of Loctite or lubricant requires a reduction in torque or the fastener will be over-stressed. -- Stephen West-Fisher N4IK -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Clayton Kirkwood Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2013 10:28 AM To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) But can oiled threads be locked with loctite. Clayton -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of PaulHunt73 Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2013 12:39 AM To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] loctite question - (Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 5) Torque specs are usually given for oiled threads. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/ccrobins@ktc.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 15 13:06:08 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05BB042590 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:06:08 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.15.18]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26E734043D for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:06:02 -0700 (MST) Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net ([10.1.76.17]) by mrigmx.server.lan (mrigmx001) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0MckDn-1TdOiG0zQ1-00HuuI for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 21:02:25 +0100 Received: (qmail 1933 invoked by uid 0); 15 Jan 2013 20:02:25 -0000 Received: from 82.156.208.140 by www027.gmx.net with HTTP; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 21:02:24 +0100 (CET) Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 21:02:24 +0100 From: "Bert Palte" To: mgs@autox.team.net NMctqz8oUygepZcTLGd5NwlUvFVx2+M9Tngw== Subject: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Just wondering (I could not resist): - Is there a correlation between MG ownership and being a ham? (apart from possibly, age?) Bert 70 B PA0LPS SA4BRL > > The 1x2 is a vanity call, 1x2 and 2x1 calls disappeared here in the south > a > long, long time ago. Previously I was N8KTZ and KQ4NO. > > > > -- > > Stephen West-Fisher > > N4IK _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 15 13:10:27 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8BB0642589 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:10:27 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from bradakis.com (bradakis.com [166.70.156.35]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 31CDD4043B for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:10:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from mark.bradakis.com (bradakis.com [166.70.156.35]) by bradakis.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C8A9A1388 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:08:33 -0700 (MST) Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:08:33 -0700 From: Mark J Bradakis User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:11.0) Gecko/20120315 Firefox/11.0 SeaMonkey/2.8 To: mgs@autox.team.net References: <20130115200224.12910@gmx.net> Subject: Re: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I'm eating a ham and cheese sandwich, does that count? But then again I sold my MG a few years back. mjb. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 15 13:16:48 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4360D42573 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:16:48 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from relay00.pair.com (relay00.pair.com [209.68.5.9]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 6FE8A4043D for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:16:43 -0700 (MST) Received: (qmail 60515 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2013 20:13:05 -0000 Received: from 97.96.111.81 (HELO mullet) (97.96.111.81) by relay00.pair.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2013 20:13:05 -0000 From: "Stephen West-Fisher" To: References: <20130115200224.12910@gmx.net> Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 15:12:26 -0500 Thread-Index: Ac3zW0UScsEQGFl6TWWOah3oc0L5vAAAJyKA Content-Language: en-us Subject: Re: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net It's more likely related to email lists - technology in other words. However my wife has often speculated about computers, airplanes, sailboats, ham radio, and old English vehicles. She thinks that when you have one, you are likely to be involved in at least two others and a high likelihood of all of them. She does have a degree in psychology and I think I have really just been a long term project. -- Stephen West-Fisher N4IK -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bert Palte Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2013 3:02 PM To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Just wondering (I could not resist): - Is there a correlation between MG ownership and being a ham? (apart from possibly, age?) Bert 70 B PA0LPS SA4BRL > > The 1x2 is a vanity call, 1x2 and 2x1 calls disappeared here in the > south a long, long time ago. Previously I was N8KTZ and KQ4NO. > > > > -- > > Stephen West-Fisher > > N4IK _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/steve@coastaldatasystems.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 15 13:22:10 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A640A42587 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:22:10 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from snt0-omc3-s10.snt0.hotmail.com (snt0-omc3-s10.snt0.hotmail.com [65.55.90.149]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83BE642548 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:22:05 -0700 (MST) Received: from SNT124-W9 ([65.55.90.137]) by snt0-omc3-s10.snt0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Tue, 15 Jan 2013 12:18:28 -0800 From: Mike E To: , Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 15:18:27 -0500 References: <20130115200224.12910@gmx.net>, <026601cdf35c$a37950f0$ea6bf2d0$@com> FILETIME=[7AB85020:01CDF35D] Subject: Re: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Well, my father was a Navy/Coast Guard signals operator and MG owner. I was an Army Morse code interceptor and an MG owner. Of course, that might just be heredity. -Mike EldredWilmington, VT 1954 MG TF1973 Midget 1977 MGB 1954 M38 Jeep > From: steve@coastaldatasystems.com > To: mgs@autox.team.net > Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 15:12:26 -0500 > Subject: Re: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership > > It's more likely related to email lists - technology in other words. > > However my wife has often speculated about computers, airplanes, sailboats, > ham radio, and old English vehicles. She thinks that when you have one, you > are likely to be involved in at least two others and a high likelihood of > all of them. She does have a degree in psychology and I think I have really > just been a long term project. > > -- > Stephen West-Fisher > N4IK > -----Original Message----- > From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On > Behalf Of Bert Palte > Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2013 3:02 PM > To: mgs@autox.team.net > Subject: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership > > Just wondering (I could not resist): > > - Is there a correlation between MG ownership and being a ham? > (apart from possibly, age?) > > Bert > 70 B > > PA0LPS > SA4BRL > > > > > > > > The 1x2 is a vanity call, 1x2 and 2x1 calls disappeared here in the > > south a long, long time ago. Previously I was N8KTZ and KQ4NO. > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Stephen West-Fisher > > > > N4IK > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/steve@coastaldatasystems.com > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/redscirocco@hotmail.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 15 14:05:48 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82343425B8 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 14:05:48 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm36.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com (nm36.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com [72.30.239.5]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3D4B4259D for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 14:05:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.139.212.153] by nm36.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Jan 2013 21:02:04 -0000 Received: from [98.139.212.196] by tm10.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Jan 2013 21:02:04 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1005.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Jan 2013 21:02:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 49952 invoked by uid 60001); 15 Jan 2013 21:02:04 -0000 s=s1024; t=1358283724; bh=9z1Nk8J30ZoSCkqFc2s8ygLNKTqWtDZbpIMCy2gsaF0=; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=2MmtRPbxA6ZgX0t0JWckZbFEaE/DQk3LC0QjCfDKY74Le6A56Ypimw7YbulRVjQy3LjNwDHen3e6+m4YyzBEPN7fuBtLD9+rL200aaAx79/zt2kFCZ/b72L7JpQ3IQjPmeKbiBP6Eg5W8IaT3xo4EFHSeVdYRyuwu3ueLqffgI0= s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=Rg2ZcL4ZD381Hlh2iYpMGopreibqtKygUOVzJxFJXGcHMbLqqHCeLSE5ySPDuGywK0sjjoDRm+FEu4ZMHjuLsUXf5GUMswSmGfEpNU8hi13eyFFgiP/aYi0OGbX2DrHC4NSzcR5nszMW3DdFB7kotZUqmzKgRuDrMVrMUz48u4U=; bv0xn4X7BnwkzVyyFcX_aJxTgSmYc5v2EuTxu2Y1sImrJvEK9uYtDabSNbTy UE72xEK6G01qWW.ShzSB55h.maSwLtQ0UGWax8lEPCl8uPU6VXNxQcJKlnuw _BQwCWEe88K7sXIVJKMyjdIRylByLIyL.HIqpSI.wb50D5MIZ_.P2sNq1j.E u8mt0ZlTq3eV77scs52fqxG4CkFhpB_qX3dtlifi3UFKbG9FwihdlfvthFHO ZD18iJewFiqmdJ5zec3N7mYNyPGATvQ0.C.WV.sjyBO1nRlcZKSn2v4DjjF2 4jY5EBPPsh0qqvT4t7gXECyw8CgTQArKTHxMRHHOrZB09WN7Ze6BUCy4C.3c iZLxXqc7GPkPFmqjlmWCQXyINb.VI8p7G9g5D5dPYK9teW6Mn1PGxhPhDn66 392qu0LO96fwOJ1bjjEuZEK.Mgtv5Ctyrc_6Boxbkjl7voZEKn2ISDnMskSC l8cF9xnvAd3u0.g-- Received: from [68.44.138.78] by web164906.mail.bf1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:02:03 PST SSd2ZSBiZWVuIHRvbGQgSSdtIGEgaGFtLi4uLgoKRGFuIEQKJzc2IEIKJzY1IEIKQ2VudHJhbCBOSiBVU0EKCgoKCl9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fCiBGcm9tOiBCZXJ0IFBhbHRlIDxwYWx0ZUBnbXgubmV0PgpUbzogbWdzQGF1dG94LnRlYW0ubmV0IApTZW50OiBUdWVzZGF5LCBKYW51YXJ5IDE1LCAyMDEzIDM6MDIgUE0KU3ViamVjdDogW01nc10gQ29ycmVsYXRpb24gSGFtIC8gTUcgT3duZXJzaGlwCiAKSnVzdCB3b25kZXJpbmcgKEkgY291bGQgbm90IHJlc2lzdCk6CgotIElzIHQBMAEBAQE- References: <20130115200224.12910@gmx.net> Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:02:03 -0800 (PST) From: Dan DiBiase To: Bert Palte , "mgs@autox.team.net" Subject: Re: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I've been told I'm a ham.... Dan D '76 B '65 B Central NJ USA ________________________________ From: Bert Palte To: mgs@autox.team.net Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2013 3:02 PM Subject: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Just wondering (I could not resist): - Is there a correlation between MG ownership and being a ham? (apart from possibly, age?) Bert 70 B PA0LPS SA4BRL > > The 1x2 is a vanity call, 1x2 and 2x1 calls disappeared here in the south > a > long, long time ago. Previously I was N8KTZ and KQ4NO. > > > > -- > > Stephen West-Fisher > > N4IK _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/d_dibiase@yahoo.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 15 14:12:23 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5DD3427AF for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 14:12:23 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC1EC425B0 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 14:11:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-217.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.217]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0FL7P0q010353 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:07:26 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 12:57:20 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Thread-Index: Ac3zYuiy/J4ib2VyaUiuReTe8BC+Zw== Subject: Re: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net The first person I knew that had an MG was an amateur actor, so yes... Actually, I think the "technical" correlation mentioned is only valid for an earlier generation. The "internet" no longer qualifies as any kind of technical interest or hobby, any more than using a phone, or a household appliance. on 1/15/13 12:02 PM, Bert Palte at palte@gmx.net wrote: > Just wondering (I could not resist): > > - Is there a correlation between MG ownership and being a ham? > (apart from possibly, age?) > > Bert > 70 B > > PA0LPS > SA4BRL > > > > >> >> The 1x2 is a vanity call, 1x2 and 2x1 calls disappeared here in the south >> a >> long, long time ago. Previously I was N8KTZ and KQ4NO. >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Stephen West-Fisher >> >> N4IK -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 15 14:16:19 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E968C427CF for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 14:16:18 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from bradakis.com (bradakis.com [166.70.156.35]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E35F425BB for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 14:16:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from mark.bradakis.com (bradakis.com [166.70.156.35]) by bradakis.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 33A2DA1388 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 14:14:24 -0700 (MST) Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 14:14:23 -0700 From: Mark J Bradakis User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:11.0) Gecko/20120315 Firefox/11.0 SeaMonkey/2.8 To: MG List References: Subject: Re: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Max Heim wrote: > The first person I knew that had an MG was an amateur actor, so yes... > > Actually, I think the "technical" correlation mentioned is only valid for an > earlier generation. The "internet" no longer qualifies as any kind of > technical interest or hobby, any more than using a phone, or a household > appliance. > > Back in 198? when Team.Net started, you had to be pretty technical. A long time ago, it seems. mjb. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 15 14:17:24 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 525D7427CB for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 14:17:24 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from relay02.pair.com (relay02.pair.com [209.68.5.16]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 5CC10427A9 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 14:17:20 -0700 (MST) Received: (qmail 53061 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2013 21:13:42 -0000 Received: from 97.96.111.81 (HELO mullet) (97.96.111.81) by relay02.pair.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2013 21:13:42 -0000 From: "Stephen West-Fisher" To: "'MG List'" References: <20130115200224.12910@gmx.net> Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 16:13:02 -0500 Thread-Index: Ac3zYuiy/J4ib2VyaUiuReTe8BC+ZwAAd+3Q Content-Language: en-us Subject: Re: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net You are correct about the Internet, but how many of those young whippersnappers are on an email list? You can't even get a reply from a 30 something on email any more, have to use Facebook :-) -- Stephen West-Fisher N4IK -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Max Heim Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2013 3:57 PM To: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership The first person I knew that had an MG was an amateur actor, so yes... Actually, I think the "technical" correlation mentioned is only valid for an earlier generation. The "internet" no longer qualifies as any kind of technical interest or hobby, any more than using a phone, or a household appliance. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 15 14:28:15 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A2C9A427A9 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 14:28:15 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm5-vm2.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (nm5-vm2.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com [98.136.218.177]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id BC171425AA for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 14:26:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.137.12.58] by nm5.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Jan 2013 21:23:14 -0000 Received: from [98.137.12.230] by tm3.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Jan 2013 21:23:14 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1038.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Jan 2013 21:23:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 5810 invoked by uid 60001); 15 Jan 2013 21:23:14 -0000 s=s1024; t=1358284994; bh=aV+0dLAmHJJCTcA3YAA0jtWJwQgKdfiUCRLmtsLWfeA=; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=qhotD1SDH77e+vm31euMAH9cWNGuFxRAGRvEnnXol2X4zhSwCT05ATetykLqJF24XUK9tKjsJCMGMO+wC5lsxojTgOS1e4gtAbjLhO36PuuL3w6qsYEUBUwodIge6gDFIvD/MwXh5jnTcpk9ZtQb3jeR/ZMqkvzHMGk6mxttzfw= s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=Y/RQHuwkCHs9vOiR6LI6HRmWP4/JpGi9g8388cWMi7xn0g6Ar2H8Cfqn3lSntdHL9AwuE90oOhgi5yNdxnjcxzjCXCrC5+VKWVpFgUujDu9ao6rkwacsjGdpbyLyIYKPWAO1aPYGQgr+vcprN/En2POL6Rno1i51Qkm9mifp+lU=; ZvvslX0uHT4uVzviBeqWcp0.ou1x2Mp5kHPrVynmnmsk8C5xM3jAre9HUr4I S8gaQKnksE_mpC8t4RV2KasNF13SG8UwhXUC1rO4ZcFgCIvYPK6S6RLYWaLl NmmDBEFOCRtIsWgGQbjTMI.XN5BA5MkaQqhSTqInzyXlDZnaz2Hqs2fLhnT5 U1ZGxxhid0uErgOlWGvxKHf6ztShQDm6kfxOa1lXZzeTbDKUvtgVtALXruW. homTJU4XxkDSErk2AxRjtrQRHUTCORLe.MRhoJ18etK2O5sz02SbA3xTFUwl CXPvKi.P7REBp0osGOTuqzkS2Y0tS6hZi2mfdzXAWFcE9rOsc96fydltJiGU F3hjTiNYK3Nm90wcFt2TV8NOqKjcRbyNy4elPZa.JqKobF35IZTiVZIzXJAl AoO8LVJ4hmp8vgRqNo29EhiKRJ1es292xEwRDVRxxjpr9bjHjaNI1Bh0MvRZ ovnZcDQ-- Received: from [170.35.224.63] by web163905.mail.gq1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:23:14 PST wqBGcm9tOiBCZXJ0IFBhbHRlIDxwYWx0ZUBnbXgubmV0PgoKCj4gLSBJcyB0aGVyZSBhIGNvcnJlbGF0aW9uIGJldHdlZW4gTUcgb3duZXJzaGlwIGFuZCBiZWluZyBhIGhhbT8KPiAoYXBhcnQgZnJvbSBwb3NzaWJseSwgYWdlPykKPiAKCkkgZ290IG15IHRoaXJkIGNsYXNzIHJhZGlvcGhvbmUgbGljZW5zZSBpbiBoaWdoIHNjaG9vbCBhbmQgaGF2ZQp3b3JrZWQgaW4gY29tbWVyY2lhbCBicm9hZGNhc3RpbmcsIGJ1dCBuZXZlciBhbWF0ZXVyLgEwAQEBAQ-- References: <20130115200224.12910@gmx.net> Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:23:14 -0800 (PST) From: David Breneman To: "mgs@autox.team.net" Subject: Re: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net From: Bert Palte > - Is there a correlation between MG ownership and being a ham? > (apart from possibly, age?) > I got my third class radiophone license in high school and have worked in commercial broadcasting, but never amateur. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 15 14:29:57 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDA92426BC for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 14:29:57 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from p3plsmtpa07-10.prod.phx3.secureserver.net (p3plsmtpa07-10.prod.phx3.secureserver.net [173.201.192.239]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 99095425AA for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 14:29:47 -0700 (MST) Received: (qmail 6748 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2013 21:26:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (205.197.253.3) by p3plsmtpa07-10.prod.phx3.secureserver.net (173.201.192.239) with ESMTP; 15 Jan 2013 21:26:06 -0000 From: "Clayton Kirkwood" To: References: <20130115200224.12910@gmx.net> Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:25:56 -0800 Thread-Index: Ac3zW1qH1HOxezftRUq4ns3tHoazIQACzxUg Content-Language: en-us Subject: Re: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Similar correlation in landrover circles -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bert Palte Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2013 12:02 PM To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Just wondering (I could not resist): - Is there a correlation between MG ownership and being a ham? (apart from possibly, age?) Bert 70 B PA0LPS SA4BRL > > The 1x2 is a vanity call, 1x2 and 2x1 calls disappeared here in the > south a long, long time ago. Previously I was N8KTZ and KQ4NO. > > > > -- > > Stephen West-Fisher > > N4IK _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/crk@godblessthe.us _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 15 14:44:04 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03452427EC for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 14:44:04 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm5-vm7.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (nm5-vm7.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com [98.136.218.182]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id A51B9426BE for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 14:41:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.137.12.189] by nm5.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Jan 2013 21:38:15 -0000 Received: from [98.137.12.243] by tm10.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Jan 2013 21:38:15 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1051.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Jan 2013 21:38:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 65265 invoked by uid 60001); 15 Jan 2013 21:38:14 -0000 s=s1024; t=1358285894; bh=6KowZsRCq5PtS77hSkiw/O7JITcvfFcPrc2JiIL3lTc=; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=Difz8rOiraYeaSEHB6LF0hkRBlhta8eA/aiLN8x08C1ss4vjMzvuj78LAtjRqyZZzvvkJHf9BB83M1Mo7SaprmTnKUccz8Fck1HtZYnP+G/hVd7Nm9FKQfpKL7aYgfPMpOYzZk/2W/pGxi3IujwCNuseKMwv13hKFfa+GPgwXZk= s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=mUJzPpROsBqGUuhp6JB5VeanvVlalAuAf7zFIuQUP9iCyNfS4h+kXFEwQmLYUVzwiMZFc1F74IRGyTGP1CzyD5QbAdIvsymiiEPJ0xXC+q3WcI7hZQJsaAi4TzXJ+cxUngBTg+/CMFQV8vB/ajm3S1p9m6+954BqkTdiSJHBjsI=; .sOo_heeQ89ggy7aGj9uTs9Myvgtb1lA_LheO4fBbyf1pVFiNr8tERoEw38Q 2vjcu1HC.q.taMwlEG.w1JKRSqEWbSXjqdJg4JF8dyGrMBDm.Q1ZOqaFxXxa ZtkDSXjfG.mWA9usBsH4jGHuMz7Cnuv.eWGqBFQzMplkBBHyMi5pR1JNbbbg WdDjNnNlBT1WXoFHO4dWVVbOp8JIU22wWX4wxUgOHS2ARcwZjwiV25X6h41J 5BvnltR_RPo76_jIznPeZ61fK8OAWSCz52Vf_NvqUTpuTiZcSjanANXEh66O Yc938_eg4JwK5K3194mH6Va9KTDYX.SInYOFXXnfULZ2gTM.xjjF8BuQOZKS VJT3PK9QOn0CeVsOlni8QCV9J8FMkmQ9gTC4MH.tWviqCPm.fWyDeBFqh3C7 Xn6WLl6oWgfhg3P7PzCnOgtAElhk1Qe9mNZsoD6AkL7_t4I7T6_5hvjTDmuA F2EyTSi0- Received: from [170.35.224.63] by web163902.mail.gq1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:38:14 PST CsKgRnJvbTogTWF4IEhlaW0gPG12aGVpbUBzb25pYy5uZXQ.CgoKPiBBY3R1YWxseSwgSSB0aGluayB0aGUgInRlY2huaWNhbCIgY29ycmVsYXRpb24gbWVudGlvbmVkIGlzIG9ubHkgdmFsaWQgCj4gZm9yIGFuCj4gZWFybGllciBnZW5lcmF0aW9uLiBUaGUgImludGVybmV0IiBubyBsb25nZXIgcXVhbGlmaWVzIGFzIGFueSBraW5kIG9mCj4gdGVjaG5pY2FsIGludGVyZXN0IG9yIGhvYmJ5LCBhbnkgbW9yZSB0aGFuIHVzaW5nIGEgcGhvbmUsIG9yIGEgaG91c2Vob2xkCj4gYXBwbGlhbmNlLgoKSSByZW1lbWIBMAEBAQE- References: <20130115200224.12910@gmx.net> Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:38:14 -0800 (PST) From: David Breneman To: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net From: Max Heim > Actually, I think the "technical" correlation mentioned is only valid > for an > earlier generation. The "internet" no longer qualifies as any kind of > technical interest or hobby, any more than using a phone, or a household > appliance. I remember that in the 80s, the assumption was that if someone had access to a Usenet news feed or email, they worked in the technology field. Same thing with Internet access up until about 1994 or so. That reality pretty much died when AOL "discovered" the internet and sold access to Usenet and mailing lists as a "feature" to their dim-bulb subscribers. It used to be that the signal to noise ratio went way down every September, when a new class of college freshmen got network access at their schools. When AOL and the other "consumer" ISPs came on line, every month was September. That pretty much killed Usenet. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 15 16:23:50 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D1D042831 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 16:23:50 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from admin.nni.com (admin.nni.com [216.107.0.100]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7106840452 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 16:23:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from [199.46.198.231] (account eugeneb@nni.com) by admin.nni.com (CommuniGate Pro WebUser 4.1.8) with HTTP id 478803509; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 18:18:57 -0500 From: "Eugene Balinski" To: "Bert Palte" ,mgs@autox.team.net Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 18:18:57 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Yup 73 de K1NR 80 B owner I know of at least 3 other ham/MG owners locally On Tue, 15 Jan 2013 21:02:24 +0100 "Bert Palte" wrote: > Just wondering (I could not resist): > > - Is there a correlation between MG ownership and being a > ham? > (apart from possibly, age?) > > Bert > 70 B > > PA0LPS > SA4BRL > > > > > > > > The 1x2 is a vanity call, 1x2 and 2x1 calls disappeared > here in the south > > a > > long, long time ago. Previously I was N8KTZ and KQ4NO. > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Stephen West-Fisher > > > > N4IK > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/eugeneb@nni.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider. http://www.nni.com/ _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 15 17:44:34 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C0DC428C6 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 17:44:34 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from qmta05.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net (qmta05.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net [76.96.30.48]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90C55428B8 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 17:44:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from omta10.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.30.28]) by qmta05.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net with comcast id oQ2g1k0040cQ2SLA5Qgm2g; Wed, 16 Jan 2013 00:40:46 +0000 Received: from yourmb2swywknr ([67.184.121.26]) by omta10.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net with comcast id oQgk1k00Y0aGQdP8WQglX8; Wed, 16 Jan 2013 00:40:45 +0000 From: "Bob Donahue" To: "Bert Palte" , References: <20130115200224.12910@gmx.net> Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 19:40:49 -0500 s=q20121106; t=1358296846; bh=qqqzF/Wyf/pXi07DZSMbAvqTbZsdCVRcuJjBHJhdeWA=; h=Received:Received:Message-ID:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version: Content-Type; b=VvK+lU4g4QKhX/ftP1mx3MBPtgc2lzJrhJ1+c6Mr698OWgI96HN1+9Obe4Cp4BfSB h6MDtqJjVcK+e0OeX6s7938xJd75O0mkjdGbCcWJwmZbYB6k1pJmImIVIw96dQzvMF TroyxhGwf76mEujkrdOZNCxlL20O/caTag3zhPlhUxsEIlCllW+p8X/3VYPFAeG5r/ ohFPDX0jA9BQNmjv4wbNFB+82fpXsLr2ip6lzkrXL+uaHwR+jHYE5jbycKAtW3Otev NELngynKaIC5aw7UH7ybqytVcSW/6ruDmXKh+XJgKtZBkf0oirw5WrEzy+bkZTBduD seb5BeIjo2Q3A== Subject: Re: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I'm a radio amateur, ND9B. There is also a couple in the local MG club who are radio amateurs, but that's as far as it goes. I get a lot of comments on the ham stick mounted to the rear bumper of my MGB. (It was quite a job getting the ignition noise out of the car. but it can be done.) Bob Donahue (Still Stuck in the '50s) Email - bobmgtd@comcast.net Cars: 52 MGTD - #17639 71 MGB - #GHN5UB254361 Member: NEMGTR #11470 NAMGBR # 7-3336 Hoosier MGB Club Olde Octagons of Indiana ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bert Palte" To: Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2013 3:02 PM Subject: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership > Just wondering (I could not resist): > > - Is there a correlation between MG ownership and being a ham? > (apart from possibly, age?) > > Bert > 70 B > > PA0LPS > SA4BRL > > > > >> >> The 1x2 is a vanity call, 1x2 and 2x1 calls disappeared here in the south >> a >> long, long time ago. Previously I was N8KTZ and KQ4NO. >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Stephen West-Fisher >> >> N4IK > _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 15 20:33:04 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E03F742990 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 20:33:04 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nlpi176.prodigy.net (nlpi176.sbcis.sbc.com [207.115.36.48]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6CB7042984 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 20:32:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from barney-gaylord.mgaguru.com (adsl-75-57-190-210.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net [75.57.190.210]) (authenticated bits=0) by nlpi176.prodigy.net (8.14.4 smptauth/8.14.4) with ESMTP id r0G3Sr9P008710 for ; Tue, 15 Jan 2013 21:28:54 -0600 Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 21:28:52 -0600 To: mgs@autox.team.net From: Barney Gaylord egacymelb.local> References: <79DFFF855A38274EBDDCD04CC4CCB58C20884B522F@LEGSERVER2008.legacymelb.local> <201212180248.qBI2mnVv001213@nlpi162.prodigy.net> <79DFFF855A38274EBDDCD04CC4CCB58C20884B5276@LEGSERVER2008.legacymelb.local> Subject: Re: [Mgs] Send me your colors Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I've been two months on this project now (on an off), and have made good progress. I now have pictures of more than half of the standard color combinaitons for MGA cars (and dozens of non-standard colors). See here: http://mgaguru.com/mgtech/paint/pt140.htm http://mgaguru.com/mgtech/paint/pt142.htm http://mgaguru.com/mgtech/paint/pt150.htm Has anyone seen MGA in any of the remainaing colors? Colors still needed: Alamo Beige with Red/Red seats 1600M2C Ash Green with Black/Green seats 1500C Ash Green with Grey/Grey seats 1500R, 1500C Black with Biege/Biege seats 1600R, 1600C, 1600M2R, 1600M2C Black with Red/Red seats 1600M2R, 1600M2C Black with Green/Green seats 1500C Chariot Red with Beige/Beige seats 1600R, 1600C, 1600M2R, 1600M2C Chariot Red with Black/Red seats 1600C, 1600M2C Chariot Red with Red/Red seats 1600M2R, 1600M2C Dove Grey Red/Red seats 1600C, 1600M2R, 1600M2C Glacier Blue with Black/Grey seats 1500R Iris Blue with Black/Light Blue seats 1600C Old English White with Black/White seats 1600R, 1600M2C Old English White with Red/Red seats 1600M2C Orient Red with Red/Red seats 1500C Orient Red with Black/Red seats 1500C Tyrolite Green with Black/Green seats 1500R Australian CKD roadsters: Aintree Green (Chartrues) Billeroy Blue (Lightning) Black BR Green (Racing Green) (New RG) Dove Grey Emgee Red (MG Red) Guan Green Nurburg White Orient Red Tyrolite Green _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 16 00:59:51 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10295429B6 for ; Wed, 16 Jan 2013 00:59:51 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from pacmmta53.windstream.net (pacmmta53.windstream.net [162.39.147.112]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85F0342988 for ; Wed, 16 Jan 2013 00:59:20 -0700 (MST) cv=Q144tqixSR1YYiEEgqcDGpPuwwbWKU3BiBZsaiVVqQQ= c=1 sm=0 a=jl2ymW9NZSsA:10 a=WuShR8tCWlEA:10 a=We2GSUcPNccA:10 a=fOpwdquTRaQA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=mHr6GJ5fAAAA:8 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=Ov22w-J6AAAA:8 a=V7PyzAoMmhDGHBSM8gAA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=J0aUVQLP0FIA:10 a=m3MdUl94G8cA:10 a=PPoi31BriXMA:10 a=SdvNMj5PkgcA:10 a=u9HzHawfpQJT6sPnBHxslg==:117 Authentication-Results: pacmmta53 smtp.user=ccrobins@ktc.com; auth=pass (PLAIN) Received: from [75.91.229.18] ([75.91.229.18:51144] helo=[127.0.0.1]) by pacmmta53 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39824M)) with ESMTPA id 99/99-16037-CFC56F05; Wed, 16 Jan 2013 02:55:40 -0500 Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 01:55:33 -0600 From: Charley & Peggy Robinson Organization: Computer Helpers User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130107 Thunderbird/17.0.2 To: MG List References: <20130115200224.12910@gmx.net> <1358285894.57550.YahooMailNeo@web163902.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Spammers killed the parts (model building) of Usenet that I frequented. CR On 1/15/2013 3:38 PM, David Breneman wrote: > From: Max Heim > > >> Actually, I think the "technical" > correlation mentioned is only valid >> for an >> earlier generation. The > "internet" no longer qualifies as any kind of >> technical interest or hobby, > any more than using a phone, or a household >> appliance. > I remember that in > the 80s, the assumption was that if someone had access > to a Usenet news feed > or email, they worked in the technology field. Same > thing with Internet > access up until about 1994 or so. That reality pretty > much died when AOL > "discovered" the internet and sold access to Usenet and > mailing lists as a > "feature" to their dim-bulb subscribers. It used to > be that the signal to > noise ratio went way down every September, when a new > class of college > freshmen got network access at their schools. When AOL > and the other > "consumer" ISPs came on line, every month was September. > That pretty much > killed Usenet. > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/ccrobins@ktc.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 16 01:06:40 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EFEB429DC for ; Wed, 16 Jan 2013 01:06:40 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from pacmmta52.windstream.net (pacmmta52.windstream.net [162.39.147.111]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A86642987 for ; Wed, 16 Jan 2013 01:04:39 -0700 (MST) cv=Jx9570vtCJLmtsOyCYU8diIJ7rMkbYjjtWgWPSCZpp4= c=1 sm=0 a=jl2ymW9NZSsA:10 a=WuShR8tCWlEA:10 a=We2GSUcPNccA:10 a=fOpwdquTRaQA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=C_IRinGWAAAA:8 a=VVlED5B4AAAA:8 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=Ov22w-J6AAAA:8 a=lrKGPfd3NauaO2OS4TEA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=J0aUVQLP0FIA:10 a=mscPh-jM9P4A:10 a=m3MdUl94G8cA:10 a=si9q_4b84H0A:10 a=BFDKbZatV3MA:10 a=SdvNMj5PkgcA:10 a=u9HzHawfpQJT6sPnBHxslg==:117 Authentication-Results: pacmmta52 smtp.user=ccrobins@ktc.com; auth=pass (PLAIN) Received: from [75.91.229.18] ([75.91.229.18:51182] helo=[127.0.0.1]) by pacmmta52 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39824M)) with ESMTPA id 1F/16-19678-C3E56F05; Wed, 16 Jan 2013 03:01:00 -0500 Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 02:00:53 -0600 From: Charley & Peggy Robinson Organization: Computer Helpers User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130107 Thunderbird/17.0.2 To: mgs@autox.team.net References: <20130115200224.12910@gmx.net> Subject: Re: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I've been a LBC owner for decades longer than I've been a Ham, although I've been a working electronics tech all my adult life. CR On 1/15/2013 6:40 PM, Bob Donahue wrote: > I'm a radio amateur, ND9B. There is also a couple in the local MG club > who are radio amateurs, but that's as far as it goes. I get a lot of > comments on the ham stick mounted to the rear bumper of my MGB. (It > was quite a job getting the ignition noise out of the car. but it can > be done.) > > Bob Donahue (Still Stuck in the '50s) > Email - bobmgtd@comcast.net > Cars: 52 MGTD - #17639 > 71 MGB - #GHN5UB254361 > Member: NEMGTR #11470 > NAMGBR # 7-3336 > Hoosier MGB Club > Olde Octagons of Indiana > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bert Palte" > To: > Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2013 3:02 PM > Subject: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership > > >> Just wondering (I could not resist): >> >> - Is there a correlation between MG ownership and being a ham? >> (apart from possibly, age?) >> >> Bert >> 70 B >> >> PA0LPS >> SA4BRL >> >> >> >> >>> >>> The 1x2 is a vanity call, 1x2 and 2x1 calls disappeared here in the >>> south >>> a >>> long, long time ago. Previously I was N8KTZ and KQ4NO. >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> Stephen West-Fisher >>> >>> N4IK >> _______________________________________________ > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/ccrobins@ktc.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 17 11:57:10 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B58640E45 for ; Thu, 17 Jan 2013 11:57:10 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from pacmmta53.windstream.net (pacmmta53.windstream.net [162.39.147.112]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B95B40561 for ; Thu, 17 Jan 2013 11:56:01 -0700 (MST) cv=asOxBwkBAZGV0T+WtrXzpfep39GF0kV392HEIHOPyDY= c=1 sm=0 a=jl2ymW9NZSsA:10 a=WuShR8tCWlEA:10 a=We2GSUcPNccA:10 a=fOpwdquTRaQA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=V0lHwwnM6sUkwj4TIvEA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=u9HzHawfpQJT6sPnBHxslg==:117 Authentication-Results: pacmmta53 smtp.user=ccrobins@ktc.com; auth=pass (PLAIN) Received: from [75.91.229.18] ([75.91.229.18:50873] helo=[127.0.0.1]) by pacmmta53 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39824M)) with ESMTPA id 4E/28-08543-E5848F05; Thu, 17 Jan 2013 13:52:14 -0500 Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2013 12:52:05 -0600 From: Charley & Peggy Robinson Organization: Computer Helpers User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130107 Thunderbird/17.0.2 To: ccrobins@ktc.com, Mga List References: <20130115200224.12910@gmx.net> <50F65E35.7070409@ktc.com> Subject: Re: [Mgs] Correlation Ham / MG Ownership Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Did resistor plugs - presuming you tried them - make much difference? CR > On 1/15/2013 6:40 PM, Bob Donahue wrote: >> I get a lot of comments on the ham stick mounted to the rear bumper >> of my MGB. (It was quite a job getting the ignition noise out of the >> car. but it can be done.) _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 19 14:44:52 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 527E642472 for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 14:44:52 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from blu0-omc4-s4.blu0.hotmail.com (blu0-omc4-s4.blu0.hotmail.com [65.55.111.143]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F29B42284 for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 14:43:37 -0700 (MST) Received: from BLU0-SMTP150 ([65.55.111.136]) by blu0-omc4-s4.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Sat, 19 Jan 2013 13:39:41 -0800 Received: from [10.203.79.207] ([198.228.226.242]) by BLU0-SMTP150.phx.gbl over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Sat, 19 Jan 2013 13:39:38 -0800 To: "=?utf-8?B?TWFnbmV0dGUgZ3JvdXA=?=" ,"=?utf-8?B?TUcgTGlzdA==?=" From: =?utf-8?B?c2NodWx0ZWppbUBtc24uY29t?= Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 16:39:36 -0500 FILETIME=[7B4E8EE0:01CDF68D] Subject: [Mgs] =?utf-8?q?Mounting_bolt_for_s=2Eu=2E_fuel_pump?= Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Folks, I am having trouble finding a bolt that will attach to the s.u. fuel pump which in turn will attach to a bracket on the MG. I have tried fine thread and course thread and none seem to go further then 1 full turn. It looks like fine to me but is it tapered? Jim in the garage with Sun light fading (-' Sent via the HTC Vividb", an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 19 15:16:21 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B64414248E for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 15:16:21 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from vms173009pub.verizon.net (vms173009pub.verizon.net [206.46.173.9]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49B1442283 for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 15:16:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from frankdcczr6l6k ([unknown] [100.40.18.211]) by vms173009.mailsrvcs.net (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7u2-7.02 32bit (built Apr 16 2009)) with ESMTPA id <0MGW0084I8C9WS20@vms173009.mailsrvcs.net> for mgs@autox.team.net; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 16:12:09 -0600 (CST) From: To: "MG List" Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 17:12:35 -0500 Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net As a follow-up and conclusion to my earlier post requesting information about sources for ZDDP I offer the latest issue of the MGB Driver tech issue. On page 25 in the article, "Basic B: Adjust Those Vaves", is a section regarding the need for ZDDP. One of the sources cited there is the Rislone Oil Supplement with ZDDP. Today I made trip to the local Pep Boys and found the last two 11 ounce bottles of the product, cost was $9 per bottle. The author suggests half a quart which I conclude is 16 ounces. Since each bottle I bought is 11 ounces I have an ample supply for one of my Bs. Frank Krajewski _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 19 15:28:55 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27E6D42476 for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 15:28:55 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from col0-omc1-s6.col0.hotmail.com (col0-omc1-s6.col0.hotmail.com [65.55.34.16]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F2CF642283 for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 15:26:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from COL122-W21 ([65.55.34.9]) by col0-omc1-s6.col0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Sat, 19 Jan 2013 14:22:21 -0800 From: RANDELL KEGG To: schultejim , "zmagnette@mgcars.org.uk" , Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 17:22:21 -0500 References: FILETIME=[73171390:01CDF693] Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Jim,The bolt that you need is a is a whitworth bolt. That is why you are having problems. For some reason SU continued to use some whitworth fasteners long after it was being phased out by MG. Randy Kegg > To: zmagnette@mgcars.org.uk; mgs@autox.team.net > From: schultejim@msn.com > Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 16:39:36 -0500 > Subject: [Mgs] Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump > > Folks, > I am having trouble finding a bolt that will attach to the s.u. fuel pump which in turn will attach to a bracket on the MG. I have tried fine thread and course thread and none seem to go further then 1 full turn. It looks like fine to me but is it tapered? > Jim in the garage with Sun light fading (-' > > Sent via the HTC Vividb", an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/randell_kegg@msn.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 19 15:38:26 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80DFB4247E for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 15:38:26 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nlpi176.prodigy.net (nlpi176.sbcis.sbc.com [207.115.36.48]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E123E42283 for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 15:38:06 -0700 (MST) Received: from barney-gaylord.mgaguru.com (adsl-68-255-1-95.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net [68.255.1.95]) (authenticated bits=0) by nlpi176.prodigy.net (8.14.4 smptauth/8.14.4) with ESMTP id r0JMY8Mg001467; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 16:34:09 -0600 Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 16:34:11 -0600 To: "schultejim@msn.com" , "MG List" From: Barney Gaylord References: Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net The part is AJD6155Z -- Screw, pump to bracket Hex Head, 1/4-26-BSF X 5/8 BSF is the fine thread series of the BSW 55 degree Whitworth threads. All of the fasteners and fittings in the SU pump are BA, BSF or BSP. It is a throwback to pre-war design, before the Allied countries adopted Unified thread standards for the war machinery. They continued making the same fuel pumps after the war, so the threads did not change to Unified standard. The Auster windscreen frame and many of the electrical parts are like that. Barney Gaylord 1958 MGA with an attitude http://MGAguru.com At 04:39 PM 1/19/2013 -0500, schultejim@msn.com wrote: >Folks, >I am having trouble finding a bolt that will attach to the s.u. fuel >pump which in turn will attach to a bracket on the MG. I have tried >fine thread and course thread and none seem to go further then 1 >full turn. It looks like fine to me but is it tapered? >Jim in the garage with Sun light fading (-' > >Sent via the HTC Vividb", an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone >_______________________________________________ > >Mgs@autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Suggested annual donation $12.75 >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/barneymg@mgaguru.com > > >----- >No virus found in this message. >Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >Version: 2013.0.2890 / Virus Database: 2638/6034 - Release Date: 01/15/13 _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 19 16:17:41 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F83342457 for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 16:17:41 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from bay0-omc4-s1.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc4-s1.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.190.203]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0595042282 for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 16:14:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from BAY157-W31 ([65.54.190.199]) by bay0-omc4-s1.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Sat, 19 Jan 2013 15:10:51 -0800 From: James Schulte To: Magnette ZAZB , "Mgs@autox.team.net" Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 18:10:51 -0500 References: , <1358636383.36956.YahooMailNeo@web180903.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> FILETIME=[3991B7E0:01CDF69A] Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net So is it 5/8 or 5/16 26 BSF thread? Barney says 5/8 and Steve says 5/16. Would a hardware store carry this or do I have to order this special from an MG supply dealer? Thanks for the info!! Jim Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 14:59:43 -0800 From: schris51@att.net Subject: Re: Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump To: zmagnette@mgcars.org.uk 5/16-26 BSF Steve Christiansen Ol Phartz Partz714-686-1236www.olphartz.comschris51@att.net From: "schultejim@msn.com" To: Magnette group Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2013 2:01 PM Subject: Re: Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump 5/16 fine 24 seems to be close but is it fine 28? I don't have one of hose to try. Jim Sent via the HTC Vivid, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone ----- Reply message ----- From: "schultejim@msn.com" To: "Magnette group" , "MG List" Subject: Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump Date: Sat, Jan 19, 2013 4:39 pm Folks, I am having trouble finding a bolt that will attach to the s.u. fuel pump which in turn will attach to a bracket on the MG. I have tried fine thread and course thread and none seem to go further then 1 full turn. It looks like fine to me but is it tapered? Jim in the garage with Sun light fading (-' Sent via the HTC Vivid, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 19 16:42:46 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AEFBC42454 for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 16:42:46 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nlpi162.prodigy.net (nlpi162.sbcis.sbc.com [207.115.36.34]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B1C242283 for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 16:42:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from barney-gaylord.mgaguru.com (adsl-68-255-1-95.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net [68.255.1.95]) (authenticated bits=0) by nlpi162.prodigy.net (8.14.4 smptauth/8.14.4) with ESMTP id r0JNcWa0021054; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 17:38:33 -0600 Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 17:38:24 -0600 To: James Schulte , "Mgs@autox.team.net" From: Barney Gaylord References: <1358636383.36956.YahooMailNeo@web180903.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Well, neither one. What I said was, AJD6155Z -- Screw, pump to bracket -- Hex Head, 1/4-26-BSF X 5/8 That is 1/4 BSF thread and 5/8 long. At 06:10 PM 1/19/2013 -0500, James Schulte wrote: >So is it 5/8 or 5/16 26 BSF thread? Barney says 5/8 and Steve says 5/16. >Would a hardware store carry this or do I have to order this special from an >MG supply dealer? >.... >Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 14:59:43 -0800 >From: schris51@att.net >.... >5/16-26 BSF Steve Christiansen >Ol Phartz Partz714-686-1236www.olphartz.comschris51@att.net >From: "schultejim@msn.com" > Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2013 2:01 PM >.... >5/16 fine 24 seems to be close but is it fine 28? I don't have one >of hose to try. >.... >From: "schultejim@msn.com" >Date: Sat, Jan 19, 2013 4:39 pm >.... >I am having trouble finding a bolt that will attach to the s.u. fuel >pump which in turn will attach to a bracket on the MG. I have tried >fine thread and course thread and none seem to go further then 1 >full turn. It looks like fine to me but is it tapered? >.... _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 19 16:48:25 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB83B42488 for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 16:48:25 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from hrndva-omtalb.mail.rr.com (hrndva-omtalb.mail.rr.com [71.74.56.122]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B00704051F for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 16:45:27 -0700 (MST) a=1q14fx7sp++YLIU7SzGzgA==:17 a=M1n3L-6PpTwA:10 a=Uol34SJu4VQA:10 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=wb0s24xMCy8A:10 a=HZJGGiqLAAAA:8 a=eM8A2uTLAAAA:8 a=AAvYLDLOAAAA:8 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=AXFVNAUyzlFLdW_Al4AA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=J0aUVQLP0FIA:10 a=W9S9m1B00NcA:10 a=m3MdUl94G8cA:10 a=HeoGohOdMD0A:10 a=s2loLT2QvaoA:10 a=K04yFKyxmTdGuAU1:21 a=tZeNM9QqqOsEKkpk:21 a=1q14fx7sp++YLIU7SzGzgA==:117 Received: from [66.66.164.187] ([66.66.164.187:64886] helo=[192.168.1.3]) by hrndva-oedge01.mail.rr.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.46 r()) with ESMTP id 1E/4B-06157-92F2BF05; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 23:41:30 +0000 From: Paul Osborne Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 18:41:29 -0500 References: , <1358636383.36956.YahooMailNeo@web180903.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> To: James Schulte Cc: "Mgs@autox.team.net" , Magnette ZAZB Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net If you are going for original , yes order the bolt, if you need to get in in and running and it is 5/16 I would run a 5/16 24 tap through it and put in a matching bolt. paulo On Jan 19, 2013, at 6:10 PM, James Schulte wrote: > So is it 5/8 or 5/16 26 BSF thread? Barney says 5/8 and Steve says 5/16. > Would a hardware store carry this or do I have to order this special from an > MG supply dealer? > Thanks for the info!! > Jim > > > Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 14:59:43 -0800 > From: schris51@att.net > Subject: Re: Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump > To: zmagnette@mgcars.org.uk > > 5/16-26 BSF Steve Christiansen > Ol Phartz Partz714-686-1236www.olphartz.comschris51@att.net > > > From: "schultejim@msn.com" > To: Magnette group > Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2013 2:01 PM > Subject: Re: Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump > > > 5/16 fine 24 seems to be close but is it fine 28? I don't have one of hose to > try. > Jim > > Sent via the HTC Vivid, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone > > ----- Reply message ----- > From: "schultejim@msn.com" > To: "Magnette group" , "MG List" > > Subject: Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump > Date: Sat, Jan 19, 2013 4:39 pm > > > Folks, > I am having trouble finding a bolt that will attach to the s.u. fuel pump > which in turn will attach to a bracket on the MG. I have tried fine thread and > course thread and none seem to go further then 1 full turn. It looks like fine > to me but is it tapered? > Jim in the garage with Sun light fading (-' > > Sent via the HTC Vivid, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/paul@ece.rochester.edu _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 19 17:06:49 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C33842466 for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 17:06:49 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from bay0-omc4-s22.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc4-s22.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.190.224]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F69042282 for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 17:06:34 -0700 (MST) Received: from BAY157-W3 ([65.54.190.199]) by bay0-omc4-s22.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Sat, 19 Jan 2013 16:02:36 -0800 From: James Schulte To: Magnette ZAZB , "Mgs@autox.team.net" Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 19:02:36 -0500 References: , <1358636383.36956.YahooMailNeo@web180903.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>, FILETIME=[7463FD90:01CDF6A1] Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Folks, My apologizes to Barney Gaylord. He said 1/4 BSF 26 x 5/8 . I misinterpreted it and only saw the 5/8 which is the length of the bolt. Even at 61 I have not learned to slow down and read everything. I can't believe in all the bolts I have taken off the parts cars I've stripped that I don't have these bolts. Oh well. I guess I will order 2 in my next order. Old and Cranky (-; Jim From: schultejim@msn.com To: zmagnette@mgcars.org.uk; mgs@autox.team.net Subject: RE: Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 18:10:51 -0500 So is it 5/8 or 5/16 26 BSF thread? Barney says 5/8 and Steve says 5/16. Would a hardware store carry this or do I have to order this special from an MG supply dealer? Thanks for the info!! Jim Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 14:59:43 -0800 From: schris51@att.net Subject: Re: Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump To: zmagnette@mgcars.org.uk 5/16-26 BSF Steve Christiansen Ol Phartz Partz714-686-1236www.olphartz.comschris51@att.net From: "schultejim@msn.com" To: Magnette group Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2013 2:01 PM Subject: Re: Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump 5/16 fine 24 seems to be close but is it fine 28? I don't have one of hose to try. Jim Sent via the HTC Vivid, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone ----- Reply message ----- From: "schultejim@msn.com" To: "Magnette group" , "MG List" Subject: Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump Date: Sat, Jan 19, 2013 4:39 pm Folks, I am having trouble finding a bolt that will attach to the s.u. fuel pump which in turn will attach to a bracket on the MG. I have tried fine thread and course thread and none seem to go further then 1 full turn. It looks like fine to me but is it tapered? Jim in the garage with Sun light fading (-' Sent via the HTC Vivid, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 19 17:09:57 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 28F6342282 for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 17:09:57 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from bay0-omc4-s4.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc4-s4.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.190.206]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C783C4227E for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 17:09:40 -0700 (MST) Received: from BAY157-W59 ([65.54.190.199]) by bay0-omc4-s4.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Sat, 19 Jan 2013 16:05:41 -0800 From: James Schulte To: "Mgs@autox.team.net" , Magnette ZAZB Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 19:05:40 -0500 FILETIME=[E271AA80:01CDF6A1] Subject: [Mgs] Poem Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Another year has passed And we're all a little older. Last summer felt hotter And winter seems much colder. There was a time not long ago When life was quite a blast. Now I fully understand About 'Living in the Past' We used to go to weddings, Football games and lunches. Now we go to funeral homes And after-funeral brunches. We used to have hangovers, >From parties that were gay. Now we suffer body aches And wile the night away. We used to go out dining, And couldn't get our fill. Now we ask for doggie bags, Come home and take a pill. We used to often travel To places near and far. Now we get sore asses >From riding in the car. We used to go to nightclubs And drink a little booze. Now we stay home at night And watch the evening news. That, my friend is how life is, And now my tale is told. So, enjoy each day and live it up... Before you're too damned old! Not sure who wrote it but seems appropriate at this time (-: _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 19 21:14:27 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D1D9F42466 for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 21:14:27 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nlpi162.prodigy.net (nlpi162.sbcis.sbc.com [207.115.36.34]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42C974227D for ; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 21:14:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from barney-gaylord.mgaguru.com (adsl-68-255-1-95.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net [68.255.1.95]) (authenticated bits=0) by nlpi162.prodigy.net (8.14.4 smptauth/8.14.4) with ESMTP id r0K4AIhx007028; Sat, 19 Jan 2013 22:10:19 -0600 Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 22:10:20 -0600 To: James Schulte , "Mgs@autox.team.net" From: Barney Gaylord References: <1358636383.36956.YahooMailNeo@web180903.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Jim, At a casual glance they look a lot like 1/4-28-UNF hex head bolts. So if you didn't know they were Whitworth when you took it apart they may be mixed in with other fasteners, or possible tossed out if they looked rusty (which most of them are). Barney At 07:02 PM 1/19/2013 -0500, James Schulte wrote: >.... >My apologizes to Barney Gaylord. He said 1/4 BSF 26 x 5/8 . I misinterpreted >it and only saw the 5/8 which is the length of the bolt. Even at 61 I have not >learned to slow down and read everything. I can't believe in all the bolts I >have taken off the parts cars I've stripped that I don't have these bolts. Oh >well. I guess I will order 2 in my next order. >.... _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jan 20 15:27:13 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D229424B3 for ; Sun, 20 Jan 2013 15:27:13 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com (outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com [64.136.55.36]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 42E8040518 for ; Sun, 20 Jan 2013 15:27:03 -0700 (MST) s=alpha; t=1358720581; bh=47DEQpj8HBSa+/TImW+5JCeuQeRkm5NMpJWZG3hSuFU=; l=0; h=From:Date:To:Cc:Subject:Message-Id:Content-Type; b=XA1sy0vDRxGlh3OMfJL5pc+DLoIjZkcmbTZ4tmFbNk4B8/Wtm7pm1kNjIGEJLpLA3 4UwOIMRkhfAslHQKhh3R91CaAdHRfVyUeV3a54VhfJZWPGMd8sa8hhuQ5ogfgK8fR+ BHfWrA1MiOmtAJJbCLGpVG1W780JDhdHeBOcEyNk= Received: from outbound-bu1.vgs.untd.com (webmail-beta02.vgs.untd.com [10.181.12.102]) by smtpout02.vgs.untd.com with SMTP id AABJR25TYAP2HUZS for (sender ); Sun, 20 Jan 2013 14:22:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from [108.88.216.197] by webmail-beta02.vgs.untd.com with HTTP: Sun, 20 Jan 2013 22:21:02 GMT From: "mgbob@juno.com" Full-Name: "mgbob@juno.com" Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2013 22:21:02 GMT To: frankk12@verizon.net Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Frank, RedLine has a ZDDP additive, $16 for eight ounces, when I bought some. Use four ounces in the sump. Bob ---------- Original Message ---------- From: To: "MG List" Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 17:12:35 -0500 As a follow-up and conclusion to my earlier post requesting information about sources for ZDDP I offer the latest issue of the MGB Driver tech issue. On page 25 in the article, "Basic B: Adjust Those Vaves", is a section regarding the need for ZDDP. One of the sources cited there is the Rislone Oil Supplement with ZDDP. Today I made trip to the local Pep Boys and found the last two 11 ounce bottles of the product, cost was $9 per bottle. The author suggests half a quart which I conclude is 16 ounces. Since each bottle I bought is 11 ounces I have an ample supply for one of my Bs. Frank Krajewski _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mgbob@juno.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jan 20 21:35:52 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 488AF40E82 for ; Sun, 20 Jan 2013 21:35:52 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from pacmmta51.windstream.net (pacmmta51.windstream.net [162.39.147.110]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 096984040C for ; Sun, 20 Jan 2013 21:34:42 -0700 (MST) cv=YyVGDYHcjyaboC8PMZJQDCOKL+k1Q4ktildSrd6759U= c=1 sm=0 a=jl2ymW9NZSsA:10 a=We2GSUcPNccA:10 a=fOpwdquTRaQA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=NoAKp6exAAAA:8 a=o1OHuDzbAAAA:8 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=Ov22w-J6AAAA:8 a=_kRAixraik0Bx2wKIHMA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=J0aUVQLP0FIA:10 a=m3MdUl94G8cA:10 a=B0cvAcWxpcAA:10 a=ILCZio5HsAgA:10 a=SdvNMj5PkgcA:10 a=u9HzHawfpQJT6sPnBHxslg==:117 Authentication-Results: pacmmta51 smtp.user=ccrobins@ktc.com; auth=pass (PLAIN) Received: from [75.91.229.18] ([75.91.229.18:49750] helo=[127.0.0.1]) by pacmmta51 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39824M)) with ESMTPA id 09/C2-05157-E64CCF05; Sun, 20 Jan 2013 23:30:39 -0500 Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2013 22:30:23 -0600 From: Charley & Peggy Robinson Organization: Computer Helpers User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130107 Thunderbird/17.0.2 To: "mgbob@juno.com" References: <20130120.172102.30674.3@webmail-beta02.vgs.untd.com> Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Dunno why you guys don't just use Valvoline racing oil. CR On 1/20/2013 4:21 PM, mgbob@juno.com wrote: > Frank, > RedLine has a ZDDP additive, $16 for eight ounces, when I bought some. Use > four ounces in the sump. > Bob > > > ---------- Original Message ---------- > From: > To: "MG List" > Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux > Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 17:12:35 -0500 > > As a follow-up and conclusion to my earlier post requesting information about > sources for ZDDP I offer the latest issue of the MGB Driver tech issue. On > page 25 in the article, "Basic B: Adjust Those Vaves", is a section > regarding > the need for ZDDP. One of the sources cited there is the Rislone Oil > Supplement with ZDDP. Today I made trip to the local Pep Boys and found the > last two 11 ounce bottles of the product, cost was $9 per bottle. The author > suggests half a quart which I conclude is 16 ounces. Since each bottle I > bought is 11 ounces I have an ample supply for one of my Bs. > Frank Krajewski > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mgbob@juno.com > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/ccrobins@ktc.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jan 20 21:37:20 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A26114041D for ; Sun, 20 Jan 2013 21:37:20 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from pacmmta52.windstream.net (pacmmta52.windstream.net [162.39.147.111]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C5DF4040C for ; Sun, 20 Jan 2013 21:37:16 -0700 (MST) cv=rVwrq0KWRJE4D9+qU66/XjvombBEfrtdgelRETzSLO0= c=1 sm=0 a=jl2ymW9NZSsA:10 a=Uol34SJu4VQA:10 a=We2GSUcPNccA:10 a=fOpwdquTRaQA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=_wZUAwuN8Au3AvhKIuEA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=u9HzHawfpQJT6sPnBHxslg==:117 Authentication-Results: pacmmta52 smtp.user=ccrobins@ktc.com; auth=pass (PLAIN) Received: from [75.91.229.18] ([75.91.229.18:49767] helo=[127.0.0.1]) by pacmmta52 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39824M)) with ESMTPA id C9/B3-12276-805CCF05; Sun, 20 Jan 2013 23:33:12 -0500 Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2013 22:32:57 -0600 From: Charley & Peggy Robinson Organization: Computer Helpers User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130107 Thunderbird/17.0.2 To: Paul Osborne References: , <1358636383.36956.YahooMailNeo@web180903.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> <636AB532-E2DE-48BA-A4BA-697780A140C4@ece.rochester.edu> Cc: "Mgs@autox.team.net" , Magnette ZAZB Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Pragmatism at it's best, bravo! CR On 1/19/2013 5:41 PM, Paul Osborne wrote: > If you are going for original , yes order the bolt, if you need to get in in > and running and it is 5/16 I would run a 5/16 24 tap through it and put in a > matching bolt. > > paulo > On Jan 19, 2013, at 6:10 PM, James Schulte wrote: _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jan 20 22:13:04 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7AD714252D for ; Sun, 20 Jan 2013 22:13:04 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ie0-f181.google.com (mail-ie0-f181.google.com [209.85.223.181]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 990DD4042B for ; Sun, 20 Jan 2013 22:12:53 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-ie0-f181.google.com with SMTP id 16so9135894iea.26 for ; Sun, 20 Jan 2013 21:08:50 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:x-received:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=0dXnD8/rOQOeHYhabO/CJ3ynRINNkYlVrHbd4IZxbzw=; b=qQeItiMwqtM89DmGAMbCwS19LR6HhWp8EHoCT3EX+cIwt3baWnY8PUMAwwiG1w0kMz 7XtJTI792dESbEzh6yPOjG9mxIGFCVeTzfelMGmkLGfMWaDomtsvxINr1lfoJtiEm9bX 1DhI/yrqaDy2losPKWQw9ctqiSdQGAcb8DV0E04ygfi9Rf/tvY5nJGUpldtMFpgnJ0Jh of0VoSm8ps0pEZSSZyjgMug4nFjkPuKxotK5oWN82PFmmAmTVaX17nBidu/Lp3g9mW+W ti2DD/PK+Mh8C1aVcPPNf//H/su25nXHEO58T3CmGpW1u8PCVOFhSdMYf5jsEVQ01Coa 8T1Q== Sun, 20 Jan 2013 21:01:21 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.64.77.33 with HTTP; Sun, 20 Jan 2013 21:01:21 -0800 (PST) References: <20130120.172102.30674.3@webmail-beta02.vgs.untd.com> <50FCC45F.3020106@ktc.com> Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2013 21:01:21 -0800 From: Simon Matthews To: ccrobins@ktc.com Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net On Sun, Jan 20, 2013 at 8:30 PM, Charley & Peggy Robinson wrote: > Dunno why you guys don't just use Valvoline racing oil. I think that this has already been discussed. Racing oil doesn't have the detergents and other chemicals that are necessary when oil is used over a long period and not just for the duration of a race. Simon _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 21 02:43:42 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5755424A9 for ; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 02:43:42 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-bk0-f48.google.com (mail-bk0-f48.google.com [209.85.214.48]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 408A340420 for ; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 02:41:43 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-bk0-f48.google.com with SMTP id jk14so355389bkc.35 for ; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 01:37:39 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:cc:references:subject:date:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority :x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=SFaRR7JevfB13MN01+DaIzfcc217Sr1Ezp/3gRU7Er8=; b=IJlfRCpwjfApCIoq69oNb+JMSiTIOS+fjsB5Twcp9zweD4UuPqZNKFboOaHC4zsWaB /cYRZb0ZANK4kQq0fKX37rI9tU3I99+ZjJLIpJTl92ISSJLYF+pG9ZXCxMQMKgrE/p0v r6yf7grILdnn9Q7XeQuaffmgmVAJ7kivfiATIB4BZDeuQ6DSk+R5cOdAi0TCQHTE7Q+E YMJrd6QS7+JTTJauMwfoTcPYezdzT20/KPXylsLxvMrGFWrkHRFGUxMYAWtMDZ60JnU9 pE8KnWHsxDqiQKAyzLPeif+YtnODpH8MaezBfpxKeojE4jTh30hS9kg/nM6IXuqzprfY MzkA== k3mr4526728bkv.117.1358761058764; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 01:37:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-3.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.105]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id f24sm7728649bkv.7.2013.01.21.01.37.38 (version=TLSv1.1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Mon, 21 Jan 2013 01:37:38 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" Cc: "Mgs@autox.team.net" References: , <1358636383.36956.YahooMailNeo@web180903.mail.ne1.yahoo.com><636AB532-E2DE-48BA-A4BA-697780A140C4@ece.rochester.edu> <50FCC4F9.70300@ktc.com> Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2013 09:15:03 -0000 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sacrilege more like, get the proper bolt! ----- Original Message ----- > Pragmatism at it's best, bravo! > > On 1/19/2013 5:41 PM, Paul Osborne wrote: >> If you are going for original , yes order the bolt, if you need to get in >> in >> and running and it is 5/16 I would run a 5/16 24 tap through it and put >> in a >> matching bolt. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 21 08:08:14 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A96EC424D7 for ; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 08:08:14 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm9-vm0.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com (nm9-vm0.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com [98.139.44.120]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92B0340536 for ; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 08:05:15 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.139.44.106] by nm9.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Jan 2013 15:01:08 -0000 Received: from [67.195.15.61] by tm11.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Jan 2013 15:01:08 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp102.sbc.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Jan 2013 15:01:08 -0000 s=s1024; t=1358780468; bh=9OCD+opF6AgfpktEVThqTjfW3yL0Q742CL3hkp1cqbk=; h=X-Yahoo-Newman-Id:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-SMTP:Received:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=VF/fPMi+MyRhLkxhO24uCcAFcOHbhNq3xXIyx61KysTC+9qLzuzLbd3iBzF939razpSXFaI4HD1QTbkgFxMUSXHykMhbrnU+CzB+v3SFb9PU69PWxaMP9bNXAoEnjXPphrVzpfgz/jYex099GNhrzOrLtQuuelw8IfVWPf/hkzM= uBmsGIt76u1e763VTmkSgTC900sPH2kuPcO.xCSBxHtj_5fVg508pk_BZ65k 2vJLUIieXdvW8p1ZUD_po9hYt2ZX1yBPSOX9zY7e3kliaPvREVk66TXLchGF dSUdi3Wb6.YaGvIEaDX3ANztmxPpztRgKrdgXYynkbhkMfX4pV6.mMyzPDCJ bHTofkvO516mSbCw94HFsefaDmp.zjy9A0_qE6qmM7GgR.Wbc2NWBqRZVvZY JZ5bQZug1PBLeARWXUnx7lkQ3GfJjvvn1BN0Y6FupwpTyEg2hAjPFjO.2RDW hMiwTzqyRQqcEGDPy8_aBVz0ASHDe4wT7YWzz0zeK9CIR3S7c6o0gZiZ0gUW lnsRfEbx8_JcUaaa6GrwE9SyG744j.ogfbd7aYsh2NXDoy3QCJvWJc0DFfAJ _f_A0zbzGr0MsVktrpGYLpYI8hsP5Cai0gtA6e3u2biQ- Received: from [127.0.0.1] (chillmog@99.9.234.42 with plain) by smtp102.sbc.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2013 07:01:08 -0800 PST Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2013 09:01:07 -0600 From: Charles Hill User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130107 Thunderbird/17.0.2 To: mgs@autox.team.net References: , <1358636383.36956.YahooMailNeo@web180903.mail.ne1.yahoo.com><636AB532-E2DE-48BA-A4BA-697780A140C4@ece.rochester.edu> <50FCC4F9.70300@ktc.com> Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net My thought was DPO in the making... Charles Hill On 1/21/2013 3:15 AM, PaulHunt73 wrote: > Sacrilege more like, get the proper bolt! > > ----- Original Message ----- >> Pragmatism at it's best, bravo! >> >> On 1/19/2013 5:41 PM, Paul Osborne wrote: >>> If you are going for original , yes order the bolt, if you need to >>> get in in >>> and running and it is 5/16 I would run a 5/16 24 tap through it and >>> put in a >>> matching bolt. > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/chillmog@sbcglobal.net _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 21 12:45:46 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A08742538 for ; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 12:45:46 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from pacmmta53.windstream.net (pacmmta53.windstream.net [162.39.147.112]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D86642529 for ; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 12:41:53 -0700 (MST) cv=asOxBwkBAZGV0T+WtrXzpfep39GF0kV392HEIHOPyDY= c=1 sm=0 a=jl2ymW9NZSsA:10 a=We2GSUcPNccA:10 a=fOpwdquTRaQA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=Ov22w-J6AAAA:8 a=L_Bbn_JNlLfrShcSUeEA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=SdvNMj5PkgcA:10 a=JdGvT7tcplY+3SYK8pD2Uw==:117 Authentication-Results: pacmmta53 smtp.user=ccrobins@ktc.com; auth=pass (PLAIN) Received: from [75.91.228.235] ([75.91.228.235:49348] helo=[127.0.0.1]) by pacmmta53 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39824M)) with ESMTPA id CB/26-08543-A099DF05; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 14:37:46 -0500 Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2013 13:37:29 -0600 From: Charley & Peggy Robinson Organization: Computer Helpers User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130107 Thunderbird/17.0.2 To: Simon Matthews References: <20130120.172102.30674.3@webmail-beta02.vgs.untd.com> <50FCC45F.3020106@ktc.com> Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net You didn't read all the post, maybe. The VR-1 Racing Oil has all the additives for street use. CR On 1/20/2013 11:01 PM, Simon Matthews wrote: > On Sun, Jan 20, 2013 at 8:30 PM, Charley & Peggy Robinson > wrote: >> Dunno why you guys don't just use Valvoline racing oil. > I think that this has already been discussed. Racing oil doesn't have > the detergents and other chemicals that are necessary when oil is > used over a long period and not just for the duration of a race. > > Simon _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 21 12:52:26 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A63642560 for ; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 12:52:26 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from pacmmta52.windstream.net (pacmmta52.windstream.net [162.39.147.111]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E439340412 for ; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 12:52:13 -0700 (MST) cv=rVwrq0KWRJE4D9+qU66/XjvombBEfrtdgelRETzSLO0= c=1 sm=0 a=jl2ymW9NZSsA:10 a=Uol34SJu4VQA:10 a=We2GSUcPNccA:10 a=fOpwdquTRaQA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=pcLIrrrKAAAA:8 a=Ov22w-J6AAAA:8 a=LrAwThtnSZFin4ct3RwA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=J0aUVQLP0FIA:10 a=m3MdUl94G8cA:10 a=ftFGBYpk1mUA:10 a=SdvNMj5PkgcA:10 a=JdGvT7tcplY+3SYK8pD2Uw==:117 Authentication-Results: pacmmta52 smtp.user=ccrobins@ktc.com; auth=pass (PLAIN) Received: from [75.91.228.235] ([75.91.228.235:49431] helo=[127.0.0.1]) by pacmmta52 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39824M)) with ESMTPA id 73/89-12276-67B9DF05; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 14:48:07 -0500 Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2013 13:47:50 -0600 From: Charley & Peggy Robinson Organization: Computer Helpers User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130107 Thunderbird/17.0.2 To: Charles Hill References: , <1358636383.36956.YahooMailNeo@web180903.mail.ne1.yahoo.com><636AB532-E2DE-48BA-A4BA-697780A140C4@ece.rochester.edu> <50FCC4F9.70300@ktc.com> <50FD5833.50100@sbcglobal.net> Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Guilty! After I bought my current '69 B roadster I became aware that it had a Midget fuel pump in it! This was apparently because a DPO had enlarged the passenger-side battery tray to hold a standard 12 volt battery. The Midget pump gave clearance for the bigger battery. I put the correct pump and fuel lines in the car and installed a group 26 battery. One thing I didn't worry about was the bolt types that hold things together. My B is a driver, not a concourse car. CR On 1/21/2013 9:01 AM, Charles Hill wrote: > My thought was DPO in the making... > > Charles Hill > > On 1/21/2013 3:15 AM, PaulHunt73 wrote: >> Sacrilege more like, get the proper bolt! >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >>> Pragmatism at it's best, bravo! >>> >>> On 1/19/2013 5:41 PM, Paul Osborne wrote: >>>> If you are going for original , yes order the bolt, if you need to >>>> get in in >>>> and running and it is 5/16 I would run a 5/16 24 tap through it and >>>> put in a >>>> matching bolt. >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Mgs@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.75 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/chillmog@sbcglobal.net > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/ccrobins@ktc.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 21 14:59:29 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F2B20403E6 for ; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 14:59:28 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from admin.nni.com (admin.nni.com [216.107.0.100]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21776403DB for ; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 14:59:05 -0700 (MST) Received: from [199.46.198.230] (account eugeneb@nni.com) by admin.nni.com (CommuniGate Pro WebUser 4.1.8) with HTTP id 480244794; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 16:54:12 -0500 From: "Eugene Balinski" To: Simon Matthews ,ccrobins@ktc.com Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2013 16:54:12 -0500 Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net This is WRONG. Valvoline VR-1 (street version) meets the requiremets for modern cars. >From the web site "Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is for use in any car, light truck, van, or SUV where American Petrolieum Institute (API) SN is recommended" (http://www.valvoline.com/pdf/vr1_racing.pdf Gene 80 B On Sun, 20 Jan 2013 21:01:21 -0800 Simon Matthews wrote: > On Sun, Jan 20, 2013 at 8:30 PM, Charley & Peggy Robinson > wrote: > > Dunno why you guys don't just use Valvoline racing oil. > > I think that this has already been discussed. Racing oil > doesn't have > the detergents and other chemicals that are necessary > when oil is > used over a long period and not just for the duration of > a race. > > Simon > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/eugeneb@nni.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider. http://www.nni.com/ _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 21 15:20:28 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 902114254F for ; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 15:20:28 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA8C1400A4 for ; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 15:16:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-106.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.106]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0LMBrBs004518 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 14:11:54 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2013 14:11:41 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux Thread-Index: Ac34JEok6oAhdmHw/UKe60x/FHTGRQ== Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net The reason for the repeated confusion is that in this case, the word "Racing" is just marketing baloney. VR-1 synthetic "Racing Oil" is apparently a street oil. I have not seen any reference to two different grades or types of VR-1 -- just different weights. Traditional "dino" (non-synthetic) Valvoline Racing Oil is just that -- racing oil, not recommended for street use. -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 1/21/13 1:54 PM, Eugene Balinski at eugeneb@nni.com wrote: > This is WRONG. Valvoline VR-1 (street version) meets the > requiremets for modern cars. > > From the web site "Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is for > use in any car, light truck, van, or SUV where American > Petrolieum Institute (API) SN is recommended" > > (http://www.valvoline.com/pdf/vr1_racing.pdf > > Gene > 80 B > > > On Sun, 20 Jan 2013 21:01:21 -0800 > Simon Matthews wrote: >> On Sun, Jan 20, 2013 at 8:30 PM, Charley & Peggy Robinson >> wrote: >>> Dunno why you guys don't just use Valvoline racing oil. >> >> I think that this has already been discussed. Racing oil >> doesn't have >> the detergents and other chemicals that are necessary >> when oil is >> used over a long period and not just for the duration of >> a race. >> >> Simon _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 21 20:56:16 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EAD4403ED for ; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 20:56:16 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from admin.nni.com (admin.nni.com [216.107.0.100]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1E7E403CF for ; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 20:49:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from [24.91.61.211] (account eugeneb@nni.com) by admin.nni.com (CommuniGate Pro WebUser 4.1.8) with HTTP id 480274298; Mon, 21 Jan 2013 21:44:18 -0500 From: "Eugene Balinski" To: Max Heim ,MG List Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2013 21:44:18 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Valvoline VR-1 is a conventional API street approved **(non-synthetic)** racing oil with ZDDP. http://www.valvoline.com/faqs/motor-oil/racing-oil/79 The other version of the VR-1 is apparently called "non-street legal" oil" per the above. FROM THE WEB PAGE: "Valvoline VR1 Racing Oil contains .13 percent of zinc and .12 percent of phosphorus compared to the Valvoline "Not Street Legal" Racing Oil which contains .14 percent of zinc and .13 percent of phosphorus." Gene 80B On Mon, 21 Jan 2013 14:11:41 -0800 Max Heim wrote: > The reason for the repeated confusion is that in this > case, the word > "Racing" is just marketing baloney. VR-1 synthetic > "Racing Oil" is > apparently a street oil. I have not seen any reference to > two different > grades or types of VR-1 -- just different weights. > > Traditional "dino" (non-synthetic) Valvoline Racing Oil > is just that -- > racing oil, not recommended for street use. > > -- > > Max Heim > '66 MGB GHN3L76149 > If you're near Menlo Park, CA, > it's the primer red one with chrome wires > > > on 1/21/13 1:54 PM, Eugene Balinski at eugeneb@nni.com > wrote: > > > This is WRONG. Valvoline VR-1 (street version) meets > the > > requiremets for modern cars. > > > > From the web site "Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is > for > > use in any car, light truck, van, or SUV where American > > Petrolieum Institute (API) SN is recommended" > > > > (http://www.valvoline.com/pdf/vr1_racing.pdf > > > > Gene > > 80 B > > > > > > On Sun, 20 Jan 2013 21:01:21 -0800 > > Simon Matthews wrote: > >> On Sun, Jan 20, 2013 at 8:30 PM, Charley & Peggy > Robinson > >> wrote: > >>> Dunno why you guys don't just use Valvoline racing > oil. > >> > >> I think that this has already been discussed. Racing > oil > >> doesn't have > >> the detergents and other chemicals that are necessary > >> when oil is > >> used over a long period and not just for the duration > of > >> a race. > >> > >> Simon > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/eugeneb@nni.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider. http://www.nni.com/ _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 22 07:13:09 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3BE740E29 for ; Tue, 22 Jan 2013 07:13:09 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from vms173011pub.verizon.net (vms173011pub.verizon.net [206.46.173.11]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9899540437 for ; Tue, 22 Jan 2013 07:12:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from frankdcczr6l6k ([unknown] [100.40.18.211]) by vms173011.mailsrvcs.net (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7u2-7.02 32bit (built Apr 16 2009)) with ESMTPA id <0MH100EY35YEES00@vms173011.mailsrvcs.net> for mgs@autox.team.net; Tue, 22 Jan 2013 08:08:40 -0600 (CST) From: To: References: <20130120.172102.30674.3@webmail-beta02.vgs.untd.com> <50FCC45F.3020106@ktc.com> Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2013 09:08:37 -0500 Cc: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net CR: If it is engineered for racing is it good for street use? The local Napa store only has the racing version and not the street one. Frank ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charley & Peggy Robinson" To: Cc: ; Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2013 11:30 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux > Dunno why you guys don't just use Valvoline racing oil. > > CR > On 1/20/2013 4:21 PM, mgbob@juno.com wrote: >> Frank, >> RedLine has a ZDDP additive, $16 for eight ounces, when I bought some. >> Use >> four ounces in the sump. >> Bob >> >> >> ---------- Original Message ---------- >> From: >> To: "MG List" >> Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux >> Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 17:12:35 -0500 >> >> As a follow-up and conclusion to my earlier post requesting information >> about >> sources for ZDDP I offer the latest issue of the MGB Driver tech issue. >> On >> page 25 in the article, "Basic B: Adjust Those Vaves", is a section >> regarding >> the need for ZDDP. One of the sources cited there is the Rislone Oil >> Supplement with ZDDP. Today I made trip to the local Pep Boys and found >> the >> last two 11 ounce bottles of the product, cost was $9 per bottle. The >> author >> suggests half a quart which I conclude is 16 ounces. Since each bottle I >> bought is 11 ounces I have an ample supply for one of my Bs. >> Frank Krajewski >> _______________________________________________ >>>> _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 22 07:57:35 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9F534252D for ; Tue, 22 Jan 2013 07:57:35 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-bk0-f42.google.com (mail-bk0-f42.google.com [209.85.214.42]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D724940442 for ; Tue, 22 Jan 2013 07:53:31 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-bk0-f42.google.com with SMTP id ji2so3809365bkc.15 for ; Tue, 22 Jan 2013 06:49:19 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:to:references:subject:date:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority :x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=xoFparX6CcL3OovOnAxe2Lmg0L6N4E4O8mk3hOG8huw=; b=iChKA2ZFWJliQY/ltbQLKNhdIkUztYAFom8ZQeOkxOZXLTYU4w5MZkti6AMOk45EqH hpg5PCSWz7z2WUHhtcC+8pcrf74YRu7DujRV96qywIraMTcht+EOD5eOFlX7KPaPrQur WYIACeuegBC5+dpsFzlBfKk2w9bHJ3gnoSeQaYiZZRJGQp8/hDNNfatPapGD2ZirDAt+ S46A3Bvzif8z6u8k89hgJHnpVzG5zxizaU7xOHd5d9eCdULkR3Fn+kxVIPCN0ryN2W92 mri91Y3cniv7zH5Qu4e/HSgI68g3VXV4t0RIa/talZjLwqb6jTdhv8jfoo9D9u3DjNCs vGfg== k14mr5806159bkv.7.1358866159704; Tue, 22 Jan 2013 06:49:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-3.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.105]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id l17sm11352087bkw.12.2013.01.22.06.49.18 (version=TLSv1.1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Tue, 22 Jan 2013 06:49:19 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" To: "MG List" References: Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2013 14:35:18 -0000 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net This is just one of the reasons I won't use it, their advertising smacks too much of bull-sh*t. ----- Original Message ----- > The reason for the repeated confusion is that in this case, the word > "Racing" is just marketing baloney. VR-1 synthetic "Racing Oil" is > apparently a street oil. I have not seen any reference to two different > grades or types of VR-1 -- just different weights. > > Traditional "dino" (non-synthetic) Valvoline Racing Oil is just that -- > racing oil, not recommended for street use. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 22 14:06:35 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C203940E45 for ; Tue, 22 Jan 2013 14:06:35 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm30-vm0.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com (nm30-vm0.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com [98.139.44.194]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A6E740559 for ; Tue, 22 Jan 2013 14:03:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.139.44.101] by nm30.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Jan 2013 20:59:41 -0000 Received: from [67.195.15.62] by tm6.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Jan 2013 20:59:41 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp103.sbc.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Jan 2013 20:59:41 -0000 I_GoCXeoCOciszf3qFd2tVEpL.xSoL_On5AR7Y9R_TGC27r1hntWi0EygONJ 3rUVNjyV8fFYIh762G2ffR.DijgTLM6vvVxxZZ3zDIzpKdBNY2LE_sTAy96r Nipy0rY5ugIOpBPDlUlwxQrYU7xOoUt0T20Vso2Vu1OUb5Qn_bDLGKcrqFpG aevbqvED8TTOcNnDsRvz3XSpqUILIdddwDJ5W4DaqX8QMq1vFQ7pkxedUJfq eRPtLqMfYpWZTNwpGOI44TK.ZsFJvh3ZeXf4yLnghdw4UXvdSppKhdQq3gxk wXe1N61p4c36G1HjlBvqJtVM17LkLAXgz_rbOK9FLMOysIf05mOEVJHv2Oxl Br54LdLJK1KVk9WLUDlpfm7_TyFZcCACrr0wO5iDlIPrrwwVJLFPwk8ccnbR S0EaHwDKtVybfVtB7wwdAlrUZ Received: from [10.0.1.8] (mike@70.226.201.172 with plain) by smtp103.sbc.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2013 12:59:41 -0800 PST From: Duvall Video Productions Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2013 14:59:40 -0600 References: To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] Brand confusion Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Nothing like brand confusion ----- VR1 is ok but the one called "Specialty Racing" labeled "Not Street Legal" indicates it has fewer detergents.... do you know anyone ticketed for using the wrong oil in their car? (joke in case you missed the humor....) VR1 Racing Oil (VR1) VR1 racing motor oil provides true race-level protection with an anti-foam system effective against extreme stress. Valvoline. Specialty Racing Oil ("Not Street Legal") Optimized for track-use, specialty racing oil provides increased horsepower and extreme wear protection. Valvoline. Racing Synthetic (VR1) Motor Oil Advanced racing synthetic motor oil is proven to maximize horsepower during demanding driving conditions. > > You didn't read all the post, maybe. The VR-1 Racing Oil has all the > additives for street use. > > CR > On 1/20/2013 11:01 PM, Simon Matthews wrote: >> On Sun, Jan 20, 2013 at 8:30 PM, Charley & Peggy Robinson >> wrote: >>> Dunno why you guys don't just use Valvoline racing oil. >> I think that this has already been discussed. Racing oil doesn't have >> the detergents and other chemicals that are necessary when oil is >> used over a long period and not just for the duration of a race. >> >> Simon _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 22 14:54:39 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC9C042567 for ; Tue, 22 Jan 2013 14:54:39 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from pacmmta51.windstream.net (pacmmta51.windstream.net [162.39.147.110]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E144D40442 for ; Tue, 22 Jan 2013 14:52:41 -0700 (MST) cv=YyVGDYHcjyaboC8PMZJQDCOKL+k1Q4ktildSrd6759U= c=1 sm=0 a=jl2ymW9NZSsA:10 a=We2GSUcPNccA:10 a=fOpwdquTRaQA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=o1OHuDzbAAAA:8 a=Ov22w-J6AAAA:8 a=NoAKp6exAAAA:8 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=9mljLJp0pkwljJ_3yHkA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=ILCZio5HsAgA:10 a=SdvNMj5PkgcA:10 a=B0cvAcWxpcAA:10 a=JdGvT7tcplY+3SYK8pD2Uw==:117 Authentication-Results: pacmmta51 smtp.user=ccrobins@ktc.com; auth=pass (PLAIN) Received: from [75.91.228.235] ([75.91.228.235:53444] helo=[127.0.0.1]) by pacmmta51 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39824M)) with ESMTPA id C6/1F-05157-7290FF05; Tue, 22 Jan 2013 16:48:23 -0500 Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2013 15:48:04 -0600 From: Charley & Peggy Robinson Organization: Computer Helpers User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130107 Thunderbird/17.0.2 To: frankk12@verizon.net References: <20130120.172102.30674.3@webmail-beta02.vgs.untd.com> <50FCC45F.3020106@ktc.com> <55FD15CD0DC0481894049D57B46761B9@frankdcczr6l6k> Cc: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Shucks, the advertising guys can call it whatever they want to. ;-) Maybe you need to read the fine print on the jug. CR On 1/22/2013 8:08 AM, frankk12@verizon.net wrote: > CR: If it is engineered for racing is it good for street use? The > local Napa store only has the racing version and not the street one. > Frank > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charley & Peggy Robinson" > > To: > Cc: ; > Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2013 11:30 PM > Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux > > >> Dunno why you guys don't just use Valvoline racing oil. >> >> CR >> On 1/20/2013 4:21 PM, mgbob@juno.com wrote: >>> Frank, >>> RedLine has a ZDDP additive, $16 for eight ounces, when I bought >>> some. Use >>> four ounces in the sump. >>> Bob >>> >>> >>> ---------- Original Message ---------- >>> From: >>> To: "MG List" >>> Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux >>> Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 17:12:35 -0500 >>> >>> As a follow-up and conclusion to my earlier post requesting >>> information about >>> sources for ZDDP I offer the latest issue of the MGB Driver tech >>> issue. On >>> page 25 in the article, "Basic B: Adjust Those Vaves", is a section >>> regarding >>> the need for ZDDP. One of the sources cited there is the Rislone Oil >>> Supplement with ZDDP. Today I made trip to the local Pep Boys and >>> found the >>> last two 11 ounce bottles of the product, cost was $9 per bottle. >>> The author >>> suggests half a quart which I conclude is 16 ounces. Since each >>> bottle I >>> bought is 11 ounces I have an ample supply for one of my Bs. >>> Frank Krajewski >>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 23 08:17:22 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 989B7425A7 for ; Wed, 23 Jan 2013 08:17:22 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from admin.nni.com (admin.nni.com [216.107.0.100]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23C104056B for ; Wed, 23 Jan 2013 08:13:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from [199.46.198.232] (account eugeneb@nni.com) by admin.nni.com (CommuniGate Pro WebUser 4.1.8) with HTTP id 480574982; Wed, 23 Jan 2013 10:08:02 -0500 From: "Eugene Balinski" To: ccrobins@ktc.com,frankk12@verizon.net Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2013 10:08:02 -0500 Cc: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net The local NAPA stores can order the street version. Just ask them. On Tue, 22 Jan 2013 15:48:04 -0600 Charley & Peggy Robinson wrote: > Shucks, the advertising guys can call it whatever they > want to. ;-) Maybe you need to read the fine print on > the jug. > > CR > On 1/22/2013 8:08 AM, frankk12@verizon.net wrote: > > CR: If it is engineered for racing is it good for > street use? The > > local Napa store only has the racing version and not > the street one. > > Frank > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charley & Peggy > Robinson" > > > > To: > > Cc: ; > > Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2013 11:30 PM > > Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux > > > > > >> Dunno why you guys don't just use Valvoline racing > oil. > >> > >> CR > >> On 1/20/2013 4:21 PM, mgbob@juno.com wrote: > >>> Frank, > >>> RedLine has a ZDDP additive, $16 for eight ounces, > when I bought > >>> some. Use > >>> four ounces in the sump. > >>> Bob > >>> > >>> > >>> ---------- Original Message ---------- > >>> From: > >>> To: "MG List" > >>> Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux > >>> Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 17:12:35 -0500 > >>> > >>> As a follow-up and conclusion to my earlier post > requesting > >>> information about > >>> sources for ZDDP I offer the latest issue of the MGB > Driver tech > >>> issue. On > >>> page 25 in the article, "Basic B: Adjust Those > Vaves", is a section > >>> regarding > >>> the need for ZDDP. One of the sources cited there is > the Rislone Oil > >>> Supplement with ZDDP. Today I made trip to the > local Pep Boys and > >>> found the > >>> last two 11 ounce bottles of the product, cost was $9 > per bottle. > >>> The author > >>> suggests half a quart which I conclude is 16 ounces. > Since each > >>> bottle I > >>> bought is 11 ounces I have an ample supply for one of > my Bs. > >>> Frank Krajewski > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/eugeneb@nni.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider. http://www.nni.com/ _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 23 14:26:34 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B19140E1F for ; Wed, 23 Jan 2013 14:26:34 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from smtp650.redcondor.net (smtp650.redcondor.net [208.80.206.50]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB37E40558 for ; Wed, 23 Jan 2013 14:23:40 -0700 (MST) Received: from cgp.netins.net ([167.142.228.73]) by smtp650.redcondor.net ({9ef01f99-b982-4add-83fd-b7c41c74273c}) via TCP (outbound) with ESMTP id 20130123211821836; Wed, 23 Jan 2013 21:18:21 +0000 Received: from [208.126.78.151] (account riverside@southslope.net HELO rileyPC) by cgpf1.cgp.netins.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.13) with ESMTPA id 472375132; Wed, 23 Jan 2013 15:18:08 -0600 From: To: "Eugene Balinski" , , References: Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2013 15:18:06 -0600 Cc: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net A visit to the Brad Penn website may be useful to some of you. art de armond -----Original Message----- From: Eugene Balinski Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2013 9:08 AM To: ccrobins@ktc.com ; frankk12@verizon.net Cc: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux The local NAPA stores can order the street version. Just ask them. On Tue, 22 Jan 2013 15:48:04 -0600 Charley & Peggy Robinson wrote: > Shucks, the advertising guys can call it whatever they > want to. ;-) Maybe you need to read the fine print on > the jug. > > CR > On 1/22/2013 8:08 AM, frankk12@verizon.net wrote: > > CR: If it is engineered for racing is it good for > street use? The > > local Napa store only has the racing version and not > the street one. > > Frank > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charley & Peggy > Robinson" > > > > To: > > Cc: ; > > Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2013 11:30 PM > > Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux > > > > > >> Dunno why you guys don't just use Valvoline racing > oil. > >> > >> CR > >> On 1/20/2013 4:21 PM, mgbob@juno.com wrote: > >>> Frank, > >>> RedLine has a ZDDP additive, $16 for eight ounces, > when I bought > >>> some. Use > >>> four ounces in the sump. > >>> Bob > >>> > >>> > >>> ---------- Original Message ---------- > >>> From: > >>> To: "MG List" > >>> Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux > >>> Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 17:12:35 -0500 > >>> > >>> As a follow-up and conclusion to my earlier post > requesting > >>> information about > >>> sources for ZDDP I offer the latest issue of the MGB > Driver tech > >>> issue. On > >>> page 25 in the article, "Basic B: Adjust Those > Vaves", is a section > >>> regarding > >>> the need for ZDDP. One of the sources cited there is > the Rislone Oil > >>> Supplement with ZDDP. Today I made trip to the > local Pep Boys and > >>> found the > >>> last two 11 ounce bottles of the product, cost was $9 > per bottle. > >>> The author > >>> suggests half a quart which I conclude is 16 ounces. > Since each > >>> bottle I > >>> bought is 11 ounces I have an ample supply for one of > my Bs. > >>> Frank Krajewski > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/eugeneb@nni.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider. http://www.nni.com/ _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/riverside@southslope.net ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2013.0.2890 / Virus Database: 2639/6050 - Release Date: 01/22/13 _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 23 17:02:48 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D69F40E11 for ; Wed, 23 Jan 2013 17:02:48 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from imta-38.everyone.net (imta-35.everyone.net [216.200.145.35]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 495B940540 for ; Wed, 23 Jan 2013 17:02:40 -0700 (MST) Received: from pps.filterd (omta001 [127.0.0.1]) by imta-38.everyone.net (8.14.4/8.14.4) with SMTP id r0NNvxrS028718; Wed, 23 Jan 2013 15:58:23 -0800 Received: by dm0201.mta.everyone.net (EON-AUTHRELAY2 - 4830971d) id dm0201.50ef9181.12a6a58; Wed, 23 Jan 2013 15:58:17 -0800 From: "Chad" To: "'Paul Osborne'" , "'James Schulte'" References: , <1358636383.36956.YahooMailNeo@web180903.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> <636AB532-E2DE-48BA-A4BA-697780A140C4@ece.rochester.edu> Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2013 17:58:18 -0600 Thread-index: Ac32nu8UzcE16ei9RN2MTpWvTqHpTADJniAQ Content-language: en-us engine=2.50.10432:5.9.8327,1.0.431,0.0.0000 definitions=2013-01-23_08:2013-01-23,2013-01-23,1970-01-01 signatures=0 spamscore=0 ipscore=0 suspectscore=2 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=6.0.2-1211240000 definitions=main-1301230217 Cc: "'Mgs@autox.team.net'" , 'Magnette ZAZB' Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net That's what I was about to say. No reason to special order... Chad -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Paul Osborne Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2013 5:41 PM To: James Schulte Cc: Mgs@autox.team.net; Magnette ZAZB Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump If you are going for original , yes order the bolt, if you need to get in in and running and it is 5/16 I would run a 5/16 24 tap through it and put in a matching bolt. paulo On Jan 19, 2013, at 6:10 PM, James Schulte wrote: > So is it 5/8 or 5/16 26 BSF thread? Barney says 5/8 and Steve says 5/16. > Would a hardware store carry this or do I have to order this special > from an > MG supply dealer? > Thanks for the info!! > Jim > > > Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 14:59:43 -0800 > From: schris51@att.net > Subject: Re: Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump > To: zmagnette@mgcars.org.uk > > 5/16-26 BSF Steve Christiansen > Ol Phartz Partz714-686-1236www.olphartz.comschris51@att.net > > > From: "schultejim@msn.com" > To: Magnette group > Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2013 2:01 PM > Subject: Re: Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump > > > 5/16 fine 24 seems to be close but is it fine 28? I don't have one of > hose to > try. > Jim > > Sent via the HTC Vivid, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone > > ----- Reply message ----- > From: "schultejim@msn.com" > To: "Magnette group" , "MG List" > > Subject: Mounting bolt for s.u. fuel pump > Date: Sat, Jan 19, 2013 4:39 pm > > > Folks, > I am having trouble finding a bolt that will attach to the s.u. fuel > pump which in turn will attach to a bracket on the MG. I have tried > fine thread and > course thread and none seem to go further then 1 full turn. It looks > like fine > to me but is it tapered? > Jim in the garage with Sun light fading (-' > > Sent via the HTC Vivid, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation > $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/paul@ece.rochester.edu _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mgb72@airmail.net _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 24 12:36:11 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EB5F40E5F for ; Thu, 24 Jan 2013 12:36:11 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm20-vm0.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com (nm20-vm0.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com [98.139.44.174]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 12BFC40E50 for ; Thu, 24 Jan 2013 12:35:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.139.44.96] by nm20.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Jan 2013 19:31:05 -0000 Received: from [67.195.22.113] by tm1.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Jan 2013 19:31:05 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp115.sbc.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Jan 2013 19:31:05 -0000 y.Iy5ReQCXqP4gbcSgzLHiu0Meb9h5QCGTAJoa0gzaFu3x4o8z8Tr9wxbTe6 .HegP.g97l49wT7Af8b6xSsqVyDhiFxX55JnXfbzLbaM4c.tNtscqA9McQaF F09OBUt_14S5oQ4xr.M4YmPcdVlrz3wd4ofMaA4qZ.4DWATW7FMGB8MjT9Ei 1gvL6ax8Rn2eJ5UbWTwr6s_fmGXm07X7JHqBY.fqUyiyh5WSGG5hxcSf5byK zX9TbfyE4xpAHOKtTmwTIiXBxYb6KClRxcRvOG_lZ8cbabv.63Fb6mJbeZ7P HVwOnF9qtNM9.5c4HJnMldpgif.9xRyB5nzydZ0aos3CQZbQmM02cZSFeK08 Ffj7M8r4U_i6rqVS6xfw.ufmnDtr2uykR7v_5wZjUxjxiERSONPgtXIkQ_q2 d4oljyXlqJosCXiha70rLk7gNqWSkyuSSpSgE.Wt7bOu8fkoEY2szc36um3g sZjtM1Pc9Ab7GLF0M6l4rTlsftmsZmkbIWgZKaKxb3r5oNjheIyR3lJINOQj dt8IdBxaPQOjew51ekhBzSRpb4u9BLc4- Received: from [10.0.1.8] (mike@70.226.201.172 with plain) by smtp115.sbc.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2013 11:31:05 -0800 PST From: Duvall Video Productions Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2013 13:31:03 -0600 References: To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] reading the fine print Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I guess most people haven't figured out if they add anything to their oil it voids the oil manufactures warranty.... http://www.mobil.us/USA-English-LCW/carengineoils_mobil-super-warranty.aspx > > A visit to the Brad Penn website may be useful to some of you. > > art de armond > > -----Original Message----- > From: Eugene Balinski > Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2013 9:08 AM > To: ccrobins@ktc.com ; frankk12@verizon.net > Cc: MG List > Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux > > The local NAPA stores can order the street version. Just > ask them. > > On Tue, 22 Jan 2013 15:48:04 -0600 > Charley & Peggy Robinson wrote: >> Shucks, the advertising guys can call it whatever they >> want to. ;-) Maybe you need to read the fine print on >> the jug. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 24 13:14:51 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C548A40E53 for ; Thu, 24 Jan 2013 13:14:51 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC1D24052B for ; Thu, 24 Jan 2013 13:10:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-74.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.74]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0OK6Xcw030571 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 24 Jan 2013 12:06:35 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2013 11:41:10 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] reading the fine print Thread-Index: Ac36asJ8kYgPc17q6060b+j9pF7pHw== Subject: Re: [Mgs] reading the fine print Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Huh. I can't imagine anyone has ever collected on an oil manufacturer's warranty. Even if you can show receipts for every oil change over the life of the car (to "prove" you used their oil exclusively), they can always claim you abused the engine by overrevving it, or running low on coolant, or something. -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 1/24/13 11:31 AM, Duvall Video Productions at mike@duvallvideo.com wrote: > I guess most people haven't figured out if they add anything to their oil it > voids the oil manufactures warranty.... > > > http://www.mobil.us/USA-English-LCW/carengineoils_mobil-super-warranty.aspx > > >> >> A visit to the Brad Penn website may be useful to some of you. >> >> art de armond >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Eugene Balinski >> Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2013 9:08 AM >> To: ccrobins@ktc.com ; frankk12@verizon.net >> Cc: MG List >> Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP Redux >> >> The local NAPA stores can order the street version. Just >> ask them. >> >> On Tue, 22 Jan 2013 15:48:04 -0600 >> Charley & Peggy Robinson wrote: >>> Shucks, the advertising guys can call it whatever they >>> want to. ;-) Maybe you need to read the fine print on >>> the jug. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 25 12:44:39 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EE5D40EA0 for ; Fri, 25 Jan 2013 12:44:39 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm20-vm0.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com (nm20-vm0.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com [98.139.44.174]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 852B04052C for ; Fri, 25 Jan 2013 12:44:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.139.44.97] by nm20.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Jan 2013 19:39:56 -0000 Received: from [67.195.22.119] by tm2.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Jan 2013 19:39:56 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp114.sbc.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Jan 2013 19:39:56 -0000 iTgEjwmNaamqfZIJsCe5B92U58vwA0IyYhgZhBr9P.FYTMRekNeL52WLnKL9 IL.wtM9vJIVjRHUGqRdJu4ZUf7vIS7X5VBNBMkx6KMm2sdYGYckaJmdMRN9a LBbwWZoVvE0YssurEDz5B.uNmvMISbIYaQjhmgb1276FCmLKSBJsdy_rQuaO iJ82RsbaNGELfDFsncMOLxuGEhoH2G8_yi9kOhNTc_xhaHarswlT1TtTzxnc H4GpDyFdOtGGctk9LhKgz9kv9iFEfCXDELhKyNPx6JMSC2X4GaglXAgiMJ2K OJudDqfxE.tXXPUu2BK7lrrdLiJ2zZAJ6eTdQemLmM93S0RCK.wuMyHLjhzA o1q6T6tKiqJ8qE1xyjtxiMwUP0bVca77JifCMTMFjMiXV9rYHebpDDqXv0pM r_R.uUkITCYjaTwoEvSTBnn4x Received: from [10.0.1.8] (mike@70.226.201.172 with plain) by smtp114.sbc.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2013 11:39:55 -0800 PST From: Duvall Video Productions Date: Fri, 25 Jan 2013 13:39:54 -0600 References: To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] Mgs Digest, Vol 68, Issue 27 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I can't imagine an individual collecting either but that doesn't mean manufacturers want to leave themselves open to class action suits and consumer advocates by providing phony warranties and products.... > > > Huh. I can't imagine anyone has ever collected on an oil manufacturer's > warranty. > > Even if you can show receipts for every oil change over the life of the car > (to "prove" you used their oil exclusively), they can always claim you > abused the engine by overrevving it, or running low on coolant, or > something. > > -- > > Max Heim > '66 MGB GHN3L76149 > If you're near Menlo Park, CA, > it's the primer red one with chrome wires _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 28 10:31:15 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4FCAC4053C for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 10:31:15 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from out02.dlls.pa.frontiernet.net (out02.dlls.pa.frontiernet.net [199.224.80.229]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3166640324 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 10:30:44 -0700 (MST) Received: from relay02.dlls.pa.frontiernet.net ([199.224.80.245]) by out02.dlls.pa.frontiernet.net with ESMTP; 28 Jan 2013 17:26:04 +0000 Received: from valuedea617bbe (clsm-74-212-19-253-pppoe.dsl.clsm.epix.net [74.212.19.253]) by relay02.dlls.pa.frontiernet.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 5226A4A059 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 17:26:04 +0000 (UTC) From: "Carr&Edwards" To: "MG list" Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 12:26:02 -0500 Subject: [Mgs] panel-light rheostat Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net We recently salvaged a panel-light rheostat from the remains of a B in the local junkyard, but have been unable to get the shaft to turn -- we presume it's corroded, as the car had been sitting out, topless, for some time. Any suggestions on how to free it up? Sarah Carr B/GT in PA _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 28 11:14:48 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 04373422A1 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 11:14:48 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D0F04056A for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 11:14:43 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-110.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.110]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0SIA0Dh026264 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 10:10:02 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 09:54:33 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] panel-light rheostat Thread-Index: Ac39gIc6E66+e6IshE2P4kEVRQRpGQ== Subject: Re: [Mgs] panel-light rheostat Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Those things barely worked in the first place. I wouldn't hold out much hope that it could be revived after corroding into immobility. Sorry. -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 1/28/13 9:26 AM, Carr&Edwards at scvc70@epix.net wrote: > We recently salvaged a panel-light rheostat from the remains of a B in the > local junkyard, but have been unable to get the shaft to turn -- we presume > it's corroded, as the car had been sitting out, topless, for some time. Any > suggestions on how to free it up? > > Sarah Carr > B/GT in PA > _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 28 11:29:08 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C837422A7 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 11:29:08 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-qc0-f171.google.com (mail-qc0-f171.google.com [209.85.216.171]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8FE54056A for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 11:27:26 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-qc0-f171.google.com with SMTP id d1so1431174qca.16 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 10:22:46 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:x-received:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=IhCjIyRP0mjxoG1Rg2yLaTaCaZ5OzslD8f6eSXpxK44=; b=wh0W5oUjfS9B889kec4q4vbzj43JEXZjUZ136xIybWm8ikxkhccxDBmG5Y99o08J3u bCW1H+2KLC3SpRVZh97yHFeBXafqsuChOBxHiymbIj3or/fIIEOjfMOq4mRpaM4lul8r wb0fYUcSaSwCZ6DzhB+lGrT5KIsyaPGHYyYC+P4cPl52N7dMw0mIu1URsJoDFXWuyGVz nTqLrFVAd3+9GaZnCgsaV99FqcdIYL7h2wbinutEJkIh4a8+uSuUeGDgMYnfIpDu2ngw /j0dTdH2OOg+/VIsp2F8h8tkS8IVjyXq8Lry32a3xcCibRjsPbd0pSr6bBlIXZzVNaec bNjA== h12mr16972961qad.73.1359397364633; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 10:22:44 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.49.35.112 with HTTP; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 10:22:44 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.49.35.112 with HTTP; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 10:22:44 -0800 (PST) References: <813973A702AB47EBBB0F0615BF0366A0@valuedea617bbe> Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 12:22:44 -0600 From: Paul Root To: Max Heim Cc: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] panel-light rheostat Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Probably start with naval jelly or other rust eating stuff. But, I wouldn't hold out much hope in it working. sent from my Android phone On Jan 28, 2013 12:10 PM, "Max Heim" wrote: > Those things barely worked in the first place. I wouldn't hold out much > hope > that it could be revived after corroding into immobility. Sorry. > > > -- > > Max Heim > '66 MGB GHN3L76149 > If you're near Menlo Park, CA, > it's the primer red one with chrome wires > > > on 1/28/13 9:26 AM, Carr&Edwards at scvc70@epix.net wrote: > > > We recently salvaged a panel-light rheostat from the remains of a B in > the > > local junkyard, but have been unable to get the shaft to turn -- we > presume > > it's corroded, as the car had been sitting out, topless, for some time. > Any > > suggestions on how to free it up? > > > > Sarah Carr > > B/GT in PA > > _______________________________________________ > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/ptrmgb@gmail.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 28 12:31:02 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 298694069A for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 12:31:02 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm16.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com (nm16.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com [98.139.44.143]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7812840513 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 12:24:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.139.44.99] by nm16.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2013 19:19:43 -0000 Received: from [98.138.84.173] by tm4.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2013 19:19:43 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp107.sbc.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2013 19:19:43 -0000 kpwVIqejyGYjLHnR4JgZ8NdMYqq7gnDzeuXVCFyKQQZAdaulJ6rX8rN6C58o jeMOWbpBOND8mJhSCPaEdbQ5N4O.rlahfvP96pMoTuE3B9jGntP8YFaOzBm_ X4b8TDSiqa9AjkO_s8K9hatBQB3kpfJXuQatNNuroYhy1YxPVSXdaRfie2_F CwLBnCJ8owMrLi9Z0ObW3cLQS6FDCS7xisUlkvHRngiwrmwkAcnt0ggskOEr 64xYpLOOQlUsVNjcNDlsQNxvTHPelLs1xH0ruwoZIUkTk64_3jwoA3h2VANl EGUiZFB.NFUGntFQWpVaICjtguZKucbBVHcLeYH24yKk08d_RlH6XYi6ZKNz 3H31fSl93kpjd_QcqIsiTgvwgdPBwuOt5J3Bk9z.knKd.fwQ_xfugtU4Dlnf knSM2 Received: from [10.0.1.8] (mike@70.226.194.78 with plain) by smtp107.sbc.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2013 11:19:42 -0800 PST From: Duvall Video Productions Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 13:19:40 -0600 References: To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] cleaning rheostat Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sarah- Go to radio shack and get a non-spray can of head cleaner and a can of tuner or electronics cleaner. Take the knob off and dump the head cleaner and the rheostat in the jar and let it soak for at least 24 hours. Use alcohol if you can't find head cleaner. After soaking, shoot it out really well with the tuner cleaner. Let it soak for awhile in the tuner cleaner. Don't force turn it hard or you could damage the windings. Keep spraying with the tuner until it frees up. Take an ohm meter and test it for function _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 28 12:46:17 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9563542282 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 12:46:17 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from fmailhost06.isp.att.net (fmailhost06.isp.att.net [207.115.11.56]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 852DA40513 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 12:44:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from station1 (adsl-98-94-199-169.ard.bellsouth.net[98.94.199.169]) by isp.att.net (frfwmhc06) with SMTP id <20130128194014H06004v39ue>; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 19:40:15 +0000 From: "Bill Snyder" To: Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 14:40:59 -0500 Thread-Index: Ac39j2WRXp4wffQBRE2YQpr65pNZYg== Content-Language: en-us Subject: [Mgs] Fuel Issue Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I have a '66B that I cranked after a 6-month hiatus a few days ago. It started but ran very rough as if on 3 cylinders. I put in fresh plugs, checked the dizzy cap and cleaned it contacts as well as the rotor. There was no change. After re-inspecting the plugs, it appears that the 4th cylinder was not firing, but the plug was not gas or oil fouled. Laying the plug out on the block, attached to the plug wire and cranking showed the plug firing properly, so I am apparently getting no fuel to that cylinder. Can anyone run me through the procedure to check on that issue? It has Petronix ignition and has been converted to negative ground. Thanks in advance. Bill Snyder Waynesville, NC _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 28 13:01:42 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CD8840567 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 13:01:42 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from relay02.pair.com (relay02.pair.com [209.68.5.16]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 0758940533 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 12:54:03 -0700 (MST) Received: (qmail 82862 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2013 19:49:20 -0000 Received: from 97.96.111.81 (HELO mullet) (97.96.111.81) by relay02.pair.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2013 19:49:20 -0000 From: "Stephen West-Fisher" To: References: <000001cdfd8f$665bb810$33132830$@net> Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 14:48:48 -0500 Thread-Index: Ac39j2WRXp4wffQBRE2YQpr65pNZYgAAPq/g Content-Language: en-us Subject: Re: [Mgs] Fuel Issue Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Since you didn't mention it can we assume you didn't have a strong smell of fuel when you shut it down? -- Stephen West-Fisher N4IK -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bill Snyder Sent: Monday, January 28, 2013 2:41 PM To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] Fuel Issue I have a '66B that I cranked after a 6-month hiatus a few days ago. It started but ran very rough as if on 3 cylinders. I put in fresh plugs, checked the dizzy cap and cleaned it contacts as well as the rotor. There was no change. After re-inspecting the plugs, it appears that the 4th cylinder was not firing, but the plug was not gas or oil fouled. Laying the plug out on the block, attached to the plug wire and cranking showed the plug firing properly, so I am apparently getting no fuel to that cylinder. Can anyone run me through the procedure to check on that issue? It has Petronix ignition and has been converted to negative ground. Thanks in advance. Bill Snyder Waynesville, NC _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/steve@coastaldatasystems.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 28 13:16:43 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 982CE422E3 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 13:16:43 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-pa0-f53.google.com (mail-pa0-f53.google.com [209.85.220.53]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0492040533 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 13:07:09 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-pa0-f53.google.com with SMTP id bg4so32513pad.12 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 12:02:29 -0800 (PST) s=20120113; h=x-received:references:in-reply-to:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding:content-type:message-id:cc:x-mailer:from :subject:date:to; bh=uaVDIR+rS00NToKGkpf2+gdReImWchdimxIjt8mlez4=; b=LdlpFQPlNm5dQyW6pU8XNs1IeeMRIyzWT1V3Yxd/0oxXItn0vONgYjwp4An5ZBTcyW LHM0Rf8d0EcMbwzfE8lT/Y4X+IBh6KyV1GQSuqKaAjFbqKb4M07HqQVCo8qsnc/pshTI +MSTMnyNtr+DQCmsQ7N4opu7L+m8xVxE6VGj/XYjrY1qVwM2Ful/L8qNwUjrnuTvc7io Usxsmq0836+q95ROSs08ZNVF25NXIzE8aGcjIgbnkBFquHTXjVmHDiJOYsFjEpcfy6r0 fs23hD+XBybm+KoHeeki18IkOA9KoEJPRJ7lKpQMjYl87b0KSGcWPWbclY40nYMPrAos WtAQ== pw2mr14904859pbb.97.1359403349305; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 12:02:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from [10.134.241.128] (mobile-166-137-182-211.mycingular.net. [166.137.182.211]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id wh8sm6840016pbc.75.2013.01.28.12.02.27 (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Mon, 28 Jan 2013 12:02:28 -0800 (PST) References: <000001cdfd8f$665bb810$33132830$@net> From: Richard Ewald Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 12:02:23 -0800 To: Bill Snyder Cc: "" Subject: Re: [Mgs] Fuel Issue Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Check the piston in rear rear carb for free movement. Of that is OK, check the needle and seat. Sent from my iPhone On Jan 28, 2013, at 11:40, "Bill Snyder" wrote: > I have a '66B that I cranked after a 6-month hiatus a few days ago. It > started but ran very rough as if on 3 cylinders. I put in fresh plugs, > checked the dizzy cap and cleaned it contacts as well as the rotor. There > was no change. After re-inspecting the plugs, it appears that the 4th > cylinder was not firing, but the plug was not gas or oil fouled. Laying the > plug out on the block, attached to the plug wire and cranking showed the > plug firing properly, so I am apparently getting no fuel to that cylinder. > Can anyone run me through the procedure to check on that issue? It has > Petronix ignition and has been converted to negative ground. Thanks in > advance. > > Bill Snyder > > Waynesville, NC > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/richard.ewald@gmail.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 28 13:17:20 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EB5742459 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 13:17:20 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A23040533 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 13:14:44 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-110.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.110]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0SKA0Ak004114 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 12:10:02 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 12:05:21 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] Fuel Issue Thread-Index: Ac39j2WRXp4wffQBRE2YQpr65pNZYgAA2duo Subject: Re: [Mgs] Fuel Issue Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Hmm, seems to me the only way it could not be getting fuel to one cylinder would be if that intake valve were stuck shut, which would imply one of several other problems (broken valve stem, rocker, pushrod or lifter; or wildly out of adjustment). Did you try checking compression? Also, did you compare the spark with that of the other cylinders? Did you try swapping out that spark plug? on 1/28/13 11:40 AM, Bill Snyder at wtsnyder@bellsouth.net wrote: > I have a '66B that I cranked after a 6-month hiatus a few days ago. It > started but ran very rough as if on 3 cylinders. I put in fresh plugs, > checked the dizzy cap and cleaned it contacts as well as the rotor. There > was no change. After re-inspecting the plugs, it appears that the 4th > cylinder was not firing, but the plug was not gas or oil fouled. Laying the > plug out on the block, attached to the plug wire and cranking showed the > plug firing properly, so I am apparently getting no fuel to that cylinder. > Can anyone run me through the procedure to check on that issue? It has > Petronix ignition and has been converted to negative ground. Thanks in > advance. > > Bill Snyder > > Waynesville, NC -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 28 13:17:37 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3DE6E422A7 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 13:17:37 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com (outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com [64.136.55.36]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id B658F40533 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 13:15:18 -0700 (MST) s=alpha; t=1359403836; bh=47DEQpj8HBSa+/TImW+5JCeuQeRkm5NMpJWZG3hSuFU=; l=0; h=From:Date:To:Subject:Message-Id:Content-Type; b=VtF+fWUaDdJiXUAhiA8GVgh4orgJhHfb4GBsvPfGqqumnTfPWqnss4iOnyz6KUj/f Zf7UpoW2QHB+0TbnXayWVdJuRVji3eNlG0ptLLa91zOfaks/mJjDM7Fis4KXil+peK esXbUdh7r6vjDpSpdlDxiWqIjqQZovCLKo/AJ3Aw= Received: from outbound-bu1.vgs.untd.com (webmail-beta02.vgs.untd.com [10.181.12.102]) by smtpout04.vgs.untd.com with SMTP id AABJSPY2PAB7B8M2 for (sender ); Mon, 28 Jan 2013 12:09:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from [108.88.216.197] by webmail-beta02.vgs.untd.com with HTTP: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 20:08:15 GMT From: "mgbob@juno.com" Full-Name: "mgbob@juno.com" Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 20:08:15 GMT To: scvc70@epix.net, mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] panel-light rheostat Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Try Liquid Wrench, or equivalent, on the shaft to free it, then use an electronics cleaner spray (Radio Shack carries it) to clean the contact and winding inside the porcelain. Instrument illumination in MGBs is weak, at best, and the rheostat even at full on seems to dim the lights a bit. Many leave the rheostat in place, but connect both incoming and outgoing wires to the same screw. Going further in the quest for legible instruments, white paint inside the housing can help a bit.BobB/GT sulking in the garage, unhappy with snow and road salt. ---------- Original Message ---------- From: "Carr&Edwards" To: "MG list" Subject: [Mgs] panel-light rheostat Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 12:26:02 -0500 We recently salvaged a panel-light rheostat from the remains of a B in the local junkyard, but have been unable to get the shaft to turn -- we presume it's corroded, as the car had been sitting out, topless, for some time. Any suggestions on how to free it up? Sarah Carr B/GT in PA _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mgbob@juno.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 28 13:21:39 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2EAD4069A for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 13:21:39 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from theta.look.ca (theta.look.ca [216.66.192.9]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D66740517 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 13:21:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from e120-pool-d89a5aef.brdbnd.telnetcommunications.com ([216.154.90.239] helo=Barrie-PC.look.ca) by theta.look.ca with esmtpa (user vectis@look.ca)(Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Tzv8H-0005G8-6P; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 15:16:45 -0500 Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 15:12:24 -0500 To: Duvall Video Productions ,mgs@autox.team.net From: Barrie Robinson References: <442C8046-5320-4C8C-8CF3-427A3CFB1EF8@duvallvideo.com> Subject: Re: [Mgs] cleaning rheostat Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sarah, I have restored several such items but yours sounds like toast - best to buy a new one ! At 01:19 PM 28/01/2013 -0600, Duvall Video Productions wrote: >Sarah- Go to radio shack and get a non-spray can of head cleaner and a can of >tuner or electronics cleaner. Take the knob off and dump the head cleaner and >the rheostat in the jar and let it soak for at least 24 hours. Use alcohol if >you can't find head cleaner. > >After soaking, shoot it out really well with the tuner cleaner. Let it soak >for awhile in the tuner cleaner. > >Don't force turn it hard or you could damage the windings. Keep spraying with >the tuner until it frees up. > >Take an ohm meter and test it for function >_______________________________________________ > >Mgs@autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Suggested annual donation $12.75 >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/barrie@look.ca Regards Barrie barrie@look.ca 705-721-9060 _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 28 13:33:08 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD4BE406AA for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 13:33:07 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from fmailhost04.isp.att.net (fmailhost04.isp.att.net [207.115.11.54]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5421540517 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 13:26:07 -0700 (MST) Received: from station1 (adsl-98-94-199-169.ard.bellsouth.net[98.94.199.169]) by isp.att.net (frfwmhc04) with SMTP id <20130128202126H0400aqs6ke>; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 20:21:27 +0000 From: "Bill Snyder" To: Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 15:22:11 -0500 Thread-Index: Ac39lSd+H0pR8N/+Q+aXd3e9MpXUBQ== Content-Language: en-us Subject: [Mgs] Fuel Issue Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Related to my earlier query, I have thought for some time about having my SU's rebuilt. Does anyone have suggestions about who to use and approximate cost? It has been suggested that I check the rear SU piston for free movement, and then the needle and seat which I will do, but possibly not before the weekend. Bill Snyder Waynesville, NC _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 28 14:18:14 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05B3140E6C for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 14:18:14 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E6CF840517 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 14:14:43 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-110.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.110]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0SLA0DB004087 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 13:10:02 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 13:08:26 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] Fuel Issue Thread-Index: Ac39lSd+H0pR8N/+Q+aXd3e9MpXUBQABnWKr Subject: Re: [Mgs] Fuel Issue Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net There is very little to rebuild in an SU -- if the throttle shaft is not overly worn, a thorough cleaning and setup with new needles would be about it. Assuming they aren't as decrepit as mine were, with loose, worn and bent pieces everywhere. In theory you could rebush the throttle shafts yourself, but most people leave that to a specialist. on 1/28/13 12:22 PM, Bill Snyder at wtsnyder@bellsouth.net wrote: > Related to my earlier query, I have thought for some time about having my > SU's rebuilt. Does anyone have suggestions about who to use and approximate > cost? It has been suggested that I check the rear SU piston for free > movement, and then the needle and seat which I will do, but possibly not > before the weekend. > > Bill Snyder > > Waynesville, NC -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 28 15:35:11 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB4764065A for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 15:35:10 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from snt0-omc1-s34.snt0.hotmail.com (snt0-omc1-s34.snt0.hotmail.com [65.55.90.45]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B701F40646 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 15:33:27 -0700 (MST) Received: from SNT124-W51 ([65.55.90.9]) by snt0-omc1-s34.snt0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Mon, 28 Jan 2013 14:28:46 -0800 From: Mike E To: , Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 17:28:46 -0500 References: <000901cdfd95$281c4c30$7854e490$@net> FILETIME=[D639E7D0:01CDFDA6] Subject: Re: [Mgs] Fuel Issue Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Joe Curto comes highly recommended: http://www.joecurto.com/ (NFI, and I don't know him personally.) -Mike EldredWilmington, Vermont > From: wtsnyder@bellsouth.net > To: Mgs@autox.team.net > Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 15:22:11 -0500 > Subject: [Mgs] Fuel Issue > > Related to my earlier query, I have thought for some time about having my > SU's rebuilt. Does anyone have suggestions about who to use and approximate > cost? It has been suggested that I check the rear SU piston for free > movement, and then the needle and seat which I will do, but possibly not > before the weekend. > > Bill Snyder > > Waynesville, NC > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/redscirocco@hotmail.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 28 16:20:48 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CABF740E6C for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 16:20:48 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from pacmmta51.windstream.net (pacmmta51.windstream.net [162.39.147.110]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 00BB040653 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 16:14:22 -0700 (MST) cv=YyVGDYHcjyaboC8PMZJQDCOKL+k1Q4ktildSrd6759U= c=1 sm=0 a=jl2ymW9NZSsA:10 a=We2GSUcPNccA:10 a=fOpwdquTRaQA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=Ov22w-J6AAAA:8 a=mQb35-OR4Un6vavu010A:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=J0aUVQLP0FIA:10 a=m3MdUl94G8cA:10 a=SdvNMj5PkgcA:10 a=P5auZbegKUGb7J55hykblg==:117 Authentication-Results: pacmmta51 smtp.user=ccrobins@ktc.com; auth=pass (PLAIN) Received: from [75.91.230.181] ([75.91.230.181:54713] helo=[127.0.0.1]) by pacmmta51 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39824M)) with ESMTPA id A4/16-05157-43507015; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 18:09:41 -0500 Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 17:09:36 -0600 From: Charley & Peggy Robinson Organization: Computer Helpers User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130107 Thunderbird/17.0.2 To: Bill Snyder References: <000001cdfd8f$665bb810$33132830$@net> Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] Fuel Issue Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net If the valve train is working OK, it may be running on only the front carb. I've run into this. CR On 1/28/2013 1:40 PM, Bill Snyder wrote: > I have a '66B that I cranked after a 6-month hiatus a few days ago. It > started but ran very rough as if on 3 cylinders. I put in fresh plugs, > checked the dizzy cap and cleaned it contacts as well as the rotor. There > was no change. After re-inspecting the plugs, it appears that the 4th > cylinder was not firing, but the plug was not gas or oil fouled. Laying the > plug out on the block, attached to the plug wire and cranking showed the > plug firing properly, so I am apparently getting no fuel to that cylinder. > Can anyone run me through the procedure to check on that issue? It has > Petronix ignition and has been converted to negative ground. Thanks in > advance. > > Bill Snyder > > Waynesville, NC > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/ccrobins@ktc.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 28 17:08:46 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 04FF240693 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 17:08:46 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from cmsout01.mbox.net (cmsout03.mbox.net [165.212.64.33]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6DF5E40568 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 17:08:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from co03.mbox.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cmsout01.mbox.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3Yw7GJ4WSmzvR54 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 00:03:36 +0000 (UTC) mtad (C8.MAIN.3.82G) with ESMTP id 790RaCaDI2480M03; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 00:03:34 -0000 Received: from ca33.cms.usa.net [165.212.11.133] by co03.mbox.net via smtad (C8.MAIN.3.88D) with ESMTP id XID407RaCaDI2094X03; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 00:03:34 -0000 ca33.cms.usa.net Received: from web05.cms.usa.net [165.212.8.205] by ca33.cms.usa.net (ESMTP/d.mckinnie@usa.net) via mtad (C8.MAIN.3.82G) with ESMTP id 653RaCaDI1440M33; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 00:03:33 -0000 Received: from 129.79.144.70 [129.79.144.70] by web05.cms.usa.net (USANET web-mailer C8.MAIN.3.88W); Tue, 29 Jan 2013 00:03:33 -0000 Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 19:03:33 -0500 From: "Douglas McKinnie" To: Z-USANET-MsgId: XID653RaCaDI1440X33 Subject: Re: [Mgs] cleaning rheostat Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Several years ago I purchased a Vellman kit to build a 12V DC PWM motor speed controller, with the intention of using that to control the brightness my dash lights. But frankly, even though I spend lots of time driving the MG on twisty unlit roads in the deep woods on moonless stormy nights, I've hardly ever had the thought "You know, my dash lights are just too bright right now". This for a person whose first action in a rental car is turning down the dash lights. Anyway, were I to seek a rheostat for the dash lights today I would probably buy one of the many 12V PWM speed controllers available on Amazon and Ebay, with this one merely as an example: http://www.ebay.com/itm/130574312785 Douglas '70 BGT _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 28 17:37:22 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC8DD42458 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 17:37:22 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm22-vm0.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com (nm22-vm0.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com [98.139.212.126]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0FBE14056E for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 17:36:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.139.212.152] by nm22.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2013 00:31:21 -0000 Received: from [76.13.13.224] by tm9.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2013 00:31:21 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp103-mob.biz.mail.ac4.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2013 00:31:21 -0000 s=s1024; t=1359419481; bh=+llGs80j5FNFL4uNZclqFwtbXHGPayYBqTkwwXXUgIY=; h=X-Yahoo-Newman-Id:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-SMTP:Received:References:Mime-Version:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-Id:Cc:X-Mailer:From:Subject:Date:To; b=OusZK8da4kXIn0vyM4XNYh0nmT3KVvxltGsHYlOTrSN8sySXwAMe29VaXOYhXlR9Sj/aQHoVaoQ+xIM/2rBWB7YCJXFIUsEH0TYcUN30gdMmNqCtDFv3XRUv00yoWMjny/nAK8Msg/V61QWqMDur8ckcyjSMZJwI//2srgNlY+E= AfkRCRnSrfD0CuwJOXCINYZs79H8fpX0dviDXGyxr2mtKXLMN66tULRy40EO cfV_SryU3DCAfaBwM.5Ik7gLplpSBjKgxmcyO1ZzLrD25qPRa5827gPnAbJk 1AybvL1E2AnEvFM8viZfZK0HkCAIzSCfKcr97VZ4lrwvGJySGGexf.rCZEEA Ziiz88ZdvOo6Con8Rv2TFEGp8CoaiBXNPbpT6In6Hgy605f5VJHaIdSLj3tA 11xOrSXFUvVt6e7MgK_1SSs3XCAjN1.f6gcyxM21iO4XAEPXnCgrPGv_7l0q ldh6VKtP0Hd0D8wAuoJ1lqM0xZq2PbBMaTcivgk7RBGII8pDZEDKNVrX2_wb 5wVww8uiqckRF4J8JWfJHIW4tjUToUUWDmtlpIJzchuLwOGHVQlUso5_64Fo Ndg1qla354bD0D3ShDamlxWauKw-- Received: from [192.168.1.71] (james.f.juhas@69.183.26.14 with xymcookie) by smtp103-mob.biz.mail.ac4.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2013 16:31:21 -0800 PST References: <000001cdfd8f$665bb810$33132830$@net> <51070530.7030307@ktc.com> From: Jim Juhas Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 19:31:21 -0500 To: "ccrobins@ktc.com" Cc: Bill Snyder , "mgs@autox.team.net" Subject: Re: [Mgs] Fuel Issue Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Another possibility is a valve stuck open in #4. Check compression. Sent via iPad Jim Juhas On Jan 28, 2013, at 6:09 PM, Charley & Peggy Robinson wrote: > If the valve train is working OK, it may be running on only the front carb. I've run into this. > > CR > On 1/28/2013 1:40 PM, Bill Snyder wrote: >> I have a '66B that I cranked after a 6-month hiatus a few days ago. It >> started but ran very rough as if on 3 cylinders. I put in fresh plugs, >> checked the dizzy cap and cleaned it contacts as well as the rotor. There >> was no change. After re-inspecting the plugs, it appears that the 4th >> cylinder was not firing, but the plug was not gas or oil fouled. Laying the >> plug out on the block, attached to the plug wire and cranking showed the >> plug firing properly, so I am apparently getting no fuel to that cylinder. >> Can anyone run me through the procedure to check on that issue? It has >> Petronix ignition and has been converted to negative ground. Thanks in >> advance. >> >> Bill Snyder >> >> Waynesville, NC >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Mgs@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.75 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/ccrobins@ktc.com > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/james.f.juhas@snet.net _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jan 28 21:28:56 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5628040E34 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 21:28:56 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-bk0-f41.google.com (mail-bk0-f41.google.com [209.85.214.41]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7588E4247E for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 21:28:04 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-bk0-f41.google.com with SMTP id q16so6194bkw.28 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 20:23:20 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:x-received:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=SGk8cglDtqukIr5sLpyZyolJ2wN4b4EMPJtbngMD+sY=; b=Y0rCF4kYQS/4IttMR+nHF9JX0tGPAw2fHlKuQBma3DZfRFEFTlLLfg9kc3UgUr0sWV vGJz0DzM8djcESzJJh84/SXjIL2IPd1x9JnpJAl17r1utZtJtu6ToGA7Oq1ia4YE+irW 8BIp0y+/xDhb808Cg84doyV19xQQ55UjXJQuDRm5ub8Yfve/w2F3c1/v11fGlFZZrEZR mpFxBkCeVDUJleNTNNUdsuukVrEaWOU/YwjEyBdwpxfQ2YSsAhiZ7thSq5cO9WK65nI4 NJ/+Q357Cm7014PCEa3ojcAnR8ce5miugeSn8+mC7uvtP0jl8W8aSnMF0E3pGYwILhkh ziNQ== Mon, 28 Jan 2013 20:23:20 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.205.19.194 with HTTP; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 20:23:20 -0800 (PST) References: <000001cdfd8f$665bb810$33132830$@net> <51070530.7030307@ktc.com> <724A0328-2E23-4F72-BAB8-84072FF9599D@snet.net> Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 20:23:20 -0800 From: Richard Ewald To: Jim Juhas Cc: Bill Snyder , "mgs@autox.team.net" Subject: Re: [Mgs] Fuel Issue Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net And the pushrod bandito might have stolen the intake pushrod for #4, but I would put that about as likely as the #4 valve being stuck open. Assuming the engine was OK when parked, I doubt that a valve would get stuck open or closed without some serious accompanying noises from the motor. Bill made no mention of any unusual noises. A stuck carb on the other hand is quite common, and would not have strange noises accompanying it. I have seen this numerous times over the years. Pull the air cleaners and lift the pistons by hand, do they both rise and fall the same? or is the rear piston stiffer to move? I'll bet 40 quatloos on a carb issue. Rick On Mon, Jan 28, 2013 at 4:31 PM, Jim Juhas wrote: > Another possibility is a valve stuck open in #4. Check compression. > > Sent via iPad > Jim Juhas > > On Jan 28, 2013, at 6:09 PM, Charley & Peggy Robinson > wrote: > > > If the valve train is working OK, it may be running on only the front > carb. > I've run into this. > > > > CR > > On 1/28/2013 1:40 PM, Bill Snyder wrote: > >> I have a '66B that I cranked after a 6-month hiatus a few days ago. It > >> started but ran very rough as if on 3 cylinders. I put in fresh plugs, > >> checked the dizzy cap and cleaned it contacts as well as the rotor. > There > >> was no change. After re-inspecting the plugs, it appears that the 4th > >> cylinder was not firing, but the plug was not gas or oil fouled. Laying > the > >> plug out on the block, attached to the plug wire and cranking showed the > >> plug firing properly, so I am apparently getting no fuel to that > cylinder. > >> Can anyone run me through the procedure to check on that issue? It has > >> Petronix ignition and has been converted to negative ground. Thanks in > >> advance. > >> > >> Bill Snyder > >> > >> Waynesville, NC > >> _______________________________________________ > >> > >> Mgs@autox.team.net > >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > >> Suggested annual donation $12.75 > >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/ccrobins@ktc.com > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/james.f.juhas@snet.net > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/richard.ewald@gmail.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 29 00:35:17 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 584DD40EA7 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 00:35:17 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ie0-f173.google.com (mail-ie0-f173.google.com [209.85.223.173]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4806740E3B for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 00:34:52 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-ie0-f173.google.com with SMTP id 9so79573iec.32 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 23:30:09 -0800 (PST) s=20120113; h=mime-version:x-received:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=ME1a8sKKo3mnhobrbc3EEaaZ/NXYO3LgEz+pp2KPxI8=; b=VUuoHS9qDHX4GRU5wTURj6DBk1GzvByFvNyHKw8f7iYkLqy6PapI8uL8cDa9mQeYLx 0Lr2pNjZJW4TVLh6rdHvHjQu7P5EYwRTIaBMtTLBZPf8gpBW57nQowTtYVBT4RNKGXy3 gVoiphUzQ7uUPYGwBw54Q8AZsx++ZwhHbAOMr2n7WGEz5nbJmLkFfgOra8AiHAW9m/wd ex4Ab4jU/wS9u0Uh/RIt/DXnDIpqVRFMQKrrQX/v8yoX0oKujbMuhnB2KK4mA1V41Nm6 Cw/PjV67/BWJI1sJxACNTxl6wfq9wcRnFgX+thiBXkm28GaK8EEQ8B6cjwv1Hc0mgjPM v3Fw== Mon, 28 Jan 2013 23:30:08 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.64.77.33 with HTTP; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 23:30:08 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 23:30:08 -0800 From: Simon Matthews To: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Can someone explain how Valvolene's VR1 meets the (claimed) SN/SM/SL rating, yet contains the claimed 0.14/0.13 Zinc/Phosphorus? As far as I can see, any oil rated higher than SL MUST contain less than .12% Zinc and Phosphorus. May I offer another solution? Amsoil offers a SG rated 20W50 oil, which is also rated for diesel engines. Simon On Fri, Jan 11, 2013 at 12:01 PM, Eugene Balinski wrote: > IMHO Valvoline VR-1 is suitable for the street IF you > purchase the street version. It has all of the additivives > for the various SAE ratings. Per the web site, > > "Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is a family of race-proven > lubricants formulated to provide high load carrying > characteristics, minimum foaming and maximum resistance to > thermal degradation. Exclusive chemistry reduces internal > friction and enhances power output under extreme service > conditions. Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is recommended > for engines burning gasoline and full or partial alcohol > fuels in track and street service. Valvoline VR-1 Racing > Motor Oil is for use in any car, light truck, van, or SUV > where API SN is recommended(see proper viscosity grade > below)." > > > API SN/SM/SL- 20W-50 > API SH * 10W-30 20W-50 > API CD/CF 10W-30 20W-50 > > http://www.valvoline.com/pdf/vr1_racing.pdf > > > Please point out if I am missing something... > > Gene > 80 B > > > > On Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:01:21 -0800 > Max Heim wrote: >> If you ignore the stipulation that racing oil is not >> suitable for street >> use... >> >> The Mobil1 15w-50 is a street oil. This weight would be >> more suitable for >> winter use, too. >> >> >> -- >> >> Max Heim >> '66 MGB GHN3L76149 >> If you're near Menlo Park, CA, >> it's the primer red one with chrome wires >> >> >> on 1/11/13 6:22 AM, Councill, David at >> dcouncill@msubillings.edu wrote: >> >> > The ZDDP conversations on this list have probably >> exceeded other illustrious >> > topics such as towing with driveline attached or not or >> even pros/cons on >> > weber carbs. The primary solution is the one Jack >> mentions - using Valvoline >> > VR1 racing oil. The problem, at least for me, is that >> 20W50 is not practical >> > for this time of year as I switch to 10W40 in the >> winter due to cold weather. >> > And it looks like it is only available as 20W50. >> Currently it is 10 F outside. >> > Yes, I drive my "fair weather" daily driver 64B when it >> is this cold out if it >> > is dry weather. Single digit or below zero temps or >> snow will keep the B >> > parked while I use my Land Rover - like today as we >> have about 3" of fresh >> > snow in an ongoing storm with 6-10" predicted by >> tomorrow. >> > >> > David Councill >> > >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net >> [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf >> > Of Jack Feldman >> > Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 6:40 AM >> > To: mgs@autox.team.net >> > Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP >> > >> > I'm surprised that no one has mentioned that Valvolene >> racing oil contains >> > ZDDP. It comes in 20W50, just right for our cars. >> > >> > They used to advertise it in large letters on the front >> label, but it now it >> > is a fine print notice on the back. You either have to >> have a sharp >> > salesperson, or spend time reading the fine print. >> > >> > Jack, who won't leave home without it. >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Mgs@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.75 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/eugeneb@nni.com > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider. > http://www.nni.com/ > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/simon.d.matthews@gmail.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 29 00:46:26 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8CE9F4248F for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 00:46:26 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ia0-f175.google.com (mail-ia0-f175.google.com [209.85.210.175]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B11240E3B for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 00:38:54 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-ia0-f175.google.com with SMTP id r4so176215iaj.20 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 23:34:11 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:x-received:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :subject:from:to:content-type; bh=BmgukM3MyX5rbvDZ6R8ditF+mlqGIs4BWhuxMvH2hIU=; b=PwnC82sra4tlhcfZK4TVSMWUZsBqoMkZMI2izaL5zx7/XwLXhPlECCnc9vSIq5apSW 5yC2+1he9HA5l18gQ7UcfTfER0QOFhTXqyJO2bD4dr/1NVlC/B+xmMER1MBncUwMEVNQ C3DxDRlt8jZ/CLkw/e0k4UhlPpgkyaNZhQH4u7Ylf5HiYyRCrdhhr6ej+sEuTHNF6KaL x3QHVqt2Yfq/eFvoOPo+IQ/YFCEhSf0Mu1BE+fVBe1k0KMZTVfKcJ9k8xFxlV/LvCdDC c2HiCGQNBAymJN/+9EyphAXDMYtlmzLDbWOtV/FDZlapCOo3f5OihO5A3Y33lGWbHS0j EKBg== Mon, 28 Jan 2013 23:34:11 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.64.77.33 with HTTP; Mon, 28 Jan 2013 23:34:10 -0800 (PST) References: Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 23:34:10 -0800 From: Simon Matthews To: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Uh, my mistake. The Amsoil oil is also rated SL -- again, how can this oil be "high Zinc", if one of the changes to oil from SF onwards was the reduction of zinc and phoshorus? Simon On Mon, Jan 28, 2013 at 11:30 PM, Simon Matthews wrote: > Can someone explain how Valvolene's VR1 meets the (claimed) SN/SM/SL > rating, yet contains the claimed 0.14/0.13 Zinc/Phosphorus? As far as > I can see, any oil rated higher than SL MUST contain less than .12% > Zinc and Phosphorus. > > May I offer another solution? Amsoil offers a SG rated 20W50 oil, > which is also rated for diesel engines. > > Simon > > > > On Fri, Jan 11, 2013 at 12:01 PM, Eugene Balinski wrote: >> IMHO Valvoline VR-1 is suitable for the street IF you >> purchase the street version. It has all of the additivives >> for the various SAE ratings. Per the web site, >> >> "Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is a family of race-proven >> lubricants formulated to provide high load carrying >> characteristics, minimum foaming and maximum resistance to >> thermal degradation. Exclusive chemistry reduces internal >> friction and enhances power output under extreme service >> conditions. Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is recommended >> for engines burning gasoline and full or partial alcohol >> fuels in track and street service. Valvoline VR-1 Racing >> Motor Oil is for use in any car, light truck, van, or SUV >> where API SN is recommended(see proper viscosity grade >> below)." >> >> >> API SN/SM/SL- 20W-50 >> API SH * 10W-30 20W-50 >> API CD/CF 10W-30 20W-50 >> >> http://www.valvoline.com/pdf/vr1_racing.pdf >> >> >> Please point out if I am missing something... >> >> Gene >> 80 B >> >> >> >> On Fri, 11 Jan 2013 10:01:21 -0800 >> Max Heim wrote: >>> If you ignore the stipulation that racing oil is not >>> suitable for street >>> use... >>> >>> The Mobil1 15w-50 is a street oil. This weight would be >>> more suitable for >>> winter use, too. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> Max Heim >>> '66 MGB GHN3L76149 >>> If you're near Menlo Park, CA, >>> it's the primer red one with chrome wires >>> >>> >>> on 1/11/13 6:22 AM, Councill, David at >>> dcouncill@msubillings.edu wrote: >>> >>> > The ZDDP conversations on this list have probably >>> exceeded other illustrious >>> > topics such as towing with driveline attached or not or >>> even pros/cons on >>> > weber carbs. The primary solution is the one Jack >>> mentions - using Valvoline >>> > VR1 racing oil. The problem, at least for me, is that >>> 20W50 is not practical >>> > for this time of year as I switch to 10W40 in the >>> winter due to cold weather. >>> > And it looks like it is only available as 20W50. >>> Currently it is 10 F outside. >>> > Yes, I drive my "fair weather" daily driver 64B when it >>> is this cold out if it >>> > is dry weather. Single digit or below zero temps or >>> snow will keep the B >>> > parked while I use my Land Rover - like today as we >>> have about 3" of fresh >>> > snow in an ongoing storm with 6-10" predicted by >>> tomorrow. >>> > >>> > David Councill >>> > >>> > -----Original Message----- >>> > From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net >>> [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf >>> > Of Jack Feldman >>> > Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 6:40 AM >>> > To: mgs@autox.team.net >>> > Subject: [Mgs] ZDDP >>> > >>> > I'm surprised that no one has mentioned that Valvolene >>> racing oil contains >>> > ZDDP. It comes in 20W50, just right for our cars. >>> > >>> > They used to advertise it in large letters on the front >>> label, but it now it >>> > is a fine print notice on the back. You either have to >>> have a sharp >>> > salesperson, or spend time reading the fine print. >>> > >>> > Jack, who won't leave home without it. >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> Mgs@autox.team.net >>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> Suggested annual donation $12.75 >>> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >>> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >>> Unsubscribe: >>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/eugeneb@nni.com >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider. >> http://www.nni.com/ >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Mgs@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.75 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/simon.d.matthews@gmail.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 29 02:03:07 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6616442466 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 02:03:07 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-bk0-f43.google.com (mail-bk0-f43.google.com [209.85.214.43]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3135140E3D for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 01:58:11 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-bk0-f43.google.com with SMTP id jm19so93289bkc.2 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 00:53:27 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:to:references:subject:date:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority :x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=810Yk1bUxsJdimWDAY7CKGSm+neOeEJppfdT/alnm80=; b=TSdK2mSi6LeZIlpL0jzMmmaAvfz0bQTGmK3AA19YeDoGA34tjmwF2MXVbL6v75mhsa wEP9ezHA8f/4eanyi+dLIOYQ8vNin09kzZB8Zc9V6vkT+hOBdZjbW5Msj7XwSzC7FKrc ViHUZA9GDhAAWfWROpj3hP+bjxJmOYfYwIdyQvMQwtZ1OoUzsJTI7Fvhe9D2PGtfdgsj IRViZZPpCw44DeX/0UTMe0cgXndu+6PwHm8W9ie4/qwBpkps9P43KnxhA4YJkiQt/+MC ILCps1c4Ljki9f8uslShtaKOnD74SxvHRW5Klc607PXzfbPd8JE3Z2eOi9dSqKlpFQKV ZiRw== d7mr101379bkv.64.1359449607704; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 00:53:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-3.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.105]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id s10sm8159577bkw.3.2013.01.29.00.53.26 (version=TLSv1.1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Tue, 29 Jan 2013 00:53:27 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" To: "Bill Snyder" , References: <000001cdfd8f$665bb810$33132830$@net> Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 08:36:49 -0000 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Fuel Issue Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net On the face of it, if only one cylinder isn't firing it can't be the rear carb as that would affect a pair of cylinders. But the MGB has a large bore balance tube joining all four cylinders so it's possible the 3rd cylinder is getting just enough mixture from the front carb but the end cylinder isn't. If it's only firing on three then you wouldn't really know if the 3rd cylinder were firing fully or not. It's a simple check to tell whether it's fuel or ignition, after running for a few moments remove plug 4. If it's wet or smells strongly of fuel then it's ignition. If it's dry and no fuel smell then it's fuel. A plug can fire when laying on the block but not when in the cylinder under compression pressure if the cap (or other HT component) is marginal and breaking down under the higher HT voltage that is required to fire a plug under compression. After having the ignition on for a few moments it's another moments job to remove the lid of the float chamber to check you have fuel in there, i.e. it isn't a blocked float valve. If that's OK remove the air cleaners and blow gently into the float chamber overflow port you *should* see fuel bubbling up the jet in the intake to check the jet pipe and jet aren't blocked. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- > ... After re-inspecting the plugs, it appears that the 4th > cylinder was not firing, but the plug was not gas or oil fouled. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 29 02:18:02 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 513214248E for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 02:18:02 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-bk0-f50.google.com (mail-bk0-f50.google.com [209.85.214.50]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 69B0C40E3D for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 02:09:11 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-bk0-f50.google.com with SMTP id jg9so98953bkc.9 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 01:04:27 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:to:references:subject:date:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority :x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=hSXiUivxYsjU839764hgL+OgsG5m9n/4ZW2VwsuAk2U=; b=fp58PHPvAI8+J3mMTawEQPXJu35Til3QDbN1oAHRsyKGP7gJb6v7PMjiyFbxzbgF+K 1B2TbxZWCoASqG5gwU8ewRV313SjXSjolntRs5hC4Zy32CN5Ohex7b//NQk5VJurN6Tb 0hsVOBV4A2YQKl/H04rtEC7J0eG0EzzTFdCszEGX9bD/w5I/gjFzdpwSQvZwwP/sxMzp fej7AHaTBRHZoj81oqpin7a7eHQwB2weKYu2Sk/mBvOXtkojh6uK8HtkdITKN0ZKxtVl 5cKsJCGySdp+6/Olck+fAZlRy2d5PAZmgtCN7g2LQEloRWqNaLCg5I2ebhuKJ30T8anY mMuA== Tue, 29 Jan 2013 01:04:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-3.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.105]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id v8sm8194472bku.6.2013.01.29.01.04.25 (version=TLSv1.1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Tue, 29 Jan 2013 01:04:26 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" To: "Simon Matthews" , "MG List" References: Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 09:01:29 -0000 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net My thoughts exactly ever since I started looking into this about four years ago, which is why I just don't trust it. Castrol GTX even though sold under it's original API spec only seems to contain half the zinc and phosphorus it did originally. I've seen a letter purporting to be from Royal Purple stating that RP XPR 10W40 has over 1500-1600 ppm of ZDDP and goes on to say "we could take all of the ZDDP out of our engine oils and still have 4 times the wear resistance of even the VR-1 oil due to our Synerlec additive technology". It which point the whole thing degenerates into farce. What was apparent when I was looking is that Diesel oils, if they had a petrol API rating as well as a Diesel, contained more ZDDP than oils with only that petrol rating, but that was also under review. In the UK I use Comma Sonic which is to API SL but has .2% zinc and .19% phosphorus http://www.commaoil.com/productsguide/file/367670c3e9a411571893883585a71863 PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- > Can someone explain how Valvolene's VR1 meets the (claimed) SN/SM/SL > rating, yet contains the claimed 0.14/0.13 Zinc/Phosphorus? As far as > I can see, any oil rated higher than SL MUST contain less than .12% > Zinc and Phosphorus. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 29 07:09:50 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 979AB4248E for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 07:09:50 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ee0-f43.google.com (mail-ee0-f43.google.com [74.125.83.43]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3EC1642280 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 07:01:47 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-ee0-f43.google.com with SMTP id c50so248659eek.2 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 05:57:03 -0800 (PST) s=20120113; h=mime-version:x-received:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=TySUlaKWQAmZyUkYFTeDAAuoa5zrcp5vR9TA1na7Elk=; b=sbAnmvz+DbuG1ZuaLb6d5lCQamhFBgo9JjnKYK6CPHyLsXdfrJ6uWoiIczJIR0H6yD bo2DGRK1A6NErXcx1gAsph7sfA1DS8XtVGD2cpdiKu9E/DEas/x49r/90aPDR3Cx2ZZb KkRBkLoviF/Rt4Aoki9AuK7TpwVDodAdul/vVT/C56dlMaB5bxZB1SDOwFaF1FxP8vtG DZWKhr3kV2pYKKhYDTL0CG5zUzywVFYlyovwUa1KKcelKeekMzQhNJSiWhsS/NDvUtya u2sQFErJ7GUEvZ1o5aWTofA+U+ocshrM2zjd4X3QPxml7I5XSwRgdzVzy6LzFx3l+L/j LtWQ== Tue, 29 Jan 2013 05:57:03 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.14.223.132 with HTTP; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 05:57:02 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 07:57:02 -0600 From: Jack Feldman To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] Hemmings and ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net In the back cover of my Hemmings Sports and Exotics is an ad for Hemmings brand oil with ZDDP formulated for our cars!!!!! *Everybody wants to get into the act.* Jack _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 29 07:10:09 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 37507424B3 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 07:10:09 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ea0-f179.google.com (mail-ea0-f179.google.com [209.85.215.179]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D64A422A0 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 07:09:16 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-ea0-f179.google.com with SMTP id d12so206576eaa.38 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 06:04:31 -0800 (PST) s=20120113; h=mime-version:x-received:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=Bk0lCRdljVLVgaWGdGq7DsCKcB9dILLyjREvjqzYrjQ=; b=sEVsAdFYk0AI5Z1piJo2RqtnPqBXAqyNnS1+pBWopZ6aAQ3J80e1qn9F+hVIDbahat o0TSG8X7oVoNpX/5e7S7J8/REkYFBCwkogERCmxQd2+B+TLskcHn1TDoxkP28ww4a1S+ HB8XZxpseHGEtctMNcODdlYQuhWOoCuKjyq0btyUkl129OuwFhDKbhXTj6jOgfESdc77 bko+ydMhfSXnHQWix1q61DRZxPAGKF15YCq+C9UkKEPgLXT0qN/EO4UekAG9vAxY/WYA rz/YeVXq4h4VtV2wHgyblBXqY/P1j5RwWhmjUCY9pDU9UvHJ9or8kUbPHf04DPYDD1HA Zzug== v44mr3556606eel.29.1359468271110; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 06:04:31 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.14.223.132 with HTTP; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 06:04:30 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 08:04:30 -0600 From: Jack Feldman To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] Rheostat, now Bulbs Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Right now the brightest lights are halogen. They are bright enough. I thought I saw an ad for bright LEDs that would work in an MG, but can't remember where. Considering the large LBC market, I'm sure they are coming. Interestingly, the halogen bulbs (Actually the bulb is the glass portion, the whole thing is called a lamp, but common usage......) worked fine until I upgraded my headlamp wiring with relays that took current directly from the battery. Now they are just as dim as always! Must be a current issue. Jack _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 29 07:30:20 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AC84424B3 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 07:30:20 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-bk0-f49.google.com (mail-bk0-f49.google.com [209.85.214.49]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F39664006E for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 07:30:03 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-bk0-f49.google.com with SMTP id w11so300622bku.36 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 06:25:18 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:to:references:subject:date:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority :x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=BQYt4Lohy2gucBgAhpr1BCSefKLDD00YtJxoPOGZ7ck=; b=VqS8wtKTPBfT8nj0eSDXybhmlj+OcG/vTXTj2TyO1atNIlezp0KwD3EtaA3mmCqanM cZXPhxn70ijoDB44Oik2VZdNrXjhY7DjfH3qDnef3KUnrhFgzMudGKqwL5GrOXI9HuUd X3ZrqTGF8hq4wzg9JHr8Vf5g2PAov13Y/55DBCWy5tkQpMaS7VnGwj6G8NZI0soOE0CS /RQ5uMQl6oJ/FICenAW/bt8QLGiWIh74UUAb8+SLUP+EauPaiK9RizGwjfXTK6oc3dgH BkWT9nD9i2yggmwGCSONWPUgcu+zExy+g+vGqS8Yqi1/vhQWV+N33sywf86OHG/LbIrN aB5A== l11mr398950bkw.2.1359469518516; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 06:25:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-3.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.105]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id i20sm9240305bkw.5.2013.01.29.06.25.15 (version=TLSv1.1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Tue, 29 Jan 2013 06:25:17 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" To: "Jack Feldman" , References: Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 14:22:57 -0000 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Rheostat, now Bulbs Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Very current, lots of complaints about it ... You need to be careful with halogen bulbs in instruments, they run much hotter than standard incandescents and can damage them, I've measured them at up to 90C compared with 30C for standard 2.2w. There are a number of directly compatible LED types around, I've tried five different types so far, but the best are only marginally better than standard - http://www.mgb-stuff.org.uk/led.htm#4, probably because they are all forward facing even when multi-element. If you could get multi-element where the elements were arranged around the surface of a cylinder, like LED festoons, but small enough to fit they would probably be better. The best I've seen are 12v LED strips cut into pieces and stuck inside the case. Ironically these are so bright they do need a dimmer, but using LEDs renders the standard dimmer useless as the resistance/current/voltage characteristic is completely wrong, really you need a pulse unit with variable duty-cycle to control the brightness of LEDs. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- > Right now the brightest lights are halogen. They are bright enough. I > thought I saw an ad for bright LEDs that would work in an MG, but can't > remember where. Considering the large LBC market, I'm sure they are > coming. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 29 07:40:39 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A873542491 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 07:40:39 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm33-vm7.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com (nm33-vm7.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com [72.30.239.207]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C26A640066 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 07:32:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from [98.139.212.152] by nm33.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2013 14:27:39 -0000 Received: from [98.139.212.196] by tm9.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2013 14:27:39 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1005.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2013 14:27:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 9294 invoked by uid 60001); 29 Jan 2013 14:27:39 -0000 s=s1024; t=1359469659; bh=Josy2aEcLS+PB+g5g5Elldz2IyOcVrm1ZxHfHEz94e8=; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=dJUVxabXNLhln+yAbHX81u+GNMPhF/t0uVTaj4vNYrPuNRXMcRgU2gKZSk3cNJvrksTGx9CHfr9SvClaUCFCaq6ynjGpvR1JAWlw0Sfv4rnvXJFvSFJ4zHgA/TQN4XJF7rRlfCCNXT2uuDcQpFQhfDDAhHj0KQUqvMDJMzbycMM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=GVZjrpYk8XlHt/KWucJpNHxmZB1hoth79OxSoPe9GFFsWgqqnDPjuAG42un/jeNwr4ycOsCEpEIesOp0AZsfl9miSeeYish8krCEJOmpvp75wbFF1Kdy2VSXUVrIYOzCjdyy77s/aACEAYOCypTQlYuD0eUhpXvQP2Zm7OZi6YQ= ; PvYGxm87zDGy6zoAvru8wkft9sLydsBgHtLS9TM9P3kynmktnZdpNJUELALB fW4T.cgomSV3pwKf_wb16i2hsgUlX2sp83Z22NB4ykWzUz_.uPXgi_fk4gYG dXmVYms.gLdTTZMUXGrmf5jyi3ijVENIJnntrqVbgZ3p1056UyQx.W2IJDZJ bO43SWoGMMgGCtDxutej6KED56gcZdyVHhGiuyBMwAC77Bs5QmSAz5cylAft X4MtBOy19Tdbjq2FONy8HUpjbrGeBElSzEe1EVxZMEH4IRBy7rD0XxcN9Idw O0fHNqYvPjd3djW8D2m0DgOT86zo4iPoi_GlzAU.9Zg7PT1juVnDjQ3hJoEn h74JPquecpY_J4wbD82L10YDfUBeSe9U7WEsFLZ0QzowmpR0N0yHfDWidmiA zUsiVN6A2v_0iowFWgJ40zKbjPgMdPuFFCvzmDllKbds9g6sZANt9QwWj7XT 2GuxXQoaZYG7bTKm1 Received: from [68.44.138.78] by web164905.mail.bf1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 06:27:39 PST QXBwcm92ZWQgYnkgTW90b3IgVHJlbmQsIG5vIGRvdWJ0Li4uLgoKRGFuIEQKJzc2IEIKJzY1IEIKQ2VudHJhbCBOSiBVU0EKCgoKCl9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fCiBGcm9tOiBKYWNrIEZlbGRtYW4gPHF1YWxpdGFzLmphY2tAZ21haWwuY29tPgpUbzogbWdzQGF1dG94LnRlYW0ubmV0IApTZW50OiBUdWVzZGF5LCBKYW51YXJ5IDI5LCAyMDEzIDg6NTcgQU0KU3ViamVjdDogW01nc10gSGVtbWluZ3MgYW5kIFpERFAKIApJbiB0aGUgYmFjayBjb3ZlciBvZiBteSBIZW1taW5ncyBTcG8BMAEBAQE- References: Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 06:27:39 -0800 (PST) From: Dan DiBiase To: Jack Feldman , "mgs@autox.team.net" Subject: Re: [Mgs] Hemmings and ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Approved by Motor Trend, no doubt.... Dan D '76 B '65 B Central NJ USA ________________________________ From: Jack Feldman To: mgs@autox.team.net Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2013 8:57 AM Subject: [Mgs] Hemmings and ZDDP In the back cover of my Hemmings Sports and Exotics is an ad for Hemmings brand oil with ZDDP formulated for our cars!!!!! *Everybody wants to get into the act.* Jack _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Donate: Archive: Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/d_dibiase@yahoo.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 29 07:56:33 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 28EDD42493 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 07:56:33 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ve0-f177.google.com (mail-ve0-f177.google.com [209.85.128.177]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9EFF422A0 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 07:51:49 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-ve0-f177.google.com with SMTP id m1so330366ves.22 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 06:47:05 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:x-received:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :subject:from:to:content-type; bh=N9FOhC7A5rRmdl+qMdAVuXu1YxHHoyKtnVCjkG9ENzU=; b=xvsyb6DJ5oBpLJQ+Pgfz4yXnNDMqSjtD6hjUpJfvf1fFjiB+R4w2ALiGPKSTEEUERD CCdV6obqp/RDUUZ+4AbNhiYFc7KIqxtKG1vf2e9F1/RoodzWPJOk20tm1jAYyqwHuEa3 xo1rjMC/7HnAioPTd+KIVs8INeAuOy5c14kAA3brlF0LuN3RlfoZdtIcK37cL0JY1Rfz BJhl5pMatMHPmWZn1WM50mbfXhvtae0R5/A3oN5Aw5QtLBIrLMfbdepDAwK6LtRr1SkN Yrbl7Uni6w6m8oIN3LMX6o0S+9ubHa8k3Bqa9XSapFXw1augBNEEuHxJ4kRnUtOeUTxx Kx1w== br13mr1083197vdc.23.1359470824928; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 06:47:04 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.52.117.84 with HTTP; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 06:47:04 -0800 (PST) References: <1359469659.8917.YahooMailNeo@web164905.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 09:47:04 -0500 From: Jim Tinkham To: "mgs@autox.team.net" Subject: Re: [Mgs] Hemmings and ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Let's see if this'll work.... The Add Jack is referring to I believe; On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 9:27 AM, Dan DiBiase wrote: > Approved by Motor Trend, no doubt.... > > Dan D > '76 B > '65 B > Central NJ USA > ________________________________ > From: Jack Feldman > To: mgs@autox.team.net > Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2013 8:57 AM > Subject: [Mgs] > Hemmings and ZDDP > > In the back cover of my Hemmings Sports and Exotics is an > ad for Hemmings > brand oil with ZDDP formulated for our cars!!!!! > > *Everybody > wants to get into the act.* > > Jack > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: > http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: > http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/d_dibiase@yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/tink5775@gmail.com [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of HSE1301.jpg] _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 29 12:32:07 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C257426BA for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 12:32:07 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from pacmmta53.windstream.net (pacmmta53.windstream.net [162.39.147.112]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A52D42574 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 12:24:10 -0700 (MST) cv=asOxBwkBAZGV0T+WtrXzpfep39GF0kV392HEIHOPyDY= c=1 sm=0 a=jl2ymW9NZSsA:10 a=We2GSUcPNccA:10 a=fOpwdquTRaQA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=Ov22w-J6AAAA:8 a=AGENXQPuM4IoT2I6jYUA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=J0aUVQLP0FIA:10 a=m3MdUl94G8cA:10 a=SdvNMj5PkgcA:10 a=P5auZbegKUGb7J55hykblg==:117 Authentication-Results: pacmmta53 smtp.user=ccrobins@ktc.com; auth=pass (PLAIN) Received: from [75.91.230.181] ([75.91.230.181:61618] helo=[192.168.1.2]) by pacmmta53 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39824M)) with ESMTPA id B7/06-08543-CB028015; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 14:19:24 -0500 Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 13:19:19 -0600 From: Charley & Peggy Robinson Organization: Computer Helpers User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130107 Thunderbird/17.0.2 To: Jack Feldman References: Cc: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] Hemmings and ZDDP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Man, those guys don't miss a thing! CR On 1/29/2013 7:57 AM, Jack Feldman wrote: > In the back cover of my Hemmings Sports and Exotics is an ad for Hemmings > brand oil with ZDDP formulated for our cars!!!!! > > *Everybody wants to get into the act.* > > Jack > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/ccrobins@ktc.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 29 12:33:10 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A765A427BA for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 12:33:10 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from pacmmta53.windstream.net (pacmmta53.windstream.net [162.39.147.112]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D1BF4258C for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 12:28:56 -0700 (MST) cv=asOxBwkBAZGV0T+WtrXzpfep39GF0kV392HEIHOPyDY= c=1 sm=0 a=jl2ymW9NZSsA:10 a=We2GSUcPNccA:10 a=fOpwdquTRaQA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=LarVh930AAAA:8 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=Ov22w-J6AAAA:8 a=Y50gu9pVQk7oWgNihFwA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=J0aUVQLP0FIA:10 a=m3MdUl94G8cA:10 a=SdvNMj5PkgcA:10 a=u2WDksua4lWgBQTr:21 a=a0EIi1dYBMRWouUW:21 a=P5auZbegKUGb7J55hykblg==:117 Authentication-Results: pacmmta53 smtp.user=ccrobins@ktc.com; auth=pass (PLAIN) Received: from [75.91.230.181] ([75.91.230.181:61641] helo=[192.168.1.2]) by pacmmta53 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39824M)) with ESMTPA id C5/37-08543-AD128015; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 14:24:11 -0500 Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 13:24:06 -0600 From: Charley & Peggy Robinson Organization: Computer Helpers User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130107 Thunderbird/17.0.2 To: MG List References: <7CAE282D7B834198A902EC22AAFA31CF@paul> Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net You guys are getting me so worried that I may never start my B up again. Maybe I'll just bronze the thing. :-) CR On 1/29/2013 3:01 AM, PaulHunt73 wrote: > My thoughts exactly ever since I started looking into this about four > years ago, which is why I just don't trust it. Castrol GTX even though > sold under it's original API spec only seems to contain half the zinc > and phosphorus it did originally. I've seen a letter purporting to be > from Royal Purple stating that RP XPR 10W40 has over 1500-1600 ppm of > ZDDP and goes on to say "we could take all of the ZDDP out of our > engine oils and still have 4 times the wear resistance of even the > VR-1 oil due to our Synerlec additive technology". It which point the > whole thing degenerates into farce. What was apparent when I was > looking is that Diesel oils, if they had a petrol API rating as well > as a Diesel, contained more ZDDP than oils with only that petrol > rating, but that was also under review. In the UK I use Comma Sonic > which is to API SL but has .2% zinc and .19% phosphorus > http://www.commaoil.com/productsguide/file/367670c3e9a411571893883585a71863 > > PaulH. > > > ----- Original Message ----- >> Can someone explain how Valvolene's VR1 meets the (claimed) SN/SM/SL >> rating, yet contains the claimed 0.14/0.13 Zinc/Phosphorus? As far as >> I can see, any oil rated higher than SL MUST contain less than .12% >> Zinc and Phosphorus. > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/ccrobins@ktc.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 29 16:53:29 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4CB1427FC for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 16:53:29 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from hrndva-omtalb.mail.rr.com (hrndva-omtalb.mail.rr.com [71.74.56.122]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14DF2427B2 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 16:50:58 -0700 (MST) a=1q14fx7sp++YLIU7SzGzgA==:17 a=M1n3L-6PpTwA:10 a=VXLBlChgrDcA:10 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=JlnAE7Pw8s4A:10 a=LarVh930AAAA:8 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=Ov22w-J6AAAA:8 a=5znVGtEyzino-HenPBMA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=J0aUVQLP0FIA:10 a=m3MdUl94G8cA:10 a=SdvNMj5PkgcA:10 a=M3bvsAEVHHihLyFU:21 a=OrR3OixYQO_U9MbJ:21 a=1q14fx7sp++YLIU7SzGzgA==:117 Received: from [66.66.164.187] ([66.66.164.187:57975] helo=[192.168.1.3]) by hrndva-oedge02.mail.rr.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.46 r()) with ESMTP id 35/D7-08009-34F58015; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 23:46:12 +0000 From: Paul Osborne Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 18:46:10 -0500 References: <7CAE282D7B834198A902EC22AAFA31CF@paul> <510821D6.2060504@ktc.com> To: ccrobins@ktc.com Cc: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Ok, here we go . I'm going to be the wrench in the works. 6 years ago I fully rebuilt an 18V engine and placed it service in my 74 BGT. This is a daily driver, no show car here , nice but a driver. The clock reads 72000miles. since that time I have done the regular maintance , a set of brakes and tires . Now I drive about 500miles to my cottage all most 3 times a month from may to oct. I use Quakerstate 20w50 oil. only I have noticed nothing but running well. My opinion, may there is a need for this additive, maybe it may help, but I owen and have owen 5 mgs . my GT I bought new, and I see no adverse problems with the oil I use in my cars. Oh well. paul o On Jan 29, 2013, at 2:24 PM, Charley & Peggy Robinson wrote: > You guys are getting me so worried that I may never start my B up again. Maybe I'll just bronze the thing. :-) > > CR > On 1/29/2013 3:01 AM, PaulHunt73 wrote: >> My thoughts exactly ever since I started looking into this about four years ago, which is why I just don't trust it. Castrol GTX even though sold under it's original API spec only seems to contain half the zinc and phosphorus it did originally. I've seen a letter purporting to be from Royal Purple stating that RP XPR 10W40 has over 1500-1600 ppm of ZDDP and goes on to say "we could take all of the ZDDP out of our engine oils and still have 4 times the wear resistance of even the VR-1 oil due to our Synerlec additive technology". It which point the whole thing degenerates into farce. What was apparent when I was looking is that Diesel oils, if they had a petrol API rating as well as a Diesel, contained more ZDDP than oils with only that petrol rating, but that was also under review. In the UK I use Comma Sonic which is to API SL but has .2% zinc and .19% phosphorus http://www.commaoil.com/productsguide/file/367670c3e9a411571893883585a71863 >> >> PaulH. >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >>> Can someone explain how Valvolene's VR1 meets the (claimed) SN/SM/SL >>> rating, yet contains the claimed 0.14/0.13 Zinc/Phosphorus? As far as >>> I can see, any oil rated higher than SL MUST contain less than .12% >>> Zinc and Phosphorus. >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Mgs@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.75 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/ccrobins@ktc.com > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/paul@ece.rochester.edu _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 29 16:56:31 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D3B6427E9 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 16:56:31 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm27.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com (nm27.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com [66.94.237.92]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8F2540446 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 16:56:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from [66.94.237.196] by nm27.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2013 23:51:40 -0000 Received: from [98.138.226.244] by tm7.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2013 23:51:40 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp115.sbc.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2013 23:51:40 -0000 s=s1024; t=1359503500; bh=ibu9Sq3cmYjF+hPzTgqIFeC7Lrf78LPUMJYINrS0vV4=; h=X-Yahoo-Newman-Id:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-SMTP:Received:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=oTHbEO4jVzf9fWw+GZ1fEr27m36aoJG7YmVjQx6ztAjtRbAVUzC+H6PC4YviKbT44ueYaLe3vWzQmZWtfYxZP/ooZSbOChJeBtDUmdpDVXUGfCuq8oHCmoJyF34mz2XucjbBBGwtmN8HFuzlGQrmHIOLXLk16iolt2I8HzrmsKk= ZDhep9ctiDCqz.oUyX6NIdCtmFzrAjDj1FtSwuLLXIK8brdC5ImC81WeeDAv vDRkHbqGuv.Zvqv5spd2dI0UMxJk1fnTzv0QCq2NUpmlCDv6wXvBt7CjHuoh wsI34vW_ZZGA5JMnZke.lQD4bx3bo_DHR3eQr5KF3m5Oz7NWTanq90K1uVs8 K0Ta5FFlpXxknwlqDMs4p41IqxBxb..e9kza9cWsv0rHXHkwJeG1wVAeBlyw aZNUfxOg7ehOitkAffR6lylcLXFXtITVBtWZBDdSpr11Z6Txe0Cfvkrra.fk jjXnlhlwL2loyVHKovKVxtd2VWWNm2jedhDR9vW1SKOjVQeyKmCIbPh8bBNS ER5lcv7JyXjyqp.SWRkiw8QZgHFXwY8oX0RbFMKBELpOH3ch9pISpNEmv3O9 6mYFC2BlXJ1XV8g2o1cQcTfHXBK7iComWPS3IOQbsE_qK63jzmqghhPcJTPS JuGBVENHO9ziHSX5bnPYKd82OSOOe9bCjn2J5tF2LodscxWS2Sj62c2V3SG4 PKSyKw.opo.ZGgnT29eoAq_hi_9qI2Igah8Oer_lNzMQ- Received: from [127.0.0.1] (chillmog@99.9.234.42 with plain) by smtp115.sbc.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2013 15:51:39 -0800 PST Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 17:51:38 -0600 From: Charles Hill User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130107 Thunderbird/17.0.2 To: mgs@autox.team.net References: <7CAE282D7B834198A902EC22AAFA31CF@paul> <510821D6.2060504@ktc.com> <6AE3F102-B903-44D9-9794-CA0FEB86A5BA@ece.rochester.edu> Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Doesn't the API ratings allow more ZDDP in higher viscosity oils? I thought I read something about that when the ZDDP flack first started. Charles Hill On 1/29/2013 5:46 PM, Paul Osborne wrote: > Ok, here we go . I'm going to be the wrench in the works. 6 years ago I fully > rebuilt an 18V engine and placed it service in my 74 BGT. This is a daily > driver, no show car here , nice but a driver. > The clock reads 72000miles. since that time I have done the regular maintance > , a set of brakes and tires . Now I drive about 500miles to my cottage all > most 3 times a month from may to oct. > I use Quakerstate 20w50 oil. only I have noticed nothing but running > well. My opinion, may there is a need for this additive, maybe it may > help, but I owen and have owen 5 mgs . my GT > I bought new, and I see no adverse problems with the oil I use in my cars. > > Oh well. > > paul o > On Jan 29, 2013, at 2:24 PM, Charley & Peggy Robinson wrote: > >> You guys are getting me so worried that I may never start my B up again. > Maybe I'll just bronze the thing. :-) >> CR >> On 1/29/2013 3:01 AM, PaulHunt73 wrote: >>> My thoughts exactly ever since I started looking into this about four years > ago, which is why I just don't trust it. Castrol GTX even though sold under > it's original API spec only seems to contain half the zinc and phosphorus it > did originally. I've seen a letter purporting to be from Royal Purple stating > that RP XPR 10W40 has over 1500-1600 ppm of ZDDP and goes on to say "we could > take all of the ZDDP out of our engine oils and still have 4 times the wear > resistance of even the VR-1 oil due to our Synerlec additive technology". It > which point the whole thing degenerates into farce. What was apparent when I > was looking is that Diesel oils, if they had a petrol API rating as well as a > Diesel, contained more ZDDP than oils with only that petrol rating, but that > was also under review. In the UK I use Comma Sonic which is to API SL but has > .2% zinc and .19% phosphorus > http://www.commaoil.com/productsguide/file/367670c3e9a411571893883585a71863 >>> PaulH. >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> Can someone explain how Valvolene's VR1 meets the (claimed) SN/SM/SL >>>> rating, yet contains the claimed 0.14/0.13 Zinc/Phosphorus? As far as >>>> I can see, any oil rated higher than SL MUST contain less than .12% >>>> Zinc and Phosphorus. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 29 17:14:54 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 508DB42810 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 17:14:54 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF431427B6 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 17:14:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-110.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.110]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0U0A09j011998 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 16:10:03 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 16:01:19 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? Thread-Index: Ac3+fO49JOPl+h5tr0i6rt6sWF4Epw== Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I just want to point out two things: - You apparently don't drive very hard. - You have a low-compression motor. Higher-performance models used for rallies and track days may have a completely different experience. As they say, YMMV... -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 1/29/13 3:46 PM, Paul Osborne at paul@ece.rochester.edu wrote: > Ok, here we go . I'm going to be the wrench in the works. 6 years ago I fully > rebuilt an 18V engine and placed it service in my 74 BGT. This is a daily > driver, no show car here , nice but a driver. > The clock reads 72000miles. since that time I have done the regular maintance > , a set of brakes and tires . Now I drive about 500miles to my cottage all > most 3 times a month from may to oct. > I use Quakerstate 20w50 oil. only I have noticed nothing but running > well. My opinion, may there is a need for this additive, maybe it may > help, but I owen and have owen 5 mgs . my GT > I bought new, and I see no adverse problems with the oil I use in my cars. > > Oh well. > > paul o _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 29 17:15:11 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1E1042808 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 17:15:11 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7C2C427B6 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 17:14:50 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.0.100] (173-228-28-110.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net [173.228.28.110]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id r0U0A09k011998 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 16:10:03 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.35.0.121009 Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 16:02:33 -0800 From: Max Heim To: MG List Thread-Topic: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? Thread-Index: Ac3+fRpYkbUCp6ibSUy2M8Lob++DWw== Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I think you may have something there. It's the super-low-viscosity oils that are intended for the newest vehicles. -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Menlo Park, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 1/29/13 3:51 PM, Charles Hill at chillmog@sbcglobal.net wrote: > Doesn't the API ratings allow more ZDDP in higher viscosity oils? I > thought I read something about that when the ZDDP flack first started. > > Charles Hill _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 29 19:26:44 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E987E42847 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 19:26:43 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nlpi176.prodigy.net (nlpi176.sbcis.sbc.com [207.115.36.48]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 458994280E for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 19:20:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from barney-gaylord.mgaguru.com (adsl-75-5-66-51.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net [75.5.66.51]) (authenticated bits=0) by nlpi176.prodigy.net (8.14.4 smptauth/8.14.4) with ESMTP id r0U2G9Su016315; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 20:16:09 -0600 Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 20:16:11 -0600 To: Max Heim , MG List From: Barney Gaylord References: <6AE3F102-B903-44D9-9794-CA0FEB86A5BA@ece.rochester.edu> Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I try not to get involved in religious wars, but I am coming to Paul's support here with considerable experience of my own. I have build a number of MGA engines using a Crane Fast Street Cam (with a bit of extra lift), Heavy Duty valve springs (more than stock spring force), short tappets and long pushrods from the 18V engine, and sometimes alloy spring caps (but not always). A couple of these engine I have done for other people, and no complaints from them. A couple of these engine I have run in my own car. I nearly always drive it like I stole it. I have done lots of competition work in SCCA autocross events (and some local club events). In short, it is an uprated engine driven by a heavy foot, sometimes at 7,000 rpm during competition. For build it gets lots of standard grease on the cam and tappets (although I would go along with the cam lube recommended by the cam manufacturer). For first run and break in the engine runs 2500 rpm for 20 minutes with no load (to run in the tappets). After re-torque it can go racing, right out of the box, although it may take up to 500 miles for the rings and cylinder walls to loosen up. I use 20W50 oil for the break in, change it at 500 miles, then run 20W50 in warm weather and 10W40 for a considerable amount of winter driving. I use almost exclusively NAPA brand oil which I think is made by Valvoline, nothing special, just regular street car engine oil. I change oil and filter at 4000 mile intervals. The engine currently in my car now has 88,000 miles, running like a champ, and very good cam and tappets. I have never used any special additive in the oil (accent on no additional ZDDP), and I don't intend to do so. I'm sure most of the hype about ZDDP additives is over blown and unnecessary. I'm also sure most of the discussion and concern for lowered ZDDP content in modern motor oil is a waste of concern (although I wouldn't chastise anyone for adding ZDDP to the oil for the break in period of a new engine if it makes them feel good). I do believe that success and long life of a new cam and flat tappets depends greatly on quality of the parts. I would never trust a reground cam to be properly hardened, and I would exercise proper concern for procuring good quality tappets with adequate hardness. I firmly believe that most (if not all) of reported premature cam failures are a result of sub-standard parts or improper installation, and none of it has anything to do with lowered amount of ZDDP in modern oil. All comments are welcome, as I stand resolutely with Teflon coating and asbestos underwear. Barney Gaylord 1958 MGA with an attitude (and 400,000 miles) http://MGAguru.com At 04:01 PM 1/29/2013 -0800, Max Heim wrote: >I just want to point out two things: > >- You apparently don't drive very hard. > >- You have a low-compression motor. > >Higher-performance models used for rallies and track days may have a >completely different experience. > >As they say, YMMV... >.... >on 1/29/13 3:46 PM, Paul Osborne at paul@ece.rochester.edu wrote: > > Ok, here we go . I'm going to be the wrench in the works. 6 years > ago I fully > > rebuilt an 18V engine and placed it service in my 74 BGT. This is a daily > > driver, no show car here , nice but a driver. > > The clock reads 72000miles. since that time I have done the > regular maintance > > , a set of brakes and tires . Now I drive about 500miles to my cottage all > > most 3 times a month from may to oct. > > I use Quakerstate 20w50 oil. only I have noticed nothing but running > > well. My opinion, may there is a need for this additive, maybe it may > > help, but I owen and have owen 5 mgs . my GT > > I bought new, and I see no adverse problems with the oil I use in my cars. > > .... _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 29 19:30:07 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FE9B42856 for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 19:30:07 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from hrndva-omtalb.mail.rr.com (hrndva-omtalb.mail.rr.com [71.74.56.122]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3D514281F for ; Tue, 29 Jan 2013 19:30:02 -0700 (MST) a=1q14fx7sp++YLIU7SzGzgA==:17 a=M1n3L-6PpTwA:10 a=VXLBlChgrDcA:10 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=JlnAE7Pw8s4A:10 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=-uCq_yd7Pqbra4xUWoEA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=J0aUVQLP0FIA:10 a=m3MdUl94G8cA:10 a=1q14fx7sp++YLIU7SzGzgA==:117 Received: from [66.66.164.187] ([66.66.164.187:62376] helo=[192.168.1.3]) by hrndva-oedge03.mail.rr.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.46 r()) with ESMTP id E6/2C-06396-B8488015; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 02:25:16 +0000 From: Paul Osborne Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 21:25:15 -0500 References: To: Max Heim Cc: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Exactly what I was saying. for the every day driver of our cars mostly, stock engine, a good quality oil, and regular changes, what I think most of us have, this works. As for the race crowd, yes, more protection is needed. As for my driving, my overdrive GT with a mild cam gets driven for hours at 70mph + on the way up. In the Adirondacks where the camp is the car gets a nice work out. But that is me. paul o On Jan 29, 2013, at 7:01 PM, Max Heim wrote: > I just want to point out two things: > > - You apparently don't drive very hard. > > - You have a low-compression motor. > > Higher-performance models used for rallies and track days may have a > completely different experience. > > As they say, YMMV... > > > -- > > Max Heim > '66 MGB GHN3L76149 > If you're near Menlo Park, CA, > it's the primer red one with chrome wires > > > > on 1/29/13 3:46 PM, Paul Osborne at paul@ece.rochester.edu wrote: > >> Ok, here we go . I'm going to be the wrench in the works. 6 years ago I fully >> rebuilt an 18V engine and placed it service in my 74 BGT. This is a daily >> driver, no show car here , nice but a driver. >> The clock reads 72000miles. since that time I have done the regular maintance >> , a set of brakes and tires . Now I drive about 500miles to my cottage all >> most 3 times a month from may to oct. >> I use Quakerstate 20w50 oil. only I have noticed nothing but running >> well. My opinion, may there is a need for this additive, maybe it may >> help, but I owen and have owen 5 mgs . my GT >> I bought new, and I see no adverse problems with the oil I use in my cars. >> >> Oh well. >> >> paul o > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/paul@ece.rochester.edu _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 30 02:06:44 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42B714286B for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 02:06:44 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-wi0-f179.google.com (mail-wi0-f179.google.com [209.85.212.179]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E181540E16 for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 02:01:38 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-wi0-f179.google.com with SMTP id o1so1315850wic.12 for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 00:56:49 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:cc:references:subject:date:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority :x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=ILt6O4tQPkE/+qUDGYzzjjhPEUaYCWFWgpTo4s1noEM=; b=Os90x+Ip62fYjkWTyf6y0Kn1lSiFw41X2RNamSQNNUvziCh+ZI0uH/xH2/LEznO/Dc 9382OQs3KuXH2tuD4wIV96gZ7XLAjjEUxjrvcPWmzXLZV77sCsc7eJIyGAQ15DhJk3ol 8yxqWqxFI3WgXY32t170ahttgVCzWYMh5VoXD3ZbrF98xf347y32nqihUw3nxlkIYhjN EHAzqtkJ6/FoDyOOiv+KsJRSEVJG4RGQs7u3fWXiev17NCTNWkYV1W8koDl/UNr6w+hF GY3ouyMOWgDCYj4w2z9ClLUYq2WNQ4JVp/UvWasuS9QgGwKAoJe5lUtsaLRWW5/BNsfL vALQ== ga10mr6861498wib.23.1359536209626; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 00:56:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-3.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.105]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id cu7sm7678033wib.8.2013.01.30.00.56.48 (version=TLSv1.1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Wed, 30 Jan 2013 00:56:48 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" Cc: "MG List" References: <7CAE282D7B834198A902EC22AAFA31CF@paul> <510821D6.2060504@ktc.com> <6AE3F102-B903-44D9-9794-CA0FEB86A5BA@ece.rochester.edu> Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 08:48:24 -0000 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/archive/index.php/t-172482.html And while I haven't found that exact quote on the Quaker State site there is this: http://www.quakerstate.com/#/motor-oil/defy on which one of the slides says "Quaker State Defy has increased zinc anti-wear agents that target surfaces susceptible to high wear while protecting catalytic converter efficiencies." See what I mean? ----- Original Message ----- > I use Quakerstate 20w50 oil. only I have noticed nothing but > running > well. My opinion, may there is a need for this additive, maybe it may > help, but I owen and have owen 5 mgs . my GT > I bought new, and I see no adverse problems with the oil I use in my cars. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 30 07:35:31 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BCAB24286D for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 07:35:31 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-wi0-f180.google.com (mail-wi0-f180.google.com [209.85.212.180]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06406424BA for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 07:35:25 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-wi0-f180.google.com with SMTP id hj13so1687664wib.13 for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 06:30:35 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:to:cc:references:subject:date :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority :x-msmail-priority:x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=N/GbNYxSRqM2Jo1GUwg+p87JqFboT4c3dEAkQIkhUO4=; b=Pi9FvSbTZ/WJPxViqBVGkMvJoT2iv6MvRM8sNR46RXesY+JvPFEB/oSk29c1o4DEpF 6uqxF0PSgAIUzkSRwW2joFS7FmnLA30pkUIB22AN4gGB1+XLGS8VoJSMMqSPk/+nmNcQ /4hA0BQ/dv68MTDbtq5rDBEEWJOqW/qKEZPq2qvV3fPstX87kUt7nuP3P+SMow0xIc/M nj1mEzc2XCUkmAqe0hyY4S61cnKDYl9pONm3Jpr7sNcrLkYB5EG8DyX7JBuqmOqDQ0Ig FGVMZ16ZGNVXQmGMONB56IUsegRbLuUj6ukQpGuyUvpvD8uDKDO75w9a5Zg8ZWC7TnYw jQCA== d18mr9178868wiv.33.1359556235589; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 06:30:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-3.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.105]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id s8sm9476061wif.9.2013.01.30.06.30.34 (version=TLSv1.1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Wed, 30 Jan 2013 06:30:34 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" To: "Paul Osborne" References: <7CAE282D7B834198A902EC22AAFA31CF@paul> <510821D6.2060504@ktc.com> <6AE3F102-B903-44D9-9794-CA0FEB86A5BA@ece.rochester.edu> <872C21468AF242F59EC74C22CA2F8E2B@paul> <5715A7B1-DC60-46AC-8EE7-6D70CF4E621B@ece.rochester.edu> Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 14:30:21 -0000 Cc: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Well that's the point, in the words of the inimitable Sir Patrick Moore - "We Just Don't Know". Like using a lead replacement additive for the little cost it is, I chose to use an oil that does claim to have higher ZDDP than others. For the same reason Rolls Royce cars had starting handles longer than anything else and men have nipples - just in case. ----- Original Message ----- Guess I chose the correct oil 35yrs ago and did not even know it. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 30 08:15:46 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B99842850 for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 08:15:46 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from theta.look.ca (theta.look.ca [216.66.192.9]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 09201424BD for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 08:13:05 -0700 (MST) Received: from e120-pool-d89a5aef.brdbnd.telnetcommunications.com ([216.154.90.239] helo=Barrie-PC.look.ca) by theta.look.ca with esmtpa (user vectis@look.ca)(Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1U0ZGo-0001Er-8P; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 10:08:14 -0500 Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 10:08:15 -0500 To: Barney Gaylord ,Max Heim , MG List From: Barrie Robinson References: <6AE3F102-B903-44D9-9794-CA0FEB86A5BA@ece.rochester.edu> <201301300216.r0U2G9Su016315@nlpi176.prodigy.net> Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Folks, I am with Barney! So I will go to Canadian Tire and to get a a Teflon coating and buy asbestos underwear (with double acting, non slip flaps) I have told this story several times already but here it goes again............ Shell used my restored Austin Healey BJ8 with rebuilt engine to test wear using their lead free fuel. They made a special measuring device and took enormous care to measure the wear due to my driving (reasonably hard but not auto-cross ertc) the car for a year. Result - no measurable wear ! At 08:16 PM 29/01/2013 -0600, Barney Gaylord wrote: >I try not to get involved in religious wars, but I am coming to >Paul's support here with considerable experience of my own. I have >build a number of MGA engines using a Crane Fast Street Cam (with a >bit of extra lift), Heavy Duty valve springs (more than stock spring >force), short tappets and long pushrods from the 18V engine, and >sometimes alloy spring caps (but not always). A couple of these >engine I have done for other people, and no complaints from them. A >couple of these engine I have run in my own car. I nearly always >drive it like I stole it. I have done lots of competition work in >SCCA autocross events (and some local club events). In short, it >is an uprated engine driven by a heavy foot, sometimes at 7,000 rpm >during competition. > >For build it gets lots of standard grease on the cam and tappets >(although I would go along with the cam lube recommended by the cam >manufacturer). For first run and break in the engine runs 2500 rpm >for 20 minutes with no load (to run in the tappets). After >re-torque it can go racing, right out of the box, although it may >take up to 500 miles for the rings and cylinder walls to loosen >up. I use 20W50 oil for the break in, change it at 500 miles, then >run 20W50 in warm weather and 10W40 for a considerable amount of >winter driving. I use almost exclusively NAPA brand oil which I >think is made by Valvoline, nothing special, just regular street car >engine oil. I change oil and filter at 4000 mile intervals. > >The engine currently in my car now has 88,000 miles, running like a >champ, and very good cam and tappets. I have never used any special >additive in the oil (accent on no additional ZDDP), and I don't >intend to do so. I'm sure most of the hype about ZDDP additives is >over blown and unnecessary. I'm also sure most of the discussion >and concern for lowered ZDDP content in modern motor oil is a waste >of concern (although I wouldn't chastise anyone for adding ZDDP to >the oil for the break in period of a new engine if it makes them feel good). > >I do believe that success and long life of a new cam and flat >tappets depends greatly on quality of the parts. I would never >trust a reground cam to be properly hardened, and I would exercise >proper concern for procuring good quality tappets with adequate >hardness. I firmly believe that most (if not all) of reported >premature cam failures are a result of sub-standard parts or >improper installation, and none of it has anything to do with >lowered amount of ZDDP in modern oil. > >All comments are welcome, as I stand resolutely with Teflon coating >and asbestos underwear. > >Barney Gaylord >1958 MGA with an attitude (and 400,000 miles) >http://MGAguru.com > > >At 04:01 PM 1/29/2013 -0800, Max Heim wrote: >>I just want to point out two things: >> >>- You apparently don't drive very hard. >> >>- You have a low-compression motor. >> >>Higher-performance models used for rallies and track days may have a >>completely different experience. >> >>As they say, YMMV... >>.... > > >>on 1/29/13 3:46 PM, Paul Osborne at paul@ece.rochester.edu wrote: >> > Ok, here we go . I'm going to be the wrench in the works. 6 >> years ago I fully >> > rebuilt an 18V engine and placed it service in my 74 BGT. This is a daily >> > driver, no show car here , nice but a driver. >> > The clock reads 72000miles. since that time I have done the >> regular maintance >> > , a set of brakes and tires . Now I drive about 500miles to my cottage all >> > most 3 times a month from may to oct. >> > I use Quakerstate 20w50 oil. only I have noticed nothing >> but running >> > well. My opinion, may there is a need for this additive, maybe it may >> > help, but I owen and have owen 5 mgs . my GT >> > I bought new, and I see no adverse problems with the oil I use in my cars. >> > .... >_______________________________________________ > >Mgs@autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Suggested annual donation $12.75 >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/barrie@look.ca Regards Barrie barrie@look.ca 705-721-9060 _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 30 08:31:28 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2D20424D6 for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 08:31:28 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from relay01.pair.com (relay01.pair.com [209.68.5.15]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 75AB240558 for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 08:29:27 -0700 (MST) Received: (qmail 95041 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2013 15:24:36 -0000 Received: from 97.96.111.81 (HELO mullet) (97.96.111.81) by relay01.pair.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2013 15:24:36 -0000 From: "Stephen West-Fisher" To: "'MG List'" References: <6AE3F102-B903-44D9-9794-CA0FEB86A5BA@ece.rochester.edu> <201301300216.r0U2G9Su016315@nlpi176.prodigy.net> Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 10:23:18 -0500 Thread-Index: Ac3+/AVvZF3rf5pBTj2wuXweF3zxqQAAHS9w Content-Language: en-us Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Yes, unfortunately the marketers are very good at their craft and can get a lot of people to buy their snake oil. Unless you were running your engines at very high power/rpm you didn't need to add lead. It didn't hurt, but you didn't need it. And now they are selling oil additives that haven't been tested - which means you are the test case. I have less concern over oil formulated with high ZDDP but you still do not need it. Remember, your engine was designed when oil had about the same levels as today. My personal belief for the failures was that when parts started being made offshore - US or UK - in India and Sri Lanka they were bad. While many of the workmen are quite skilled, the metallurgy in the area was and still is very substandard. This exists even today, look at the problems Royal Enfield is having, although to their credit they are improving. -- Stephen West-Fisher N4IK -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Barrie Robinson Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 10:08 AM To: Barney Gaylord; Max Heim; MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? Folks, I am with Barney! So I will go to Canadian Tire and to get a a Teflon coating and buy asbestos underwear (with double acting, non slip flaps) I have told this story several times already but here it goes again............ Shell used my restored Austin Healey BJ8 with rebuilt engine to test wear using their lead free fuel. They made a special measuring device and took enormous care to measure the wear due to my driving (reasonably hard but not auto-cross ertc) the car for a year. Result - no measurable wear ! _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 30 09:32:54 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D803B4283D for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 09:32:54 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ia0-f171.google.com (mail-ia0-f171.google.com [209.85.210.171]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 645B240539 for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 09:29:41 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-ia0-f171.google.com with SMTP id z13so2567929iaz.2 for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 08:24:51 -0800 (PST) s=20120113; h=mime-version:x-received:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=6So0nrjkyj22Yj00DGHWBLydXwSjPI7qZCUQK9GO5LA=; b=JOsELOd0aL7Qgv0BcvhUA+0GYTV4C7oRHVQiD9IHtI4FTd+hjkiVqA0wD/PCLb1kF2 cmCtiQtzDxFT2JCZa+IMU0EaYjOAI64cArqUtbX07SDUaYNrCzIjaY4iQlLfqCKaw0je 9k9SoxurBAYmpLAYmlQn1K/2u4iUiQ7/rhT7WIr0IPMWgEO59Qa3V7vhuq2fyUZDN31E kWm/oPb4qRKKoH2/ecR3x10iN8kL4jxs8QMY9jovxpmHDq1PlZ5SN7ssZqOkCVeFJJ/D HGu7X+OgUcLYSCoEvEKtY8mo2PgnUT67hr9Xy3X7mAQuSsK+nTfQpI1pDipNjS6HSaLq /GAg== df3mr3810687igc.94.1359563091360; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 08:24:51 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.64.77.33 with HTTP; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 08:24:51 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 08:24:51 -0800 From: Simon Matthews To: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? Reply from Amsoil Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Some clarification from Amsoil. I assume that Valvolene would say the same thing. I think someone already suggested that the reduced zinc and phosphorus in newer standards only applies to low viscosity oils: Quote: The Premium 20W-50 (ARO) contains 1379 ppm Zinc and 1266 ppm phosphorus. API SL came out in 2001 and became obsolete in 2004, which was superseded by API SM. The Phosphorus limitation is .08 and that only applies to energy conserving oils  that apply to viscosity grades of 20W and 30W. Viscosity grades that are not energy conserving such as 40W or 50W do not carry Zinc or Phosphorus limits and therefore the amount of ZDDP is irrelevant. I can safely tell you that in your engine, either the ARO product or even our Z-Rod oils would be excellent choices. End Quote Simon On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 7:23 AM, Stephen West-Fisher wrote: > Yes, unfortunately the marketers are very good at their craft and can get a > lot of people to buy their snake oil. Unless you were running your engines > at very high power/rpm you didn't need to add lead. It didn't hurt, but you > didn't need it. And now they are selling oil additives that haven't been > tested - which means you are the test case. I have less concern over oil > formulated with high ZDDP but you still do not need it. Remember, your > engine was designed when oil had about the same levels as today. > > My personal belief for the failures was that when parts started being made > offshore - US or UK - in India and Sri Lanka they were bad. While many of > the workmen are quite skilled, the metallurgy in the area was and still is > very substandard. This exists even today, look at the problems Royal Enfield > is having, although to their credit they are improving. > > -- > Stephen West-Fisher > N4IK > > > -----Original Message----- > From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On > Behalf Of Barrie Robinson > Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 10:08 AM > To: Barney Gaylord; Max Heim; MG List > Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? > > Folks, > > I am with Barney! So I will go to Canadian Tire and to get a a Teflon > coating and buy asbestos underwear (with double acting, non slip flaps) I > have told this story several times already but here it goes > again............ > Shell used my restored Austin Healey BJ8 with rebuilt engine to test wear > using their lead free fuel. They made a special measuring device and took > enormous care to measure the wear due to my driving (reasonably hard but not > auto-cross ertc) the car for a > year. Result - no measurable wear ! > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/simon.d.matthews@gmail.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 30 09:34:55 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B951428B2 for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 09:34:55 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-vb0-f44.google.com (mail-vb0-f44.google.com [209.85.212.44]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0335424AB for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 09:34:43 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-vb0-f44.google.com with SMTP id fc26so1100427vbb.31 for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 08:29:54 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:x-received:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :subject:from:to:content-type; bh=0AtGM44zEYa35z8OmUswODMLqWd5+EUIJMDJbVQnJaQ=; b=W1MBv3sAWx4c4cxOoR91DQNzzwqc2ve3cj/r4+RxytNhrcuzbjsHSzrHtswDYKzB6S 2iLU49A837gS4NgwH5XJ/2PpOobLmcbGOd9RjLMabkpYwOlk7c08/aNtembFOc2Q0EbS lfHYCShYrbwzZeZsAkgjyoFBecV984csN8H8vQc7rN1xKMHbYcq8qLKyovODmzYKJ9K/ 0hN8tOfDHA8BmI3dIsFpY+8h5wWjczWQF9xKqqzBiBgCK/qI5iFA3KqEeMq5JRQXJK4q TDDyMCfgPPAG2BuNs/4kRbtUyQn0Yx47dal7/z4T6dwHR87PH0JbkbfrSPLDcekW4qId m/5Q== cp1mr1441272vdb.41.1359563393927; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 08:29:53 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.58.67.72 with HTTP; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 08:29:53 -0800 (PST) References: <6AE3F102-B903-44D9-9794-CA0FEB86A5BA@ece.rochester.edu> <201301300216.r0U2G9Su016315@nlpi176.prodigy.net> Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 09:29:53 -0700 From: Henri Lefebvre <71mgbgt@gmail.com> To: Mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I do not build engines, I leave that responsibility to my mechanic. He rebuilt my '71 MGB GT engine 5 years ago, new cam, lifters, push rods, pistons, rings, polished crank plus bearings etc, slightly more performance than stock. He also rebuilt my TR6 engine 4 years ago, 165hp, triple webers, high compression, 150hp PI cam, lifters, push rods, polished & ported head etc. Both engines were broken-in appropriately on his engine dyno. I use both cars, plus my TR8, as daily drivers during the spring to fall period, and did drive the TR6 on the track in non racing events. My mechanic warrants the rebuilt engines and does all the oil changes using exclusively Castrol GTX plus Comp Cam additive. http://www.compperformancegroupstores.com/store/merchant.mvc?Store_Code=CC&Screen=PROD&Product_Code=159 We both sleep well at night and we have been good friends for 20 years. YMMV Henri 71 MGB GT 75 TR6 80 TR8 _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 30 10:22:12 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52158428BF for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 10:22:12 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm22.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com (nm22.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com [66.94.237.223]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D4744286B for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 10:22:04 -0700 (MST) Received: from [66.94.237.192] by nm22.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2013 17:17:14 -0000 Received: from [66.94.237.109] by tm3.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2013 17:17:14 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1014.access.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 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Wed, 30 Jan 2013 09:17:14 PST Y2hlY2sgaXQgb3V0IGh0dHA6Ly9iaXQubHkvMTI5RnkyZQoKQmlsbAEwAQEBAQ-- Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 09:17:14 -0800 (PST) From: Bill Collier To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] hi Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net check it out http://bit.ly/129Fy2e Bill _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 30 16:16:31 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F80C428E0 for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 16:16:31 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nm24-vm0.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com (nm24-vm0.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com [66.94.236.143]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3613040EAB for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 16:16:04 -0700 (MST) Received: from [66.94.237.195] by nm24.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 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UXlJO8SgMgRRnRn.oV_CupKqcroE9OMP77Bt6iCidvJQ44f8x7Yg95Yuax6k WtleJKA2fuKUpkCjrhdVe2odJACMUc_DwfsM3gAZZMIGhOk0Bff1dx5r7k2C vQqYk81thQa4UtBvQUmicKetDonRIOEBE0SPdqQox5_JcNSSKVgfpQfXR93t aahgHsKTsKdM0BpSGgXPsVHAPE0laDZJ3RK_7ESAT5GcrOfmC9xNPLlngfp6 DYX_ggHH6knfzBUuX8CcL9XmdmU79IuwzqGUMO_7Wbjq5FJ.k2O3LN_gW0y4 mezvrtH5vspwnycAsTRRReUAEV4_SBqHMdcSsp06VDFFDjYuxr4k.cyd9HFl k5C_IttarP3yzh9jntQ91VsDYg8byBbEY.mq6MOPM0vC2N37GwrashXVApKM N19foc8sOzjpHEffN9CRm431UXv0yoaXCRq_B6nrveRPByHRXDsz4FkidXVe 4l06ay79xZL0vRb5Io3dzUh1jAhzAaVVqxPgoJtb.Xw0T_yjlcYy7_hmS6WU H4gH8yxP3qKIKVelJzJGKWYVmGj68NjfyC8ztTey2.9IB2ZkL5sNC Received: from [190.20.39.157] by web184405.mail.bf1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 15:11:13 PST Y2hlY2sgdGhpcyBwYWdlIG91dCBodHRwOi8vbXNuLm5iY25ld3MuY29tLWltNy5uZXQvZmluYW5jZS8KCkJpbGwBMAEBAQE- Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 15:11:13 -0800 (PST) From: Bill Collier To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] hi Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net check this page out http://msn.nbcnews.com-im7.net/finance/ Bill _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 30 16:41:31 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72E254290B for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 16:41:31 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from bradakis.com (bradakis.com [166.70.156.35]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFF2D428B8; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 16:40:48 -0700 (MST) Received: from mark.bradakis.com (bradakis.com [166.70.156.35]) by bradakis.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67233A07BB; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 16:37:45 -0700 (MST) Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 16:37:44 -0700 From: Mark J Bradakis User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:18.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/18.0 SeaMonkey/2.15.1 To: Triumphs , mgs , Spitfires@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] Drat. Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net I really need to get some filters set up to keep that crap from hijacked emails getting through. My apologies for not doing it sooner. mjb. _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 30 17:18:23 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07F05428F9 for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 17:18:23 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from snt0-omc1-s34.snt0.hotmail.com (snt0-omc1-s34.snt0.hotmail.com [65.55.90.45]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED39F40E16 for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 17:18:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from SNT403-EAS115 ([65.55.90.9]) by snt0-omc1-s34.snt0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Wed, 30 Jan 2013 16:13:25 -0800 References: <6AE3F102-B903-44D9-9794-CA0FEB86A5BA@ece.rochester.edu> <201301300216.r0U2G9Su016315@nlpi176.prodigy.net> From: Mike E Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 19:13:24 -0500 To: Barney Gaylord FILETIME=[C9861160:01CDFF47] Cc: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net That's pretty much what I think, too. And if a lack of ZDDP were going to destroy our engines, it would no longer be academic - we'd all know somebody with critical valvetrain wear or would have our own tappet problems. -Mike Eldred Wilmington, VT 1951 M38 Jeep 1954 MG TF 1973 Midget 1977 MGB Sent from my iPad On Jan 29, 2013, at 21:22, "Barney Gaylord" wrote: > I try not to get involved in religious wars, but I am coming to Paul's support here with considerable experience of my own. I have build a number of MGA engines using a Crane Fast Street Cam (with a bit of extra lift), Heavy Duty valve springs (more than stock spring force), short tappets and long pushrods from the 18V engine, and sometimes alloy spring caps (but not always). A couple of these engine I have done for other people, and no complaints from them. A couple of these engine I have run in my own car. I nearly always drive it like I stole it. I have done lots of competition work in SCCA autocross events (and some local club events). In short, it is an uprated engine driven by a heavy foot, sometimes at 7,000 rpm during competition. > > For build it gets lots of standard grease on the cam and tappets (although I would go along with the cam lube recommended by the cam manufacturer). For first run and break in the engine runs 2500 rpm for 20 minutes with no load (to run in the tappets). After re-torque it can go racing, right out of the box, although it may take up to 500 miles for the rings and cylinder walls to loosen up. I use 20W50 oil for the break in, change it at 500 miles, then run 20W50 in warm weather and 10W40 for a considerable amount of winter driving. I use almost exclusively NAPA brand oil which I think is made by Valvoline, nothing special, just regular street car engine oil. I change oil and filter at 4000 mile intervals. > > The engine currently in my car now has 88,000 miles, running like a champ, and very good cam and tappets. I have never used any special additive in the oil (accent on no additional ZDDP), and I don't intend to do so. I'm sure most of the hype about ZDDP additives is over blown and unnecessary. I'm also sure most of the discussion and concern for lowered ZDDP content in modern motor oil is a waste of concern (although I wouldn't chastise anyone for adding ZDDP to the oil for the break in period of a new engine if it makes them feel good). > > I do believe that success and long life of a new cam and flat tappets depends greatly on quality of the parts. I would never trust a reground cam to be properly hardened, and I would exercise proper concern for procuring good quality tappets with adequate hardness. I firmly believe that most (if not all) of reported premature cam failures are a result of sub-standard parts or improper installation, and none of it has anything to do with lowered amount of ZDDP in modern oil. > > All comments are welcome, as I stand resolutely with Teflon coating and asbestos underwear. > > Barney Gaylord > 1958 MGA with an attitude (and 400,000 miles) > http://MGAguru.com > > > At 04:01 PM 1/29/2013 -0800, Max Heim wrote: >> I just want to point out two things: >> >> - You apparently don't drive very hard. >> >> - You have a low-compression motor. >> >> Higher-performance models used for rallies and track days may have a >> completely different experience. >> >> As they say, YMMV... >> .... > > >> on 1/29/13 3:46 PM, Paul Osborne at paul@ece.rochester.edu wrote: >> > Ok, here we go . I'm going to be the wrench in the works. 6 years ago I fully >> > rebuilt an 18V engine and placed it service in my 74 BGT. This is a daily >> > driver, no show car here , nice but a driver. >> > The clock reads 72000miles. since that time I have done the regular maintance >> > , a set of brakes and tires . Now I drive about 500miles to my cottage all >> > most 3 times a month from may to oct. >> > I use Quakerstate 20w50 oil. only I have noticed nothing but running >> > well. My opinion, may there is a need for this additive, maybe it may >> > help, but I owen and have owen 5 mgs . my GT >> > I bought new, and I see no adverse problems with the oil I use in my cars. >> > .... > _______________________________________________ > > Mgs@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.75 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/redscirocco@hotmail.com _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 30 20:57:51 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C07554284A for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 20:57:51 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from nlpi162.prodigy.net (nlpi162.sbcis.sbc.com [207.115.36.34]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 393324052E for ; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 20:57:42 -0700 (MST) Received: from barney-gaylord.mgaguru.com (adsl-75-5-66-51.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net [75.5.66.51]) (authenticated bits=0) by nlpi162.prodigy.net (8.14.4 smptauth/8.14.4) with ESMTP id r0V3qhLH027200; Wed, 30 Jan 2013 21:52:50 -0600 Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 21:52:45 -0600 To: "Eugene Balinski" From: Barney Gaylord References: <201301300216.r0U2G9Su016315@nlpi176.prodigy.net> Cc: MG List Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Anyone who has replaced a MG camshaft in the past 20 years is using an aftermarket replica part. I'm not sure anyone knows the objective quality of original equipment parts that are long gone. I can only say that I believe the Crane Cams cam is a good quality part, made from an original forging. There is a good chance the some other recent replacement cams are not such good quality, but I don't have any personal experiance with those, as I have been using the Crane Cams cams exclusively since turn of the century. One interesting point is that the 18V type tappets were off the shelf parts forn Moss Motors, way back then, and they have not failed or eaten the cam. Maybe they don't make them like they used to. There has been more recent reports of tappets not being hard enough, resulting in failure of the tappets and damage to a cam shaft. The point is that many of us use standard motor oil and drive engines long and hard with no cam or tappet problem. Then there are a few who experience cam failure in as little as a few thousand miles after assembly with new parts. This is not everyone mind you, but the few who have failures like this make a lot of news (or noise). To me this must point to a parts problem (or installation issues), not an oil problem. If it was an oil problem all of the engine would be failing (including mine). I just checked my records, and the last tappets I bougnt were the 18V type from Moss (460-605) in August 2000. It was 8 pieces for $30.60 total (possibly includug pro-rata shipping cost). Less the $4 each. This part number has been listed as N/A for quite some time. Today an 18V type tappet set from the same source (460-604) is $199.95, or $25 each. As I recall, some time after I bought mine there were qualith problems, and Moss discontinued sales of their part, referring customers to some much more expensive parts supplied my a well know "speed shop" type source. That may be what they are selling now for the much higher price. Moss now also offers an "Uprated Tappet Set" (18V type) for $79.95 ($10 each). Go figure. Uprated from what I don't know, and none of these tappets have ever had any functional specs attached (like hardness figures). I'm pretty hep on such things, but I have no idea what the quality level is on any of the parts sold in the past 10 years. There have been some recent comments on various BBS about actual measured hardness of some tappets, some being better than others. I don't know how to judge the quality of any tappet without hardness testing. Considering the current state of affairs, I think any vendor selling flat tappets should include a certified test results sheet with every tappet shipped. And if somone does a QA test and finds the parts don't measure up to the spec, the vendor should be severely chastised in public (or worse). $.03, Barney At 01:47 PM 1/30/2013 -0500, Eugene Balinski wrote: >Barney, > > Is there a possibility that the Crane cam that you use along > with the tappets are of better quality or different materials than > the stock components in an 18V motor ? > >Maybe that is the difference in the ZDDP requuirements ? >.... _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 31 02:13:11 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 494E1428FC for ; Thu, 31 Jan 2013 02:13:11 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: mgs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-we0-f173.google.com (mail-we0-f173.google.com [74.125.82.173]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B42B840E6A for ; Thu, 31 Jan 2013 02:12:58 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-we0-f173.google.com with SMTP id r5so1842066wey.4 for ; Thu, 31 Jan 2013 01:08:04 -0800 (PST) d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:message-id:from:to:references:subject:date:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority :x-mailer:x-mimeole:x-gm-message-state; bh=wfUjWi5jFCSCcI+ZcDQJnXFAu0sRGOLLHTktR2keEqQ=; b=dwgTYv3huY0OJXcOfplC1H2U2y/pXJPrCeVvd6AiorqNqyvkUXSFY2kmjWzx1kpUkh MavPzpfo3Ax4prWZ/qB9K4poVAy7yfPiA9IKczsE3ftkyhyYHZPr+K/7vhB6qy+zXL6C KNK2Lv9w8fkxDiHoM03Yj4HvhHZs2gpiAgvLU4QDJafcmC+jYqk7TGslotZTNid7+yrr rsdccK/KcxOSrQgluXGly+OI8l1o1mihZ65ZS6yxhzb4wGt9sFpf8eXvoiLIDTytLFZk beG4qDcXHZNf7OYxnF3ceVIOIW7mCroDqvMHNko9TAEE+ogKx/8BDlr40PHGRwU6sxoY +1aw== vn2mr13782165wjc.23.1359623284123; Thu, 31 Jan 2013 01:08:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from paul (know-mailgateway-3.server.virginmedia.net. [62.254.26.105]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id fa15sm13660953wid.7.2013.01.31.01.08.02 (version=TLSv1.1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Thu, 31 Jan 2013 01:08:03 -0800 (PST) From: "PaulHunt73" To: "MG List" References: <6AE3F102-B903-44D9-9794-CA0FEB86A5BA@ece.rochester.edu><201301300216.r0U2G9Su016315@nlpi176.prodigy.net> Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2013 09:07:49 -0000 Subject: Re: [Mgs] ZDDP (Again)??!!?? Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Quite apart from lead in fuel or not being a completely different issue to ZDDP in oil, your one-off uncontrolled experience is completely at odds with the tests that the Motor Industry Research Association performed on behalf of the Federation of British Historic Vehicle Clubs when lead was about to be removed from petrol in the UK. These tests used multiple, new, BL (known to be more susceptible to valve seat recession than other manufacturers) engines run for many hours at high rpm and loading, and showed conclusively that significant recession did occur. They tested a number of additives on behalf of their manufacturers which gave a wide range of results, only four of which gave a significant reduction in recession, although none were as good as lead. They publicised these four products, and subsequently a fifth, but not the ones that failed. For some years several petrol manufacturers produced a grade called Lead Replacement that contained one of these additives, including Shell. Subsequently a quote attributed to BMW said that an engine that has run 30k on leaded, and not had replacement valves or seats recut, will have enough lead leached into the valves and seats to protect them 'for the rest of their normal service life'. Even though my roadster engine falls into that category, and because I run it quite often for long durations at motorway speeds, I choose to use one of the additives. One bottle a year at about #6 is cheap insurance. And maybe replacement cams and tappets *are* softer now than the originals, but doesn't that *make* the case for using an oil with higher levels of ZDDP if ZDDP really does reduce wear as is incontrovertibly the case? Again, one chooses to or not, but it is better to be informed than uninformed. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- > Shell used my restored Austin Healey BJ8 with rebuilt engine to test wear > using their lead free fuel. They made a special measuring device and took > enormous care to measure the wear due to my driving (reasonably hard but > not auto-cross ertc) the car for a year. Result - no measurable wear ! _______________________________________________ Mgs@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mharc@autox.team.net