From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 1 10:41:59 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E8A02D03AE for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 10:41:59 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from nm28-vm8.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (nm28-vm8.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com [98.136.216.167]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id E9AE12D02A7 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 10:40:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [98.137.12.190] by nm28.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Jun 2012 16:41:10 -0000 Received: from [68.142.200.224] by tm11.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Jun 2012 16:41:10 -0000 Received: from [66.94.237.105] by t5.bullet.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Jun 2012 16:41:10 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1010.access.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Jun 2012 16:41:10 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 224818.62522.bm@omp1010.access.mail.mud.yahoo.com Received: (qmail 46302 invoked from network); 1 Jun 2012 16:41:09 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=flash.net; h=DKIM-Signature:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-SMTP:Received:From:To:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:Thread-Index; b=b4f/crxrIy3uwGe8A3++7nt27di4zETMDvRbqLrqMjx2hgJrlDkfGXT2UYIZ7E+9aabZE93Wbt4SEGUHwT6UcA7Vqn2Zd9jmIoEYRFr68wh0TGpbhab2CiNMIdE6snWPrsJ/DDGxxCLV9DCCmG+ZDh4qx15pU+ANG0+WVikE0FM= ; DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=flash.net; s=s1024; t=1338568869; bh=e3WDi/x9dNJ+kt9ku/yPe9cLm0cNFN2+WqluRVuW1AQ=; h=X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-SMTP:Received:From:To:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:Thread-Index; b=QQkQFsLlpZEZYaWWvb7r7dn77e9qQT/k/E9nM34P8cDWqtXvx9qBt4VK85Uf/JbcsBdwaSeRnASZJHxel9iqamaAU0nz6rEfsJQBt3vFETLgs+yaWlSaKT7MucAU+MYmrEeIvAlykMMwKDogpveZ3GDJeiP2F09xI2P4MvEa5B8= X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-YMail-OSG: BBvnVzsVM1mjmSHXL0Ir_ojeZZmVqaiM8y_fMXlgONfmK8x DRqctSNZm7p2syFjAdM1Cou1Q7fIon8XzT5A1zdV_lpidzmHIBtC_xXUETZZ VfIliRrIZytXjdoj1Hr.NaL6SCHzFpJffvgwCrtA7YnMTGXmhU8dZpFgzV6R yWUE5M10F9SpZUO8epWTZ_uji3cf3zG.tXs5xtVnG7SShJX_XG9i3oSQuy7L 8dBwaa.mmmVblOY0vi3llE0Z08pRLJUw61vrlxOyenkDSdvHbQhoGknTMIH7 89qnHkYOp2225wHYWLZa.SOMOfXL7G4U2FclJ7srCU8vQOi3sh4uXVlDwf98 OkhKAl1CKP_jcw5hTRIPcRN4I9IVPYaYsZC6usNjkhIQKKWEO5VFzoWPVSoq 67jUIvRDivmLyAh5DumJxxBrDGPdj3tv2zPDEcJ3T6AGQov0w4.SHi0u4K3L t0Se.3qRczbqz6itOiWaLl3yHlGeVc6hUVX03VmJoS0Y_Np8hCtTTBNlfOnU Ljn6tgDPq2csoyA-- X-Yahoo-SMTP: MDGza_qswBAgyXr4jGOoN7xw7ESbp_tRSUhNZ0MvX6drvGE- Received: from bboffice (bill_beecher@96.26.3.50 with login) by smtp114.sbc.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 01 Jun 2012 09:41:09 -0700 PDT From: To: Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2012 11:41:08 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: Ac1AFVbzJhleoQsWQQuxIahZvOMekA== X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Subject: [TR] Cleaning Fluid X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net I think we have always brought the subject of lube & hydro fluifs to a pretty fine point on this list. But, what about cleaning, degreasing, fluids? As I begin a new project I am starting to have to fight the 50 years of buildup on this latest acquisition. I bought the ZEP Purple degreaser, this stuff seems to work real good, wear gloves and don't let it get into an open cut. My only complaint is that it has a slick film residue that really requires some clean water scrubbing after you have degreased your part. So what EPA compliant(or not) compound are you using? Pros & Cons? Inquiring minds need to know, Bill Bill Beecher '58 TR3A TS/30766L "Tarbaby" '62 TR3B TCF/2549L www.triumphowners.com/1566 '68 Land Rover Series IIa 88" "The Beast" "Hello, my name is Bill and I own an old British car. Now...What are the next 11 steps?" ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 1 12:50:14 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D5B612D02FF for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 12:50:14 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from m1plsmtpa01-03.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (m1plsmtpa01-03.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.4]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 22F8C2D0207 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 12:39:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ALFA ([76.249.237.211]) by m1plsmtpa01-03.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net with id H6gS1j0074aM3T8016gSGz; Fri, 01 Jun 2012 11:40:26 -0700 Message-ID: <053E054339224464B21C3B32C20D5052@ranteer.local> From: "Dave" To: References: In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2012 13:40:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 15.4.3555.308 Subject: Re: [TR] Cleaning Fluid X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net I have had great success with (depending upon the severity) carb cleaning fluid (buy from walmart, not flaps); add fine steel wool (0000) where necessary orange cleaning fluid from the dollar store a couple gallons of that cleaning solution (comes in a 1 gal can; has a little plastic parts holder in it) and for a more macro approach, buy a good power washer. -----Original Message----- From: bill_beecher@flash.net Sent: Friday, June 01, 2012 11:41 AM To: triumphs@autox.team.net Subject: [TR] Cleaning Fluid I think we have always brought the subject of lube & hydro fluifs to a pretty fine point on this list. But, what about cleaning, degreasing, fluids? As I begin a new project I am starting to have to fight the 50 years of buildup on this latest acquisition. I bought the ZEP Purple degreaser, this stuff seems to work real good, wear gloves and don't let it get into an open cut. My only complaint is that it has a slick film residue that really requires some clean water scrubbing after you have degreased your part. ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 1 13:23:24 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2954D2D02D9 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 13:23:24 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from va3outboundpool.messaging.microsoft.com (va3ehsobe003.messaging.microsoft.com [216.32.180.13]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 557DA2D0290 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 12:58:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail134-va3-R.bigfish.com (10.7.14.246) by VA3EHSOBE010.bigfish.com (10.7.40.12) with Microsoft SMTP Server id 14.1.225.22; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 18:58:24 +0000 Received: from mail134-va3 (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail134-va3-R.bigfish.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 732E6180048 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 18:58:24 +0000 (UTC) X-Forefront-Antispam-Report: CIP:157.56.236.85; KIP:(null); UIP:(null); IPV:NLI; H:BY2PRD0410HT004.namprd04.prod.outlook.com; RD:none; EFVD:NLI X-SpamScore: 1 X-BigFish: PS1(zzzz1202hzzz32i2a8h668h839h944hd25hf0ah) Received-SPF: permerror (mail134-va3: error in processing during lookup of domain of redcross.org: Could not find a valid SPF record) client-ip=157.56.236.85; envelope-from=Michael.Mack@redcross.org; helo=BY2PRD0410HT004.namprd04.prod.outlook.com ;.outlook.com ; Received: from mail134-va3 (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mail134-va3 (MessageSwitch) id 1338577102921197_17855; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 18:58:22 +0000 (UTC) Received: from VA3EHSMHS019.bigfish.com (unknown [10.7.14.241]) by mail134-va3.bigfish.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D412936004D for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 18:58:22 +0000 (UTC) Received: from BY2PRD0410HT004.namprd04.prod.outlook.com (157.56.236.85) by VA3EHSMHS019.bigfish.com (10.7.99.29) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.225.23; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 18:58:16 +0000 Received: from BY2PRD0410MB377.namprd04.prod.outlook.com ([169.254.10.181]) by BY2PRD0410HT004.namprd04.prod.outlook.com ([10.255.83.39]) with mapi id 14.16.0164.004; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 18:58:47 +0000 From: "Mack, Michael (Rochester)" To: "triumphs@autox.team.net" Thread-Topic: [TR] Cleaning Fluid Thread-Index: AQHNQCeAPs2kB0YMCEeCYIRLBGtYNpblz3yQ Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2012 18:58:47 +0000 Message-ID: <6A6C6BB6A374144385E5E3CF3864B54511DF564C@BY2PRD0410MB377.namprd04.prod.outlook.com> References: <053E054339224464B21C3B32C20D5052@ranteer.local> In-Reply-To: <053E054339224464B21C3B32C20D5052@ranteer.local> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US x-originating-ip: [162.6.97.24] MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: redcross.org Subject: Re: [TR] Cleaning Fluid X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net I've had good success with Simple Green. I used it undiluted on the outside of my Spitfires tranny and cleaned up some vinyl GT6 seats. I bought a gallon pretty cheap at BJs wholesale club. Sam's Club probably has it also. Mike Mack 80 TR8 73 Stag 79 Spit 70 GT6 ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 1 13:50:43 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 61A1F2D039F for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 13:50:43 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-gg0-f169.google.com (mail-gg0-f169.google.com [209.85.161.169]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B1F02D02D9 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 13:50:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: by ggm4 with SMTP id 4so2736006ggm.14 for ; Fri, 01 Jun 2012 12:51:16 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=irCf+d5NVtA44u2xiXauWVyMl5OzRVnrupkoDSWR3hA=; b=sgiRLcxLM4I/1yzSjWv32Z8SM1R93zdKwayHY75ZMcZUCfgafBwIBYA67RnXBMnmmc IfJGxiNjbGdN6H7Rsl6ziCEd5AbskMfSkVM8EjBZNabjYbyADLhQPeDldno7JxSlKj4v qJdKg2AuZasDsPt6n6fi3/U3y0h5MaOQv0SNM3wwp2r3VTc8+0MiA5ff6CeN8nWoyjE8 vm/HoM/L+DI7DPMue2ZnF3CeN1Un7sVdsEWv08c+o1I6pWawpIQV3LV5DgMA+VCL26Ie Ff7e4KP08oWmq0q3A5NR6Hdwfpisen/cjMremYRor7su99PLo0fYnPyRyQO6u/J6GoIX YMSw== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.149.225 with SMTP id ud1mr2784302igb.74.1338580276212; Fri, 01 Jun 2012 12:51:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.50.212.66 with HTTP; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 12:51:16 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2012 15:51:16 -0400 Message-ID: From: Benjamin Zwissler To: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Subject: Re: [TR] Silicon and Paint X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net For what's its worth, my paint shop guy said clean up any silcon (Armor All, DOT5, whatever) before you do any sanding. He said sanding will push the silicon into the paint, plastic, etc and then no amount of cleaning will remove it (barring cleaning to bare metal). He recommended Dawn dishwashing detergent. I did that but it still wasn't sheeting water like I liked so I followed up with some water soluble parts degreaser from Sam's Club, then I used Dawn after that again. Worked great. I was painting a TR8 plastic dash that I know had been ArmorAll'd multiple times 'cuz I'd done it. Ben..... ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 1 13:57:54 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C57132D03C7 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 13:57:54 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from devils.ext.ti.com (devils.ext.ti.com [198.47.26.153]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B3B52D02D9 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 13:53:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dlelxv30.itg.ti.com ([172.17.2.17]) by devils.ext.ti.com (8.13.7/8.13.7) with ESMTP id q51Js0Fq032554 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 14:54:00 -0500 Received: from DFLE70.ent.ti.com (dfle70.ent.ti.com [128.247.5.40]) by dlelxv30.itg.ti.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id q51Js096024740 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 14:54:00 -0500 Received: from DLEE01.ent.ti.com ([fe80::9545:c9d2:c053:428]) by DFLE70.ent.ti.com ([fe80::db3:609a:aa62:e1ec%22]) with mapi id 14.01.0323.003; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 14:54:00 -0500 From: "Fisher, Ed" To: "triumphs@autox.team.net" Thread-Topic: degreaser Thread-Index: Ac1AMEgsqrIq0FyFTeeZH7hV6O12gQ== Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2012 19:54:00 +0000 Message-ID: <67A276399E247245AC2050FC103C4E8A3E304868@DLEE01.ent.ti.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US x-originating-ip: [128.247.5.50] MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Subject: [TR] degreaser X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net The parts that I can remove are taken to the 'quarter car wash' and I blast the bejeebers out of them. Take coveralls and googles, there is a lot of blowback. Those that aren't readily transported I use a trusty old, worn out, rounded off flat screwdriver as a scraper. Once I have broken through the main layers I use a product from Kano Labs called Floway. It works pretty darned well, with some scrubbing of course.. Ed Fisher Dallas, Tx ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 1 16:37:22 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4EF932D02FF for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 16:37:22 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com (cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com [75.180.132.120]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA8FC2D0233 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 16:31:33 -0600 (MDT) Authentication-Results: cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com smtp.user=tr3driver@ca.rr.com; auth=pass (LOGIN) X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.0 cv=KKDY/S5o c=1 sm=0 a=iMoyTtzuBmCwh8BMLBhhUw==:17 a=gW9qi44zxCkA:10 a=05ChyHeVI94A:10 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=ayC55rCoAAAA:8 a=fv4QCWkNaZEn1qZx6sAA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=iMoyTtzuBmCwh8BMLBhhUw==:117 X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 X-Originating-IP: 66.127.147.4 Received: from [66.127.147.4] ([66.127.147.4:17444] helo=ryoung2wna) by cdptpa-oedge02.mail.rr.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.46 r()) with ESMTPA id 4E/A3-05395-7F249CF4; Fri, 01 Jun 2012 22:32:23 +0000 From: "Randall" To: "'Don Hiscock'" References: <4D4FABA15328FC42B1AA0DEE4673548C86F7FD34FC@DR-EX-04.datacenter.dataresolution.net> <1338485096.75416.YahooMailNeo@web120202.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> <0be001cd3f60$88988680$99c99380$@rr.com> In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2012 15:32:22 -0700 Message-ID: <002801cd4046$6a47a120$3ed6e360$@rr.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: Ac0/d9KRQDiOgs7SQKScXlvHRVRVwgAyxDbA Content-Language: en-us Cc: triumphs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [TR] brake fluid X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net > If "synthetic" fluids are not based on petroleum, then what are they > based on? Sorry, I mistyped. I meant to say not directly based on petroleum. Petroleum may have been the starting point for some of the chemicals involved, but there were multiple chemical reactions involved in producing the brake fluid, it wasn't simply distilled or cracked from petroleum (the way gasoline, diesel fuel, "conventional" motor oil, etc are). I did a bit of poking around on the net. According to one paper, one formula for conventional brake fluid is approx 53% glycol ether and 35% Boric acid ester; plus smaller amounts of polyglycol, bisphenol A, "antioxidant", and "anticorrosive". "Glycol ether" and "boric acid ester" both cover an entire class of chemicals, the paper did not give specifics. But apparently glycol ethers are commonly made by reacting ethylene oxide with anhydrous alcohol in the presence of a suitable catalyst. Boric acid esters are made by combining boric acid with either an alcohol or a phenol, then using various techniques to extract the desired ester from the result. One text said: "Some of the methods that have been used to separate methyl borate from the azeotrope are extraction with sulfuric acid and distillation of the enriched phase (18), treatment with calcium chloride or lithium chloride (19, 20), washing with a hydrocarbon and distillation (21), ..." (I didn't pay to read the remainder of the paper) Ethylene oxide is produced by oxidizing ethylene gas, which in turn is produced (by cracking) from petroleum (either oil or natural gas). So there is your link back to "dinosaur juice". Does that answer the question? -- Randall ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 1 19:47:56 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E5772D0226 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 19:47:56 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from smtp.fuse.net (unknown [64.8.71.19]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC09F2D017C for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 19:45:35 -0600 (MDT) X_CMAE_Category: 0,0 Undefined,Undefined X-CNFS-Analysis: v=2.0 cv=GZKVbHrL c=1 sm=0 a=xLz2L0sCA/pk1mBfSkem+A==:17 a=vYbi2SD7W5AA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=w1lZMHalAAAA:8 a=a6tZ-xuzlM7F1lc1lQ8A:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=xLz2L0sCA/pk1mBfSkem+A==:117 X-CM-Score: 0 X-Scanned-by: Cloudmark Authority Engine Authentication-Results: smtp02.cincibell.synacor.com smtp.mail=dconnitt@fuse.net; spf=unknown; sender-id=unknown Authentication-Results: smtp02.cincibell.synacor.com header.from=dconnitt@fuse.net; sender-id=unknown Received-SPF: error (smtp02.cincibell.synacor.com: 72.49.196.163 is neither permitted nor denied by domain of fuse.net Received: from [72.49.196.163] ([72.49.196.163:50450] helo=DaveLaptop) by smtp.fuse.net (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39787)) with ESMTP id 58/4E-32180-17079CF4; Fri, 01 Jun 2012 21:46:25 -0400 Message-ID: <9B2824F72CBB41E39983854016CF1956@DaveLaptop> From: "Dave Connitt" To: "Benjamin Zwissler" , References: In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2012 21:50:32 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Mail 6.0.6002.18197 Subject: Re: [TR] Silicon and Paint X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net I agree regarding using Dawn dishwashing soap to prep a car for paint. I had a problem with fisheye while painting my engine compartment. Not sure where it came from (the silicon), but it really screwed up the paint. I washed it with water and Dawn, rinsed really well and then sanded with 400 wet/dry to get down to a smooth finish. Then wiped it down with paint prep (wash on/wipe off method) with two lint free paper towels.Thankfully, that did the trick but what a pain.. Dave Connitt '67 TR4A IRS http://home.fuse.net/davestr4a ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 1 19:48:34 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A7C82D048B for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 19:48:34 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from smtp.fuse.net (unknown [64.8.71.19]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B8C7F2D0223 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 19:48:00 -0600 (MDT) X_CMAE_Category: 0,0 Undefined,Undefined X-CNFS-Analysis: v=2.0 cv=GZKVbHrL c=1 sm=0 a=xLz2L0sCA/pk1mBfSkem+A==:17 a=vYbi2SD7W5AA:10 a=w1lZMHalAAAA:8 a=2a17aCi6Z86fciX2TnMA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=ZYZONdyl0BK64gb-OQQA:9 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=xLz2L0sCA/pk1mBfSkem+A==:117 X-CM-Score: 0 X-Scanned-by: Cloudmark Authority Engine Authentication-Results: smtp02.cincibell.synacor.com smtp.mail=dconnitt@fuse.net; spf=unknown; sender-id=unknown Authentication-Results: smtp02.cincibell.synacor.com header.from=dconnitt@fuse.net; sender-id=unknown Received-SPF: error (smtp02.cincibell.synacor.com: 72.49.196.163 is neither permitted nor denied by domain of fuse.net Received: from [72.49.196.163] ([72.49.196.163:50452] helo=DaveLaptop) by smtp.fuse.net (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.47 r(39787)) with ESMTP id 2C/0F-32180-30179CF4; Fri, 01 Jun 2012 21:48:51 -0400 Message-ID: <971AB9DEF773456EB452E214A30CD080@DaveLaptop> From: "Dave Connitt" To: Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2012 21:52:58 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Mail 6.0.6002.18197 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Subject: [TR] Brake Fluid X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Thanks to everyone that responded to my question. Since I bought both master cylinders from The Roadster Factory, I think I will just buy fluid from them the next time I order something else. Now, back to painting.. Thanks again everyone! Dave Connitt ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 1 21:27:49 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2AAC32D0271 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 21:27:49 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from smtpauth14.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth14.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.39]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id A40FB2D0218 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 21:27:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 19831 invoked from network); 2 Jun 2012 03:28:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (76.249.237.211) by smtpauth14.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.39) with ESMTP; 02 Jun 2012 03:28:00 -0000 Message-ID: <018F5B721D654E5392612EF17DE74398@ranteer.local> From: "Dave" To: References: <4D4FABA15328FC42B1AA0DEE4673548C86F7FD34FC@DR-EX-04.datacenter.dataresolution.net><1338485096.75416.YahooMailNeo@web120202.mail.ne1.yahoo.com><0be001cd3f60$88988680$99c99380$@rr.com> <002801cd4046$6a47a120$3ed6e360$@rr.com> In-Reply-To: <002801cd4046$6a47a120$3ed6e360$@rr.com> Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2012 22:26:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 15.4.3555.308 Subject: Re: [TR] brake fluid X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net but the question still remains (at least for me) what's the difference between dot 3 and dot 4? -----Original Message----- From: Randall Sent: Friday, June 01, 2012 5:32 PM To: 'Don Hiscock' Cc: triumphs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [TR] brake fluid > If "synthetic" fluids are not based on petroleum, then what are they > based on? Sorry, I mistyped. I meant to say not directly based on petroleum. Petroleum may have been the starting point for some of the chemicals involved, but there were multiple chemical reactions involved in producing the brake fluid, it wasn't simply distilled or cracked from petroleum (the way gasoline, diesel fuel, "conventional" motor oil, etc are). I did a bit of poking around on the net. According to one paper, one formula for conventional brake fluid is approx 53% glycol ether and 35% Boric acid ester; plus smaller amounts of polyglycol, bisphenol A, "antioxidant", and "anticorrosive". "Glycol ether" and "boric acid ester" both cover an entire class of chemicals, the paper did not give specifics. But apparently glycol ethers are commonly made by reacting ethylene oxide with anhydrous alcohol in the presence of a suitable catalyst. Boric acid esters are made by combining boric acid with either an alcohol or a phenol, then using various techniques to extract the desired ester from the result. One text said: "Some of the methods that have been used to separate methyl borate from the azeotrope are extraction with sulfuric acid and distillation of the enriched phase (18), treatment with calcium chloride or lithium chloride (19, 20), washing with a hydrocarbon and distillation (21), ..." (I didn't pay to read the remainder of the paper) Ethylene oxide is produced by oxidizing ethylene gas, which in turn is produced (by cracking) from petroleum (either oil or natural gas). So there is your link back to "dinosaur juice". Does that answer the question? ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 1 21:57:52 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B746E2D024A for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 21:57:52 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from p3plsmtpa07-06.prod.phx3.secureserver.net (p3plsmtpa07-06.prod.phx3.secureserver.net [173.201.192.235]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id DB1872D0222 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 21:57:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 24457 invoked from network); 2 Jun 2012 03:58:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (76.249.237.211) by p3plsmtpa07-06.prod.phx3.secureserver.net (173.201.192.235) with ESMTP; 02 Jun 2012 03:58:18 -0000 Message-ID: <64B0E8834D95454C88A417332106FAB9@ranteer.local> From: "Dave" To: References: <4D4FABA15328FC42B1AA0DEE4673548C86F7FD34FC@DR-EX-04.datacenter.dataresolution.net><1338485096.75416.YahooMailNeo@web120202.mail.ne1.yahoo.com><0be001cd3f60$88988680$99c99380$@rr.com> <002801cd4046$6a47a120$3ed6e360$@rr.com> In-Reply-To: <002801cd4046$6a47a120$3ed6e360$@rr.com> Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2012 22:58:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 15.4.3555.308 Subject: Re: [TR] brake fluid X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net here is a good description of the various brake fluids including 5.1 there are actually numerous discourses on the net about brake fluid, mostly in automotive boards http://www.tccoa.com/brake-fluid/ ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 1 23:04:35 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41D072D02A3 for ; 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Fri, 01 Jun 2012 22:05:03 PDT X-Mailer: YahooMailWebService/0.8.118.349524 References: <4D4FABA15328FC42B1AA0DEE4673548C86F7FD34FC@DR-EX-04.datacenter.dataresolution.net><1338485096.75416.YahooMailNeo@web120202.mail.ne1.yahoo.com><0be001cd3f60$88988680$99c99380$@rr.com> <002801cd4046$6a47a120$3ed6e360$@rr.com> <018F5B721D654E5392612EF17DE74398@ranteer.local> Message-ID: <1338613503.40089.YahooMailNeo@web120201.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2012 22:05:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Frank Fisher To: Dave , "triumphs@autox.team.net" In-Reply-To: <018F5B721D654E5392612EF17DE74398@ranteer.local> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Subject: Re: [TR] brake fluid X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list Reply-To: Frank Fisher List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net dont make me say DOT 1 ________________________________ From: Dave To: triumphs@autox.team.net Sent: Friday, June 1, 2012 8:26 PM Subject: Re: [TR] brake fluid but the question still remains (at least for me) what's the difference between dot 3 and dot 4? -----Original Message----- From: Randall Sent: Friday, June 01, 2012 5:32 PM To: 'Don Hiscock' Cc: triumphs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [TR] brake fluid > If "synthetic" fluids are not based on petroleum, then what are they > based on? Sorry, I mistyped. I meant to say not directly based on petroleum. Petroleum may have been the starting point for some of the chemicals involved, but there were multiple chemical reactions involved in producing the brake fluid, it wasn't simply distilled or cracked from petroleum (the way gasoline, diesel fuel, "conventional" motor oil, etc are). I did a bit of poking around on the net. According to one paper, one formula for conventional brake fluid is approx 53% glycol ether and 35% Boric acid ester; plus smaller amounts of polyglycol, bisphenol A, "antioxidant", and "anticorrosive". "Glycol ether" and "boric acid ester" both cover an entire class of chemicals, the paper did not give specifics. But apparently glycol ethers are commonly made by reacting ethylene oxide with anhydrous alcohol in the presence of a suitable catalyst. Boric acid esters are made by combining boric acid with either an alcohol or a phenol, then using various techniques to extract the desired ester from the result. One text said: "Some of the methods that have been used to separate methyl borate from the azeotrope are extraction with sulfuric acid and distillation of the enriched phase (18), treatment with calcium chloride or lithium chloride (19, 20), washing with a hydrocarbon and distillation (21), ..." (I didn't pay to read the remainder of the paper) Ethylene oxide is produced by oxidizing ethylene gas, which in turn is produced (by cracking) from petroleum (either oil or natural gas). So there is your link back to "dinosaur juice". Does that answer the question? ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/yellowtr3@yahoo.com ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 1 23:14:55 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B38D2D024A for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 23:14:55 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: Triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from bradakis.com (bradakis.com [166.70.156.35]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7CA752D0229 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 23:14:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mark.bradakis.com (166-70-156-36.ip.xmission.com [166.70.156.36]) by bradakis.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C51122E01D for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 23:24:36 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <4FC9A28D.5020801@bradakis.com> Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2012 23:20:13 -0600 From: Mark J Bradakis User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:12.0) Gecko/20120429 Firefox/12.0 SeaMonkey/2.9.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Triumphs References: <4D4FABA15328FC42B1AA0DEE4673548C86F7FD34FC@DR-EX-04.datacenter.dataresolution.net><1338485096.75416.YahooMailNeo@web120202.mail.ne1.yahoo.com><0be001cd3f60$88988680$99c99380$@rr.com> <002801cd4046$6a47a120$3ed6e360$@rr.com> <018F5B721D654E5392612EF17DE74398@ranteer.local> <1338613503.40089.YahooMailNeo@web120201.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <1338613503.40089.YahooMailNeo@web120201.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [TR] brake fluid X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Frank Fisher wrote: > dont make me say DOT 1 > > Now that was funny! mjb. ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 2 00:11:27 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC40D2C0D4D for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 00:11:26 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from fed1rmfepo103.cox.net (fed1rmfepo103.cox.net [68.230.241.145]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C6DB2D0223 for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 00:10:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from fed1rmimpo306.cox.net ([68.230.241.174]) by fed1rmfepo103.cox.net (InterMail vM.8.01.04.00 201-2260-137-20101110) with ESMTP id <20120602061132.RUBP9100.fed1rmfepo103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo306.cox.net>; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 02:11:32 -0400 Received: from Vista ([70.176.164.231]) by fed1rmimpo306.cox.net with bizsmtp id HJ6w1j00J4zsG5S03J6w41; Sat, 02 Jun 2012 02:06:56 -0400 X-CT-Class: Clean X-CT-Score: 0.00 X-CT-RefID: str=0001.0A020206.4FC9AE94.0054,ss=1,re=0.000,fgs=0 X-CT-Spam: 0 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.1 cv=KX+v5h4Bo19/wPa7BIMoXY6ArU991IQkCVNWm470N+4= c=1 sm=1 a=G8Uczd0VNMoA:10 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=nBxdLrbP6lFJcns0bAiXyw==:17 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=kviXuzpPAAAA:8 a=ZPhXfjG4OuZw9gro_S8A:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=J0aUVQLP0FIA:10 a=m3MdUl94G8cA:10 a=4vB-4DCPJfMA:10 a=nBxdLrbP6lFJcns0bAiXyw==:117 X-CM-Score: 0.00 Authentication-Results: cox.net; none From: "Joe Curry" To: "'Dave'" , References: <4D4FABA15328FC42B1AA0DEE4673548C86F7FD34FC@DR-EX-04.datacenter.dataresolution.net><1338485096.75416.YahooMailNeo@web120202.mail.ne1.yahoo.com><0be001cd3f60$88988680$99c99380$@rr.com><002801cd4046$6a47a120$3ed6e360$@rr.com> <018F5B721D654E5392612EF17DE74398@ranteer.local> In-Reply-To: <018F5B721D654E5392612EF17DE74398@ranteer.local> Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2012 23:11:54 -0700 Message-ID: <82349F58618647A3822B59ADB69C7C19@Vista> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: Ac1Ab9Hbujn7IJcbQ5CYLLvu2kuTigAFqv7g Subject: Re: [TR] brake fluid X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net The relevant difference for Triumph owners is that the DOT 5 will not eat paint the way DOT 3 does. Joe -----Original Message----- From: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Dave Sent: Friday, June 01, 2012 8:27 PM To: triumphs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [TR] brake fluid but the question still remains (at least for me) what's the difference between dot 3 and dot 4? -----Original Message----- From: Randall Sent: Friday, June 01, 2012 5:32 PM To: 'Don Hiscock' Cc: triumphs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [TR] brake fluid > If "synthetic" fluids are not based on petroleum, then what are they > based on? Sorry, I mistyped. I meant to say not directly based on petroleum. Petroleum may have been the starting point for some of the chemicals involved, but there were multiple chemical reactions involved in producing the brake fluid, it wasn't simply distilled or cracked from petroleum (the way gasoline, diesel fuel, "conventional" motor oil, etc are). I did a bit of poking around on the net. According to one paper, one formula for conventional brake fluid is approx 53% glycol ether and 35% Boric acid ester; plus smaller amounts of polyglycol, bisphenol A, "antioxidant", and "anticorrosive". "Glycol ether" and "boric acid ester" both cover an entire class of chemicals, the paper did not give specifics. But apparently glycol ethers are commonly made by reacting ethylene oxide with anhydrous alcohol in the presence of a suitable catalyst. Boric acid esters are made by combining boric acid with either an alcohol or a phenol, then using various techniques to extract the desired ester from the result. One text said: "Some of the methods that have been used to separate methyl borate from the azeotrope are extraction with sulfuric acid and distillation of the enriched phase (18), treatment with calcium chloride or lithium chloride (19, 20), washing with a hydrocarbon and distillation (21), ..." (I didn't pay to read the remainder of the paper) Ethylene oxide is produced by oxidizing ethylene gas, which in turn is produced (by cracking) from petroleum (either oil or natural gas). So there is your link back to "dinosaur juice". Does that answer the question? ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/spitlist@cox.net ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 2 06:24:27 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0979D2D0282 for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 06:24:27 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from qmta03.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta03.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.32]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F08C2D0200 for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 06:18:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from omta16.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.88]) by qmta03.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id HPHv1j0061uE5Es53QKWLh; Sat, 02 Jun 2012 12:19:30 +0000 Received: from sz0059.wc.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.58.113]) by omta16.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id HQKW1j0032SagsU3cQKW94; Sat, 02 Jun 2012 12:19:30 +0000 Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2012 12:19:30 +0000 (UTC) From: terryrs@comcast.net To: triumphs@autox.team.net Message-ID: <1229354405.1216685.1338639570161.JavaMail.root@sz0059a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net> In-Reply-To: <9B2824F72CBB41E39983854016CF1956@DaveLaptop> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Originating-IP: [24.63.233.143] X-Mailer: Zimbra 6.0.13_GA_2944 (ZimbraWebClient - [unknown] (Win)/6.0.13_GA_2944) Subject: [TR] Oils and the Sump Drain Plug Magnet X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Am conducting a little experiment. Just finished engine rebuild on my TR3. Tried to start it, discovered I was a tooth off with the ignition, fixed that, and then it started right up. Ran smooth and strong with no leaks for 25 minutes before I shut it down. Made some water pump noise for a few minutes, then that quieted right out. Smokes more than I remember from last time, but I expect that will sort out as the rings set. The experiment is, I added a few wads of magnets to the outside of the sump, near the magnetic drain plug, to see if it doesn't capture more metal shavings common with rebuilds. I don't see why it wouldn't complement the already magnetic plug. But it raised the question. While I know the zinc in the Valvoline Racing Oil I'm running for break-in is not magnetic. ...But...are there other elements in the oil that would be sucked from the chemical composition by a strong magnetic field? Terry Smith, '59 TR3A TS 58667 New Hampshire ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 2 06:27:02 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0EC52C0D39 for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 06:27:02 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from qmta07.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta07.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.64]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF7EB2D022C for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 06:24:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from omta13.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.52]) by qmta07.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id HQNu1j00317dt5G57QQxdH; Sat, 02 Jun 2012 12:24:57 +0000 Received: from sz0059.wc.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.58.113]) by omta13.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id HQQx1j00r2SagsU3ZQQxWx; Sat, 02 Jun 2012 12:24:57 +0000 Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2012 12:24:57 +0000 (UTC) From: terryrs@comcast.net To: triumphs@autox.team.net Message-ID: <374918717.1216826.1338639897498.JavaMail.root@sz0059a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net> In-Reply-To: <9B2824F72CBB41E39983854016CF1956@DaveLaptop> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Originating-IP: [24.63.233.143] X-Mailer: Zimbra 6.0.13_GA_2944 (ZimbraWebClient - [unknown] (Win)/6.0.13_GA_2944) Subject: [TR] Valve Lash Adjustment Method X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net The book I'm using describes adjusting valves when the intake and exhaust are at the point of balance, at which moment you can set both valve lashes to .010. I hadn't noticed that before. I had always set the valves on the exhaust when the intake was completely down, and vice versa. Question: Does it make any difference? Terry Smith, '59 TR3A TS 58667 New Hampshire ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 2 06:56:48 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1C252D0232 for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 06:56:48 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from mta31.charter.net (mta31.charter.net [216.33.127.82]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8BD952D0191 for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 06:56:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imp11 ([10.20.200.11]) by mta31.charter.net (InterMail vM.8.01.05.02 201-2260-151-103-20110920) with ESMTP id <20120602125704.ZBDG24708.mta31.charter.net@imp11>; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 08:57:04 -0400 Received: from Desktop ([71.88.43.114]) by imp11 with smtp.charter.net id HQx11j00B2TnnaX05Qx4PW; Sat, 02 Jun 2012 08:57:04 -0400 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.1 cv=rvNqJbVGdbt4egs52VbhtoJZG7AoPDG9H2iogr/sNfs= c=1 sm=1 a=yCR8ZjDcSg4A:10 a=yUnIBFQkZM0A:10 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=l0rTUnuL56bM4w0sCDsvjQ==:17 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=C_IRinGWAAAA:8 a=hOpmn2quAAAA:8 a=K1y8wh0780Tp2_LpORYA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=J0aUVQLP0FIA:10 a=m3MdUl94G8cA:10 a=si9q_4b84H0A:10 a=hUswqBWy9Q8A:10 a=l0rTUnuL56bM4w0sCDsvjQ==:117 From: "Alex & Janet Thomson" To: , References: <9B2824F72CBB41E39983854016CF1956@DaveLaptop> <374918717.1216826.1338639897498.JavaMail.root@sz0059a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net> In-Reply-To: <374918717.1216826.1338639897498.JavaMail.root@sz0059a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net> Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2012 08:56:58 -0400 Message-ID: <000301cd40bf$332a16e0$997e44a0$@charter.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Thread-Index: AQGx37uejJcuMwRKD7L+kcM9I/fS15cdulKg Content-Language: en-us Subject: Re: [TR] Valve Lash Adjustment Method X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net In the big picture, you always want to adjust a valve when its lifter or tappet is completely "off the cam". It's true that an exhaust valve would be fully closed when the intake is fully open and vice-versa. Your system should be fine. Alternatively, you will never have a problem if you adjust valves for a given cylinder when it is at TDC - Compression. By using distributor rotor position as a guide, you only have to turn the engine over twice to adjust all valves in this manner. Some engine manufacturers, Deere as an example, will tell you all of the valves that can be adjusted when #1 cylinder is at TDC - Compression and will then direct you to turn the crankshaft one revolution and adjust all of the remaining valves. On small air-cooled engines that may be equipped with a compression release device via the exhaust valve, the manufacturers usually direct you to adjust the valves when the piston is approximately 0.5" below and after TDC - Compression. I'm not quite sure what the term "point-of-balance" refers to. Depending on your automotive dialect, I suppose it could refer to what some of us call "valve rock" at TDC - Exhaust or full clearance at TDC - Compression. Alex Thomson -----Original Message----- From: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of terryrs@comcast.net Sent: Saturday, June 02, 2012 8:25 AM To: triumphs@autox.team.net Subject: [TR] Valve Lash Adjustment Method The book I'm using describes adjusting valves when the intake and exhaust are at the point of balance, at which moment you can set both valve lashes to .010. I hadn't noticed that before. I had always set the valves on the exhaust when the intake was completely down, and vice versa. Question: Does it make any difference? Terry Smith, '59 TR3A TS 58667 New Hampshire ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/aljlthomson@charter.net ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 2 07:37:16 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E52E52D0285 for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 07:37:16 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from nm23.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com (nm23.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com [98.139.91.93]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id AF9F42D0207 for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 07:36:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [72.30.22.79] by nm23.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Jun 2012 13:37:46 -0000 Received: from [68.142.194.244] by tm13.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Jun 2012 13:37:46 -0000 Received: from [66.94.237.120] by t2.bullet.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Jun 2012 13:37:45 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1025.access.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Jun 2012 13:37:45 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 794220.106.bm@omp1025.access.mail.mud.yahoo.com Received: (qmail 19833 invoked from network); 2 Jun 2012 13:37:45 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=flash.net; h=DKIM-Signature:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-SMTP:Received:From:To:References:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:In-Reply-To:Thread-Index; b=VpRc3T85NHRp/4rnvdvo4fstL7RR4O9HQeOXRtktQntRKF54iOlzTAYQSWgkS8/VmuxgXDGeMMbyW8djJ62ty/C/Owbycz3qMYN/RlS6LPagwzd9iIxEPgRJJUVnrDW84wCPmWWlRK6DVz7qNUjPD6SGyzvjQiWumDsMnGX0320= ; DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=flash.net; s=s1024; t=1338644265; bh=KXYf0mUmncafvODKoJNUJ7Ez4HLwJkm44TFFUCCB8ks=; h=X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-SMTP:Received:From:To:References:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:In-Reply-To:Thread-Index; b=3Sw+bRdTLrZo1JZIzfzrht3rj2RpeIJx7jOVe+lY6utIawA/0pyQMTYdTtJ+x2iw5iBQL6lHLPlITFRhMYJi15M07NXGSDKWpVJLXV6JlovwOv8NtnfMzV1c9PkiewR7hFoFZF0/7w0fnAKMnb8I5uI5xS4VMeCnA2bl6Ja01Lg= X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-YMail-OSG: qIUC_XkVM1lfelyp8wu8uYmXR_tj2CCQLZQ.nOJepDIJORT yuliHZXHmHmggeTishU3SxyvWzYpXvFeeHqnWrOYGz2ra1uqQsZ1rE6SrKlg xPDMvSvc2wCzXeu4t7U8SeO7WjmfRaNC8vqsGL50seI5HYWSBgsM1J5OwyYV oCbvHqpB0Xt4BlHMqVZGrYh9ukPVlDL8qHzAs9ylRsCi9IHCz.iDDxRkkzwF jQDztC3hXwxLl4DmYewMc5CQxQ5frYDJkJWli5ARGSFVhsmNs_UXqU8xRWEp zG5h6m2ZeFcZ5U5JghYstz0aXL6si0wLkCPo4z5qwavhrRSlgD_f3q7NQxje j91Q89iecACnbA08N0WV9cpbPX9UMCf2xGfAvbvyFh4pghTmkz.jIxjrCDPt Buh_9KKRCnSlC6fHS7IpK4WJ9yBj_DxETe9EfBp2h1eTNDJDZSrD3tGP30kQ k8sj7HuROfekUXtMXwSncsJmshmXzwPBLYkhNjr.Y7s6McGzHwr5uGpjTkAL eXABlheQ- X-Yahoo-SMTP: HTF4o02swBC5GolW.rz6obXo2eBuCkymtyWpl3Q- Received: from bboffice (wbeech@96.26.3.50 with login) by smtp112.sbc.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 02 Jun 2012 06:37:45 -0700 PDT From: To: "'Joe Curry'" , "'Dave'" , References: <4D4FABA15328FC42B1AA0DEE4673548C86F7FD34FC@DR-EX-04.datacenter.dataresolution.net><1338485096.75416.YahooMailNeo@web120202.mail.ne1.yahoo.com><0be001cd3f60$88988680$99c99380$@rr.com><002801cd4046$6a47a120$3ed6e360$@rr.com><018F5B721D654E5392612EF17DE74398@ranteer.local> <82349F58618647A3822B59ADB69C7C19@Vista> Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2012 08:37:30 -0500 Message-ID: <72D5A0FE04904D04A0C0B2D14ABC7B08@bboffice> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-Reply-To: <82349F58618647A3822B59ADB69C7C19@Vista> Thread-Index: Ac1Ab9Hbujn7IJcbQ5CYLLvu2kuTigAFqv7gAA9IW+A= Subject: Re: [TR] brake fluid X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Yep, that's all it took for me to change. My paint guy said he would use DOT-3 for stripper if it weren't so expensive. -----Original Message----- From: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Joe Curry Sent: Saturday, June 02, 2012 1:12 AM To: 'Dave'; triumphs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [TR] brake fluid The relevant difference for Triumph owners is that the DOT 5 will not eat paint the way DOT 3 does. Joe -----Original Message----- From: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Dave Sent: Friday, June 01, 2012 8:27 PM To: triumphs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [TR] brake fluid but the question still remains (at least for me) what's the difference between dot 3 and dot 4? -----Original Message----- From: Randall Sent: Friday, June 01, 2012 5:32 PM To: 'Don Hiscock' Cc: triumphs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [TR] brake fluid > If "synthetic" fluids are not based on petroleum, then what are they > based on? Sorry, I mistyped. I meant to say not directly based on petroleum. Petroleum may have been the starting point for some of the chemicals involved, but there were multiple chemical reactions involved in producing the brake fluid, it wasn't simply distilled or cracked from petroleum (the way gasoline, diesel fuel, "conventional" motor oil, etc are). I did a bit of poking around on the net. According to one paper, one formula for conventional brake fluid is approx 53% glycol ether and 35% Boric acid ester; plus smaller amounts of polyglycol, bisphenol A, "antioxidant", and "anticorrosive". "Glycol ether" and "boric acid ester" both cover an entire class of chemicals, the paper did not give specifics. But apparently glycol ethers are commonly made by reacting ethylene oxide with anhydrous alcohol in the presence of a suitable catalyst. Boric acid esters are made by combining boric acid with either an alcohol or a phenol, then using various techniques to extract the desired ester from the result. One text said: "Some of the methods that have been used to separate methyl borate from the azeotrope are extraction with sulfuric acid and distillation of the enriched phase (18), treatment with calcium chloride or lithium chloride (19, 20), washing with a hydrocarbon and distillation (21), ..." (I didn't pay to read the remainder of the paper) Ethylene oxide is produced by oxidizing ethylene gas, which in turn is produced (by cracking) from petroleum (either oil or natural gas). So there is your link back to "dinosaur juice". Does that answer the question? ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/spitlist@cox.net ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/wbeech@flash.net ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 2 07:49:29 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C35B72D024A for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 07:49:29 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-yw0-f41.google.com (mail-yw0-f41.google.com [209.85.213.41]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B2CA2D0207 for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 07:49:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: by yhr47 with SMTP id 47so2940338yhr.14 for ; Sat, 02 Jun 2012 06:49:59 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=xH+amDuBKJAy+5z19t6aqsq8yOfzpwYfVawCjHde33M=; b=0DANKPVmtnuegxgN+6oM/RWysTRqnvMo5k5kMMR0RU/+8YauNN+cIQjF08gMYd/0PU k9WRmglQlJ7PgFsf3llm8TxgFipbHO5ITLtsCTgP5u0TTcF8Kgntr2H6R4VdUSZm9F0W yxhxB/M5VAECWGqir8VfgxSt7/ZSt+ThDlM1z2L6KpL2RZgcSYjrCqO8AmATWRxZed4f L49qliRgwBvx9JjL0/RNTfr8MziSmHit0zCQJJ9rO/ObFyyZnWILjRyfSuVYn07TLO6v bU6m6EHHL8UXYkMnNGBNYJGAW1+fjicuFngzakKsI69QI5EouN41f/zfeusL++f+iFay 0EBA== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.36.200 with SMTP id s8mr4296006igj.27.1338644999323; Sat, 02 Jun 2012 06:49:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.251.163 with HTTP; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 06:49:59 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <1229354405.1216685.1338639570161.JavaMail.root@sz0059a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net> References: <9B2824F72CBB41E39983854016CF1956@DaveLaptop> <1229354405.1216685.1338639570161.JavaMail.root@sz0059a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net> Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2012 06:49:59 -0700 Message-ID: From: Geo Hahn To: terryrs@comcast.net X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Cc: triumphs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [TR] Oils and the Sump Drain Plug Magnet X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Seems unlikely to me since iron & nickel are the only common elements I know of that are attracted to the magnets. I do modify those magnetic drain plugs commonly sold by breaking and digging out the fairly lame magnet that comes in them and JBWelding a rare-earth magnet in its place. Geo On Sat, Jun 2, 2012 at 5:19 AM, wrote: > ...While I know the zinc in the Valvoline Racing Oil I'm running for > break-in is not magnetic. ...But...are there other elements in the oil > that would be sucked from the chemical composition by a strong magnetic > field? ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 2 08:00:03 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A8BB32D0228 for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 08:00:03 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-gh0-f169.google.com (mail-gh0-f169.google.com [209.85.160.169]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FCE82D0207 for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 07:55:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: by ghrr18 with SMTP id r18so4013722ghr.14 for ; Sat, 02 Jun 2012 06:56:39 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=OH0LamWUQ3cke0WDQ1ysPAJMtDaj25qHrN09oqVYsnE=; b=pnvS6z+Ha7M8qPANCtWQMRX7wGf+J5190mvPDLCxulUOb7ID3Sb29wU9S41v1h+tnP IYmp/OXDQIULmTqMMc+ciDgXzi337UwORZHM0ioB2x8nL726VeOYP3noUBRCgBPz0fXq WAUW7msIxVreCQTOI78ipGZb8M3fHTN7BHhpHDS7kzrnpo6iShPn5t0W9bjEYSegZ8wh c8iB1LoHipd4rl2hX2ucXnzv5S55XSQ6zt5Q4krRlRGb5BBDsmxiKE/7Sn46hz2d17/r 2TEDGWjmbSI0CXNjqtUVs/WIoqBooff4L2CXpdWQfX83j0jEXsbgNClB79/s8a+OrBi2 7E9Q== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.184.198 with SMTP id ew6mr4310721igc.27.1338645398885; Sat, 02 Jun 2012 06:56:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.251.163 with HTTP; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 06:56:38 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <000301cd40bf$332a16e0$997e44a0$@charter.net> References: <9B2824F72CBB41E39983854016CF1956@DaveLaptop> <374918717.1216826.1338639897498.JavaMail.root@sz0059a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net> <000301cd40bf$332a16e0$997e44a0$@charter.net> Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2012 06:56:38 -0700 Message-ID: From: Geo Hahn To: terryrs@comcast.net X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Cc: triumphs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [TR] Valve Lash Adjustment Method X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net I just use the chart in the Haynes manual (ignoring the typo) which is essentially the 'rule of 9' (i.e.looking at the 8 valves you note which ones are depressed and adjust the ones that are 9 minus their position). Other will have different ideas, but I always set the exhaust valves at .012 as too loose is a bit noisy but too tight is expensive. Geo ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 2 08:00:38 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F81F2D0215 for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 08:00:38 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from snt0-omc1-s8.snt0.hotmail.com (snt0-omc1-s8.snt0.hotmail.com [65.55.90.19]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D8142D0207 for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 07:56:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from SNT123-W51 ([65.55.90.8]) by snt0-omc1-s8.snt0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Sat, 2 Jun 2012 06:56:53 -0700 Message-ID: X-Originating-IP: [98.212.159.186] From: Rich White To: TR owners List Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2012 08:56:51 -0500 In-Reply-To: <971AB9DEF773456EB452E214A30CD080@DaveLaptop> References: <971AB9DEF773456EB452E214A30CD080@DaveLaptop> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Jun 2012 13:56:53.0318 (UTC) FILETIME=[90A78660:01CD40C7] X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Subject: Re: [TR] Brake Fluid X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net What is this fluid stuff of which you speak?Is that the same as fluif? :) Rich White Central, IL USA '63 TR3B TCF###L That ain't a scrap pile, that is my car! ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 2 09:42:11 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19E6F2D0207 for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 09:42:11 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from spamtest4.bright.net (spamtest4.bright.net [209.143.0.182]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B7B0B2D019E for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 09:41:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rg7.cniteam.com (rg7.cniteam.com [209.143.0.247]) by spamtest4.bright.net (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id q52FgSx9020180; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 11:42:28 -0400 Received: from [127.0.0.1] ([216.201.14.237]) by rg7.cniteam.com (MOS 4.2.4-GA) with ESMTP id BIU13018; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 11:42:26 -0400 Message-ID: <4FCA3468.8050104@bright.net> Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2012 11:42:32 -0400 From: Ted Schumacher User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:11.0) Gecko/20120327 Thunderbird/11.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: TR8 CCCA Listing , TR list X-Spam-Score: -5.00 () [Hold at 4.00] 24(-5) X-CanIt-Geo: No geolocation information available for 209.143.0.247 X-CanItPRO-Stream: all (inherits from default) X-Scanned-By: CanIt (www . roaringpenguin . com) on 209.143.0.182 Subject: [TR] TR8 uprated front sway bar X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Hello list members. We are just finishing another production run of our TR8 uprated front (anti-roll) sway bars. The bar is 7/8" diameter compared to 13/16" found on a stock TR8 or 3/4" for a stock TR7. For sway bar rate information and other useful suspension data please go to our website www.tsimportedautomotive.com and select "Product Info" (5th gear) As usual, the list is offered a "price" or incentives not found on our website. Sway bar price is $141.95. Choose from any of the 3 options listed below. Price is good till June 23rd. Thanks for your time and support. Ted #1. Free shipping for bar anywhere in lower 48 states. Canadian customers - if you have a US pick up address this works for you. #2. Urethane sway bar mount set - $29 is regular price for the mounts. #3. Free needle bearing front strut kit - $35 is regular price for the kit. -- Ted Schumacher tedtsimx@bright.net http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com 108 S. Jefferson St. Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) Phone: 800.543.6648 (US& Canada) Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 2 11:31:51 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 327422D01C6 for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 11:31:51 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from vms173013pub.verizon.net (vms173013pub.verizon.net [206.46.173.13]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 984682C0D48 for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 11:31:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from vznit170128pub.verizon.net ([unknown] [192.168.1.3]) by vms173013.mailsrvcs.net (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7u2-7.02 32bit (built Apr 16 2009)) with ESMTPA id <0M5000MD93D00JYP@vms173013.mailsrvcs.net> for triumphs@autox.team.net; Sat, 02 Jun 2012 12:31:48 -0500 (CDT) Received: from 96.255.241.164 ([96.255.241.164]) by vznit170128 (Verizon Webmail) with HTTP; Sat, 02 Jun 2012 12:31:48 -0500 (CDT) Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2012 12:31:48 -0500 (CDT) From: thenicholls@verizon.net To: triumphs@autox.team.net Message-id: <2506085.376596.1338658308806.JavaMail.root@vznit170128> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Verizon Webmail X-Originating-IP: [96.255.241.164] Subject: Re: [TR] Valve Lash Adjustment Method X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net I just got done doing this last weekend, I took a short ride today and came home to adjust idle, I feel like it is tapping more than it was before the adjustment. A member of my car club helped me, we set to .010. It is fine when driving, no issues there. If you hear the valves at idle, does this generally mean they are too loose or too tight? I would rather be towards the loose end based on this thread. Thanks in advance. Craig 1972 Triumph TR6 On 06/02/12, Geo Hahn wrote: I just use the chart in the Haynes manual (ignoring the typo) which is essentially the 'rule of 9' (i.e.looking at the 8 valves you note which ones are depressed and adjust the ones that are 9 minus their position). Other will have different ideas, but I always set the exhaust valves at .012 as too loose is a bit noisy but too tight is expensive. Geo ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/thenicholls@verizon.net ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 2 12:15:00 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 28A922D024A for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 12:15:00 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from mta21.charter.net (mta21.charter.net [216.33.127.81]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A6B8F2D0211 for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 12:07:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imp10 ([10.20.200.15]) by mta21.charter.net (InterMail vM.8.01.05.02 201-2260-151-103-20110920) with ESMTP id <20120602180843.BXGW12025.mta21.charter.net@imp10> for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 14:08:43 -0400 Received: from [127.0.0.1] ([96.32.139.40]) by imp10 with smtp.charter.net id HW8i1j00e0sV6Ds05W8iDA; Sat, 02 Jun 2012 14:08:43 -0400 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.1 cv=JYQIUidRAECiNa+jsiaNMIhYElg3H2WoMKCJIGO75f4= c=1 sm=1 a=1F-HOIdIGasA:10 a=yUnIBFQkZM0A:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=sB3BXsIfANGg2wjxVdtBBQ==:17 a=XagMjcpuSdeZoW1itj0A:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=sB3BXsIfANGg2wjxVdtBBQ==:117 Message-ID: <4FCA56AC.9010703@charter.net> Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2012 14:08:44 -0400 From: Jeff User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:12.0) Gecko/20120428 Thunderbird/12.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: triumphs@autox.team.net References: <4D4FABA15328FC42B1AA0DEE4673548C86F7FD34FC@DR-EX-04.datacenter.dataresolution.net><1338485096.75416.YahooMailNeo@web120202.mail.ne1.yahoo.com><0be001cd3f60$88988680$99c99380$@rr.com><002801cd4046$6a47a120$3ed6e360$@rr.com> <018F5B721D654E5392612EF17DE74398@ranteer.local> <82349F58618647A3822B59ADB69C7C19@Vista> In-Reply-To: <82349F58618647A3822B59ADB69C7C19@Vista> X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 120602-0, 06/02/2012), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Subject: Re: [TR] brake fluid X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net On 6/2/2012 2:11 AM, Joe Curry wrote: > The relevant difference for Triumph owners is that the DOT 5 will not eat > paint the way DOT 3 does. But it will pool water, contain air, and give a slightly softer pedal. That's why there are choices. I prefer the hard pedal and maximum stopping power, at the expense of periodic brake system maintenance. Jeff Scarbrough Corrosion Acres, Ga. ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net From triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 2 12:20:20 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mharc@autox.team.net Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 720F72D0208 for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 12:20:20 -0600 (MDT) X-Original-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Delivered-To: triumphs@autox.team.net Received: from mail-gg0-f169.google.com (mail-gg0-f169.google.com [209.85.161.169]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A33D2D01AC for ; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 12:20:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: by ggm4 with SMTP id 4so3172568ggm.14 for ; Sat, 02 Jun 2012 11:20:53 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=oIyETaXqpY2boxZ2GcnzELTNnl/SuUQE0Jho7df1/EI=; b=V91GYoZNbjWpkSB1IiOVK2piEpzT3/B88dA6t0oOUkOFPhueMkhUvWR+EKn1FymbNv Kb4g3B3E7ygau4Jfml7fEXEwmsOqD6nnPAT0hzw5EY3Ac2+URRClDq/fFDKHInl6i1YI HH/Bgcy6mtk7MkdD3qyVquE7+Rtw7KgME8xJDtGlQ2pcqwW1sWs33SX7ldJLsVqN0WIQ WiAPWFQeS2BKXskSUcDcMPa7N2Qz3v0NsHM86+OC8WPtUriNRHupzOJ1XgvA9ler27p6 hhBXPQUthU17f4EjdDmOBKILq4T9Iasu38WrEZ7bjM00GP1AkEsh14gm2/PpR2BVZECV fb/w== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.184.198 with SMTP id ew6mr4699409igc.27.1338661253375; Sat, 02 Jun 2012 11:20:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.251.163 with HTTP; Sat, 2 Jun 2012 11:20:53 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2012 11:20:53 -0700 Message-ID: From: Geo Hahn To: Dave Connitt X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Cc: triumphs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [TR] Brake Fluid? X-BeenThere: triumphs@autox.team.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Triumph Sports car discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net Sender: triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net On Wed, May 30, 2012 at 6:53 PM, Dave Connitt wrote: > Hi List, > I don't really want to start another thread on brake fluid... > I guess we all saw this coming but got on board anyway. Geo ** triumphs@autox.team.net ** Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mharc@autox.team.net